IMPENDING THEOCRACY WATCH: more insanity from the mouth of Tom DeLay - Page 2 - U2 Feedback

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Old 04-15-2005, 05:29 AM   #16
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PING Delay: 'Activist judges' did not "impose" separation of church and state! THE CONSTITUTION DOES! If you don't like that, you don't like America.

Another piece of this that often gets lost is that this principle is *good for the Church* too! It protects the Church from arbitrary control or having legislative agendas imposed on it. Also, for those of us here who are Christians, let's never ever forget that the Church was at its most corrupt when it was at its most politically powerful.
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Old 04-15-2005, 05:57 AM   #17
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I am really tired of hearing this old about liberals and belief in God. I'm a liberal and a practicing Catholic. I've just put a garnet cross I have that was blessed by Pope John Paul II in my safety deposit box.
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Old 04-15-2005, 08:18 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sherry Darling
PING Delay: 'Activist judges' did not "impose" separation of church and state! THE CONSTITUTION DOES! If you don't like that, you don't like America.

Another piece of this that often gets lost is that this principle is *good for the Church* too! It protects the Church from arbitrary control or having legislative agendas imposed on it. Also, for those of us here who are Christians, let's never ever forget that the Church was at its most corrupt when it was at its most politically powerful.
The Constitution prohibits the establishment of a state-run church and guarantees the free practice of religion by the public.


The measuring stick of "separation" was invented by the courts.

As a standard, it is overbroad when compared to the Constitutional requirements.
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Old 04-15-2005, 08:52 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
The Constitution prohibits the establishment of a state-run church and guarantees the free practice of religion by the public.

The measuring stick of "separation" was invented by the courts.

As a standard, it is overbroad when compared to the Constitutional requirements.
When primarily Muslim regions start requiring Muslim prayers in public schools, even when non-Muslims are in the school (this could conceivably happen in parts of Michigan here), then Christians will start crying "separation of church and state."

As it stands, "Christians" use this term to serve themselves, because in most regions of the country, they are the "majority," and they callously don't give a flying fuck about "diversity" or "respect" for the minority. But when they are the "minority," all of a sudden, it's "separation of church and state."

The Christian Coalition pulled this stunt a few years ago, when a college required incoming freshmen to read the Koran. Fucking hypocrites.

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Old 04-15-2005, 09:30 AM   #20
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When primarily Muslim regions start requiring Muslim prayers in public schools, even when non-Muslims are in the school (this could conceivably happen in parts of Michigan here), then Christians will start crying "separation of church and state."
No, they should cry "Establishment" as noted by the term "requiring".

We can analyze this without the labels.
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Old 04-15-2005, 09:33 AM   #21
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No, they should cry "Establishment" as noted by the term "requiring".
But I would argue that the Christian Coalition would jump for joy if schools started requiring students to read the Bible. Do you think they'd suddenly cry "establishment" for the sake of the minority?

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Old 04-15-2005, 09:50 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


The Constitution prohibits the establishment of a state-run church and guarantees the free practice of religion by the public.


The measuring stick of "separation" was invented by the courts.

As a standard, it is overbroad when compared to the Constitutional requirements.

last time i checked, only christians went to a church. jews go to temple. muslims to a mosque.

"separation of church and state" is a phrase specifically tailored to Christianity because it is the majority religion, and that phrase is intended to prevent the estabilshment of Christianity, with no real competitors, as the state religion.
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Old 04-15-2005, 10:02 AM   #23
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But I would argue that the Christian Coalition would jump for joy if schools started requiring students to read the Bible.
The usual publicity seeking figure heads would jump. The rest of us would know that such a proposal would never see the light of a classroom.


Quote:
Originally posted by melon
Do you think they'd suddenly cry "establishment" for the sake of the minority?
Yes. As you've noted before, just because it has a "Christian" label doesn't mean all Christians would be happy with the end product.
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