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Old 04-11-2007, 07:53 PM   #241
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When did this happen. LOL
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Old 04-11-2007, 07:54 PM   #242
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Imus is now being dropped from MSNBC. Anyone else think this is a little much? Imus is really a great guy and has a philathropic track record. He's poured money into charities and giving orphan children a chance. Imus made a joke -- it was a bad one -- it was inappropriate -- it was not funny. Lets move on for God's sake. Black people call eachother hos and niggers constantly. Imus did it as a joke -- apologized repeatedly, and he gets sacked. That is called hypocricy. I'm a white liberal and I consider myself to be FAR from racist, but the way the african american community has responded to this is over zealous and absurd.
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Old 04-11-2007, 07:56 PM   #243
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Actually if you look at the other thread and this one they coinside. Why????

The other one is asking/demanding their sons name be removed from the memorial, but you say no because it's freedom of speech. Don Imus says some comments and people, and corporations demand he be removed thus taking his job/freedom to speak and then being feathered and tarred for his comments.
This is an entirely different situation, Justin, and I'm surprised you can't see that.

In your thread, basically you were for forcing those people to remove the names from the memorial. Now, I would assume that the only means to force them would be for the police or some governmental body ordering them to do so, which would in direct contradiction with the constitution - as the government can not restrict one's right to freedom of speech/expression.

With Imus, the situation is entirely different. The corporations are not the government, and if they see Imus as a liability they have every right to not sponsor him, put him on leave or even fire him. Corporations are not democracies. The places most people work are not democracies, otherwise we'd all vote for who our boss would be (among other things). If you are a liability to a company's bottom line, you can bet that the company is going to deal with you, whether it's a big company and a bigshot like Imus who just scared off your sponsors and a large chunk of your revenue, or a small company and a part time employee who is lazy and unproductive.

The key is, Imus still has the option to say the exact same things. If he is fired, he can still go to the corner and say the exact same things and the government can do nothing about it. The people who you forced to alter their memorial, however, no longer have the option of exercising that right.
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Old 04-11-2007, 07:57 PM   #244
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Even though it's not his show, would you want a bigot to remain on the show, that could possibly lower raitings?
I couldn't care less whether either Imus or Washington get fired, though if it were up to me I wouldn't fire either based on one comment. However, it isn't up to me. Again I don't understand where this hypocrisy charge against people in here is coming from.

There was most definitely public condemnation of Isaiah Washington, so I'm not sure why you're saying there wasn't. I do agree as far as it goes that it's easier to get away with slurs against gay people, sadly.
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Old 04-11-2007, 08:36 PM   #245
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Originally posted by cjboog
Imus is now being dropped from MSNBC. Anyone else think this is a little much? Imus is really a great guy and has a philathropic track record. He's poured money into charities and giving orphan children a chance. Imus made a joke -- it was a bad one -- it was inappropriate -- it was not funny. Lets move on for God's sake. Black people call eachother hos and niggers constantly. Imus did it as a joke -- apologized repeatedly, and he gets sacked. That is called hypocricy. I'm a white liberal and I consider myself to be FAR from racist, but the way the african american community has responded to this is over zealous and absurd.
Thank you! I agree wholeheartedly.
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Old 04-11-2007, 08:56 PM   #246
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Originally posted by cjboog
Imus is now being dropped from MSNBC. Anyone else think this is a little much?
It was a corporation's business decision. 5 or 10 sponsors had pulled out anyway.
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Old 04-11-2007, 09:17 PM   #247
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It may be time for Imus to follow Howard Stern to sat radio.

I am a bit concerned. I think of all the things that Stern has said and done on his show, yet never outcry like this. Why not? One of my friends who has Sat Radio said that Stern is now boring because there are no boundaries. Maybe the two are not related. I stopped listening to Stern when my daughter was born. My perceptions changed.

Today I am thinking about how I would feel if it were my daughter were on that team. I am really pissed he did this.

I am just not certain losing his job is the answer. But I am not sure the man can change.
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:35 PM   #248
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Originally posted by cjboog
[. Black people call eachother hos and niggers constantly. Imus did it as a joke -- apologized repeatedly, and he gets sacked. That is called hypocricy. I'm a white liberal and I consider myself to be FAR from racist, but the way the african american community has responded to this is over zealous and absurd. [/B]

You may not view yourself as a racist -- but you might want to be a wee tad careful about the racial stereotypes that you're flinging around. The "African-American community" includes a lot of people with a lot of viewpoints. If you're referring to Sharpton, for example, why would you assume that he somehow represents the viewpoints of ALL African-Americans? Similarly, I would love to see how you back up your assertion that "Black people call each other hos and niggers constantly". Again, don't confuse a diverse community of people with characters in Rap videos marketed to White audiences.
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:38 PM   #249
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Waisting time because you only want things in your favor and don't like to look at all angles?
Oh goodness...
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Old 04-11-2007, 10:51 PM   #250
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Originally posted by cjboog
Black people call eachother hos and niggers constantly. Imus did it as a joke -- apologized repeatedly, and he gets sacked. That is called hypocricy.
That is an awful comparison. Yes, black people do call each other those terms (mostly rappers), but if you've noticed, the same people who are condemning Imus, have condemned rappers for the use of the same terms. Calling people hos is not a joke...
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Old 04-11-2007, 11:06 PM   #251
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When did this happen. LOL
I think we have talked Imus to death,
perhaps it is just a free speech thing.

by the way
I was looking at some of your photos you posted
are you related to that "big assed hooker"?
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Old 04-11-2007, 11:12 PM   #252
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I'm a white liberal
No shit.

Quote:
Originally posted by cjboog
and I consider myself to be FAR from racist,
I'm glad at least you do.
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Old 04-11-2007, 11:32 PM   #253
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Originally posted by cjboog
Lets move on for God's sake. Black people call eachother hos and niggers constantly. Imus did it as a joke -- apologized repeatedly, and he gets sacked. That is called hypocricy. I'm a white liberal and I consider myself to be FAR from racist, but the way the african american community has responded to this is over zealous and absurd.
None of the black people I know call each other "hos" or "niggers". As far as those who will, the word simply isn't as degrading coming from a fellow member of the group, who's just as likely him/herself to receive the insult "for real" in its more familiar social context, where history supplies a different perceived attitude on the speaker's part--one it isn't really possible for someone within the group to hold. Language doesn't operate in a vacuum and while anyone can co-opt a word, they can't necessarily co-opt the context it was used in originally, whether they wish to or not.

I think perhaps the excessive media hype surrounding Imus' (and Rosenberg's, and McGuirk's) comments may have less to do with any one social group's public reaction to them than to a kind of schizoid attitude the public in general tends to hold towards 'shock jock' media personalities, especially ones who are taken seriously to the degree Imus is (which may in part explain why Limbaugh tends not to attract much condemnation, despite the fact that unlike Imus, he not only uses slurs, but on top of that takes positions which many find racist even without the language). On the one hand, certain words are taboo to a degree which can cause pronouncing them to seem a much worse 'crime' than it actually is; on the other hand, there's a kind of speakin'-truth-to-power! mystique we often honor speech that's 'provocative' in only the most cheap and unworthy sense of that term with. It's an uncomfortably gray area (and one which many comedians, some of them quite skillfully, often exploit) and when you get lightning-rod incidents like this which exert pressure to take a stand on one side or the other, the obsessiveness of the scrutiny and vested-interest back-and-forth can shoot to pathetic levels pretty quickly.

I've been thinking about Irvine's point about the press conference amounting to an infantilization of women, and I really can't agree with it. As I said earlier, I feel they should've spoken up sooner if they were going to, but I think the main intent was to wrestle something positive out of the situation by underlining that they are athletes as well as otherwise-accomplished women. It really isn't comparable to calling a team of (primarily) black male athletes "pimps" (or for that matter John Edwards a "faggot"), as there isn't any underlying tradition that men have no business expecting to be taken seriously on a basketball court to be drawn upon in giving those comments their force. What stood out to me about the comments was more the implied ridiculousness of what that game amounted to, as if it were just some 'catfight', with the fact that most of said female players were black then in turn being drawn upon to further ridicule them--look at these gross 'nappy-headed hos' playing ball, haha those Tennessee chicks are kinda cute though, they must be the 'wannabes'.

Still, I think Imus' apology plus the temporary suspension should've been sufficient, so long as his style of humor (which, as Gellman pointed out, has an unfortunate way of conflating mere cruelty with strategic satire) continues to be otherwise tolerated by corporations and media executives. I agree Sharpton's and Jackson's habit of appointing themselves The Arbiters on behalf of all African-Americans can get tiresome, and to the extent that they were instrumental in bringing MSNBC's 'firing' about (which I suspect may be being exaggerated), that may be unfortunate. But personally, as far as it goes, I cannot find it regrettable if the message sent to other 'shock jocks' by this is that all those laughs they take to the bank with them come at a risk and a price.
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Old 04-11-2007, 11:42 PM   #254
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i don't think it was the press conference, per se, that was infantalizing, it was the whole, "but i'm not a ho" as well as comments in here that assumed these women were all personally devastated by the remarks, that their accomplishments had been tainted forever, that their season was all for nothing, and all because of this one mean man.

my, what power we've given to this man, he destroyes basketball teams.

i could also delve into the John Edwards "faggot" comment -- and note that it was precisely designed to emasculate him and his pretty hair and well-moisturized exfoliated skin, to feminize him, hasn't Coulter already said that he could be "our first female president" -- and i think, implicit in that, is the assumption that good looking, articulate men are, on some level, effeminate/gay, and are thusly incapable of marching into a middle eastern country and toppling the government. what's going on is pretty much the same blueprint, only one is politics where the feminine has no place, and the other is sports where the feminine also has no (legitimate) place.

but i also agree with deep that we've all talked this to death. myself 100% included.
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Old 04-11-2007, 11:49 PM   #255
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Originally posted by yolland

I think perhaps the excessive media hype surrounding Imus' (and Rosenberg's, and McGuirk's) comments may have less to do with any one social group's public reaction to them than to a kind of schizoid attitude the public in general tends to hold towards 'shock jock' media personalities, especially ones who are taken seriously to the degree Imus is (which may in part explain why Limbaugh tends not to attract much condemnation, despite the fact that unlike Imus, he not only uses slurs, but on top of that takes positions which many find racist even without the language).
I think the fact that Imus is simulcast on cable TV also has something to do with why he is judged more harshly than Limbaugh. TV seems to have a lower threshold for what is considered offensive, and Imus will keep his radio show. In fact Limbaugh used the term "hos" in describing the Duke case accusers, but it was not widely publicized.
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