Im just watching the translated tape of Bin Laden and Al Qaeda supporters celebrating - U2 Feedback

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Old 12-13-2001, 11:47 AM   #1
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Im just watching the translated tape of Bin Laden and Al Qaeda supporters celebrating

...please dont take anything I say too seriously if it is offensive, I just need to free my mind, so I'm here.

It's so tragic, seeing this mix of totally impoverished people and some evil people at the head giving them hope through teaching them to hate. Those Afghan people, I can't believe what they have to live through, they have nothing, and I think Bin Laden has given them something to live for.
How can one man be so evil? He hasn't been impoverished in the same way these people have...he grew up with money. Seeing the poor celebrate after September 11th doesnt make me angry, it makes me sad. But seeing the Al Qaeda head members celebrate just gives me the chills.

In some fundamental ways, this reminds me of what Hitler did to Germany after it was destroyed in WWI....
I don't know. i dont know what to do or what to say really? isnt there anyway to give those people something else to live for? anything?
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Old 12-13-2001, 11:52 AM   #2
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I watched part of it, but I had to turn it off...I can't stand it...I can't stand looking at that pathetic excuse for a human being any longer...I don't want to ever see his face again...

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Old 12-13-2001, 12:02 PM   #3
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i had to turn it off too. it was making me sick.
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Old 12-13-2001, 12:23 PM   #4
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sorry wrong thread!

[This message has been edited by babble (edited 12-13-2001).]
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Old 12-13-2001, 12:29 PM   #5
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Here's an article about it.

Anyone still have 'doubts' as to his involvement?

WASHINGTON (AP) - Osama bin Laden (news - web sites) contentedly recalled the Sept. 11 suicide attacks against America on a videotape released Thursday by the Pentagon (news - web sites), saying the destruction exceeded his estimates and the event ``benefitted Islam greatly.''

The hijackings were ``a martyrdom operation,'' Bin Laden said in a conversation with two aides and a Saudi sheik, but those who carried them out didn't know the precise details until just before they boarded the planes.

The tape, amateurish in quality but chilling nonetheless, was released as part of an administration effort to support claims that bin Laden was the mastermind behind the attacks that killed thousands in New York, Washington and Pennsylvania. The translation of the Arabic conversation was provided by the administration.

In it, bin Laden discussed some of the planning that led to the attacks, and recalled tuning in to the radio to hear American news broadcasts of the attack.

``They were overjoyed when the first plane hit the building,'' he said of others listening with him that day. ``So I said to them: Be patient.''

He said, ``At the end of the newscast, they reported that a plane just hit the World Trade Center.''

``Allah be praised,'' replied one of the other men in the videotape.

``After a little while, they announced that another plane had hit the World Trade Center,'' bin Laden recalled. ``The brothers who heard the news were overjoyed by it.''

Administration officials have said the tape was found in a house in Jalalabad after anti-Taliban forces moved in.

On the tape, bin Laden is sitting on the floor of a spare room, talking with several other men, including two aides and an unidentified Saudi sheik.

Entering the room, bin Laden bends over to greet the sheik, then smilingly takes his place next to him, sitting cross-legged on the floor.

The sheik promptly thanks bin Laden, saying, ``You have given us weapons, you have given us hope and we thank Allah for you.''

``Everybody praises what you did, the great action you did, which was first and foremost by the grace of Allah,'' the sheik continued. ``This is the guidance of Allah and the blessed fruit of Jihad.''

``Thanks to Allah,'' replied bin Laden.

The sheik informed bin Laden that another cleric had delivered a sermon in Saudi Arabia Sept. 11. ``He said this was jihad and those people were not innocent victims,'' the sheik said, apparently referring to the victims of the World Trade Center and Pentagon attacks.

References to jihad, or holy war, and Allah run throughout the videotape, and at one point bin Laden recites a portion of verse: ``I was ordered to fight the people until they say there is no god but Allah, and his prophet Muhammad.''

Moments later, he says, ``This event made people think (about true Islam) which benefitted Islam greatly,'' he said.

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Old 12-13-2001, 01:09 PM   #6
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here's the transcript from msnbc.com.

it was too long to post.
http://www.msnbc.com/news/672063.asp

[This message has been edited by Screaming Flower (edited 12-13-2001).]
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Old 12-13-2001, 01:53 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by BabyGrace:
It's so tragic, seeing this mix of totally impoverished people and some evil people at the head giving them hope through teaching them to hate. Those Afghan people, I can't believe what they have to live through, they have nothing, and I think Bin Laden has given them something to live for.
How can one man be so evil? He hasn't been impoverished in the same way these people have...he grew up with money. Seeing the poor celebrate after September 11th doesnt make me angry, it makes me sad. But seeing the Al Qaeda head members celebrate just gives me the chills.

In some fundamental ways, this reminds me of what Hitler did to Germany after it was destroyed in WWI....
I don't know. i dont know what to do or what to say really? isnt there anyway to give those people something else to live for? anything?
Let's rephrase, surplanting Bush for Bin Laden, and so forth. Maybe that will make you realize why they acted the way they did..

"It's so tragic, seeing this mix of totally impoverished people and some evil people at the head giving them hope through teaching them to hate. Those American people, I can't believe what they have to live through, they have nothing, and I think the Bush administration has given them something to live for.
How can Bush be so evil? He hasn't been impoverished in the same way these people have...he grew up with money. Seeing the Americans celebrate after the Afganistan attacks doesnt make me angry, it makes me sad. But seeing the Bush administration celebrate just gives me the chills.

In some fundamental ways, this reminds me of what Hitler did to Germany after it was destroyed in WWI....(Abolishing civil liberties, because the government told its citizens that Jews were to blaim for all wrongs. Just like the US is blaming the Terrorists for all OUR wrongs)
I don't know. i dont know what to do or what to say really? isnt there anyway to give those people something else to live for? anything?"

The reason I did this was to show how both sides are wrong. It's looks as if Bin Laden had a role in this attack, and therefore, I will agree that he needs to die. But his message is far stronger than his life. I'm sure he's willing to die, before the US gets their hands on him...just like Hitler.

We need to figure out how to stop these attacks in the future, and something tells me that building a stronger MACHO defense is only part of the equation. Let's try feeding and clothing and sheltering those impovished people, before we starting erradicating them from the earth...

peace
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Old 12-13-2001, 05:27 PM   #8
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Danospano -

I'm not sure that you realize that the United States gave $134 million in foreign aid to Afghanistan last year.

And to criticize the US for blaming the terrorists seems unbelievably ignorant. What don't you question the morality of their acts?
There have been many figures in history who have achieved significant change without resorting to violent means - Ghandi, Mandela, King. Terrorism, on the other hand, has never achieved its dubious goals.
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Old 12-13-2001, 07:01 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by devalera1:
Danospano -

I'm not sure that you realize that the United States gave $134 million in foreign aid to Afghanistan last year.

And to criticize the US for blaming the terrorists seems unbelievably ignorant. What don't you question the morality of their acts?
There have been many figures in history who have achieved significant change without resorting to violent means - Ghandi, Mandela, King. Terrorism, on the other hand, has never achieved its dubious goals.
Well said.. Bin Laden doesn't have a message.. He just hates America and wants to kill as many of them as he can.. Using Islam as his excuse... Also.. I have heard onteh news that some muslims are accusing America of tampering with the tape, and forging it.. Even that sort of 'quasi-ignorance-blindness' makes me sick.. as i again, turn off the news as teh tape is being played...
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Old 12-13-2001, 07:52 PM   #10
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BabyG you are on the money. There's that thread in Everything You Know... about a Bono quote, part of it is about exactly what you are talking about. Take a country with nothing but problems, people with nothing but pain and poverty, show them a country like the US or most of Europe, or Australia etc any wealthy western country, give them a charismatic, powerful leader, get him to point the blame for their state of living at us, suddenly they have a hope and a goal. If someone has nothing, they'll go for anything.

As long as there are countries like Afghanistan, people like bin Laden will be able to pop up and get support. Bono and a host of other people in the media who support his view are right. Do more for poverty and you'll get less of this.
My cousin is married to a guy who is a negotiator for the Red Cross, he goes into hot spots and negotiates with both sides to let the Red Cross in and guarantee their safety (he has a law background + speaks something like 8 languages fluently. He's a freak) He's been everywhere, Sarejevo, Rwanda, Mid East and is currently in Afghanistan, and had to negotiate with the Taliban. So although each individual case has different causes, different 'details', he see's this as a common problem running through pretty much all of them.
He stands firmly behind the belief that, until the top 10% of the world takes a look around, the bottom 90% will keep looking at us with anger. Oh, and his lovely chiling prediction is 'wait till someone like that pops up in Africa'.
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Old 12-13-2001, 07:56 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by TylerDurden:
BabyG you are on the money. There's that thread in Everything You Know... about a Bono quote, part of it is about exactly what you are talking about.
This thread, right? http://forum.interference.com/u2feed...ML/016469.html

Had some relevant and good points raised in it, I think.

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Old 12-13-2001, 08:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by devalera1:
I'm not sure that you realize that the United States gave $134 million in foreign aid to Afghanistan last year.
This is often overlooked; in fact, I think some people wish it could be suppressed.

A good point from beautiful old Alexandria, Virginia.

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Old 12-13-2001, 10:36 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bonochick:
I watched part of it, but I had to turn it off...I can't stand it...I can't stand looking at that pathetic excuse for a human being any longer...I don't want to ever see his face again...
It won't be long now.

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Old 12-14-2001, 07:00 PM   #14
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I can't take Osama anymore.

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Old 12-14-2001, 08:45 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano:
Let's rephrase, surplanting Bush for Bin Laden, and so forth. Maybe that will make you realize why they acted the way they did..

"It's so tragic, seeing this mix of totally impoverished people and some evil people at the head giving them hope through teaching them to hate. Those American people, I can't believe what they have to live through, they have nothing, and I think the Bush administration has given them something to live for.
How can Bush be so evil? He hasn't been impoverished in the same way these people have...he grew up with money. Seeing the Americans celebrate after the Afganistan attacks doesnt make me angry, it makes me sad. But seeing the Bush administration celebrate just gives me the chills.

In some fundamental ways, this reminds me of what Hitler did to Germany after it was destroyed in WWI....(Abolishing civil liberties, because the government told its citizens that Jews were to blaim for all wrongs. Just like the US is blaming the Terrorists for all OUR wrongs)
I don't know. i dont know what to do or what to say really? isnt there anyway to give those people something else to live for? anything?"

The reason I did this was to show how both sides are wrong. It's looks as if Bin Laden had a role in this attack, and therefore, I will agree that he needs to die. But his message is far stronger than his life. I'm sure he's willing to die, before the US gets their hands on him...just like Hitler.

We need to figure out how to stop these attacks in the future, and something tells me that building a stronger MACHO defense is only part of the equation. Let's try feeding and clothing and sheltering those impovished people, before we starting erradicating them from the earth...

peace
Great poing Donaspano- I couldnt even tell the difference!!!! now I am going to get flamed for this, but it is my view, I will first state that no killing is right, it is all unjustified and wrong, but if one was to look at the amount of people killed throughout history as a result of American intervention I am sure that you would find a number that greatly exceeds 4000, remember Nicaragua, Korea, Vietnam, Egypt and various other proxy wars fulled by the imperialist propaganda of the Cold War thorughout sth est Asia, Africa and the Middle East..........I personally believe that before anything is going to get better in the Middle East then the Israeli/Palestinian conflict needs to be addressed and a solution devised, I dont know what that solution is, but something must happen....anyway there is no doubt about it that OBL is a wanker, but then again so is Bush in my opinion, to me there is not much difference in their fundamentalism, the main difference being that usually when America goes an attacks they are very good at getting away with it, or so they would have us believe

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