I have just lost a ton of respect for Rush.... - Page 3 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 03-17-2002, 08:57 AM   #31
Refugee
 
Achtung Bubba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: One Nation. Under God.
Posts: 1,513
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Angell:

Moore is an extremist liberal of the first order. He is famous for one reason only: creating the cult favorite "Roger & Me", a documentary where Moore violated private property laws and harassed corporate executives.

What's lesser known about Moore is that he sued another guy who harassed him in the same way. He also directed a couple music videos (mostly for Rage Against the Machine) and occasionally writes books that next to no one reads.

He's famous on this forum for being one of the few semi-famous Americans to blame 9/11 on America itself, mourn the fact that NY and DC weren't even geographic areas that voted for Bush, and criticize the possibility of a military response against the terrorist organization that went out of their way to kill as many American civilians as possible.

In a reaction that was only surprising at the time, many Forum members praised Moore for speaking "the truth" about Big, Bad, Evil America.

And, ultimately, Moore genuinely IS an idiot.

U2LA:

Fifteen or twenty million weekly listeners probably have some amount of respect for the man, not to mention that he stands beside William F. Buckley as a standard-bearer of the conservative movement.

That said, really witty comment.

I'm laughing hysterically.

Ha.

Ha.

popsadie:

I actually don't believe you when you say "99 percent of the opinions he spews frankly sicken me."

Really? Okay, then. Name five of those opinions that sicken you.

z edge:

It's clear to me that you didn't listen to Rush during those years, because Rush nailed other Democrats for their support of Clinton, basically, for giving away their principles to defend a man who lied to a Federal Court.

If you have anything substantive to add to this debate, I'd welcome it.


I still wonder, are any of you open-minded enough to criticize those on your side of the issue when they go too far? When they wrongly and foolishly call Limbaugh a Nazi?

Or are any of you brave enough to defend the accusation?

Or at least brave enough to recognize it?
__________________

__________________
Achtung Bubba is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 09:00 AM   #32
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
80sU2isBest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 4,970
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by tiny dancer:
I'm sorry but I don't have much respect for someone who puts poor and sick people down.
tiny dancer, what makes you think Rush Limbaugh does that?

__________________

__________________
80sU2isBest is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 09:27 AM   #33
ONE
love, blood, life
 
melon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 11,781
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Lemonite:
Rush himself was congratulating a liberal caller who called his show last week on the fact that he didn't call names... The reason I find this funny is because Rush has said himself that it takes the average liberal '30 Seconds' to Launch into Name Calling Coniptions against him.
Join the club, Rush. Funny how almost all of my arguments denigrate into my opponent calling me names. Perhaps I should put a list of the names I've been called in this forum by your "fellow conservatives"?

Rush is successful for the simple reason that AM radio is dominated by conservatives, since all liberal media jumped to television, with a smaller based contingent on FM-based NPR, but it is television where they stand.

Melon

------------------
"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time
__________________
melon is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 09:43 AM   #34
ONE
love, blood, life
 
melon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 11,781
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Bubba, with all due respect, you are virtually the president of Rush Limbaugh's fan club, so I do not expect a balanced opinion on him from you.

Your comments on Michael Moore are sufficient enough to prove that you hate people on the opposite end of your ideological spectrum just as much as liberals hate Rush Limbaugh.

In case you don't know this (which this should be common sense), just as much as followers of Rush Limbaugh probably don't agree with everything he says, not everyone who follows Michael Moore follows everything he says.

The likely moral one can derive from Moore's 9/11 monologues, which, I must remind you, I have criticized myself, was that some of the actions of previous administrations led up to the climate that created 9/11. Even Dubya gave the Taliban $45 million to fight the "War on Drugs" in May 2001. Now don't tell me that the Taliban actually used all that money to fight drugs?

I think that the climate has finally changed within the Republican Party that I think we won't be propping up shaky dictatorships with atrocious human rights records just because they are "anti-communist," but it is funny that it took an event like 9/11 to force Republicans to look at this ultimately liberal idea of setting up responsible governments that actually serve more than just the U.S.'s business interests, no matter how oppressive they are to their own people. The new Afghanistan will certainly be the test as to if this is true or not.

Melon

------------------
"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time
__________________
melon is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 11:47 AM   #35
you are what you is
 
Salome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 22,016
Local Time: 12:05 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Achtung Bubba:
In a reaction that was only surprising at the time, many Forum members praised Moore for speaking "the truth" about Big, Bad, Evil America.
my memory isn't that great and since I know nothing about Moore I don't really have an opinion on him (I think I never posted in any thread about Moore myself), but I don't think people were praising him back then
some people did appreciate it that he at least recognized that US foreign policies in the middle east over the years contributed to the hatred that certain groups over there feel re. the US

------------------
Salome
Shake it, shake it, shake it
__________________
Salome is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 12:49 PM   #36
I'm a chauvinist leprechaun
 
Lemonite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Notre Dame, IN, 46556
Posts: 1,072
Local Time: 11:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Salome:
some people did appreciate it that he at least recognized that US foreign policies in the middle east over the years contributed to the hatred that certain groups over there feel re. the US


I think almost everyone agrees to this fact, but I also would make the statement that an even larger contributor to the outright hatred and the factor spawning such attacks 'On Our Soil' is just pure jealousy over our Country, what it stands for, in fact.. Jealousy over Western Civilization and all it represents which America is the Poster Boy For.

Not changing the push of this thread...,
L.Unplugged

[This message has been edited by Lemonite (edited 03-17-2002).]
__________________
Lemonite is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 12:56 PM   #37
Refugee
 
Achtung Bubba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: One Nation. Under God.
Posts: 1,513
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Melon:

You're ducking the issue.

Certainly, you can point out the names that you've been called, and I just as easily remind you of certain things you've said about conservatives in general, conservative Christians, and me specifically.

Certainly, I'm not unbiased about Rush Limbaugh, but I also defend my claims well beyond any baises. If you want talk about unbalanced opinions, I could remind you about your tendency to link President Bush with dictators of the last century.

The fact remains, calling someone a NAZI is a serious, serious accusation. Other names aside, you should have the cajones to either condemn the accusation or defend it.
__________________
Achtung Bubba is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 01:07 PM   #38
I'm a chauvinist leprechaun
 
Lemonite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Notre Dame, IN, 46556
Posts: 1,072
Local Time: 11:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Achtung Bubba:
If you want talk about unbalanced opinions, I could remind you about your tendency to link President Bush with dictators of the last century.

Don't forget his age old Joke of calling Bush a 'Monkey'.. oh.. excuse me ... 'Trained Chimp'... (In regards to his Implementation of various policies.. Not mention his latest a thread over or so).

Hahaha.. (Insert Smiley with 'Shit Eating Grin' Here).. I think I saw Z Edge use it to perfection somewheres else.. it's the Green faced one...

L.Unplugged

__________________
Lemonite is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 01:07 PM   #39
Refugee
 
Achtung Bubba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: One Nation. Under God.
Posts: 1,513
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Salome:
my memory isn't that great and since I know nothing about Moore I don't really have an opinion on him (I think I never posted in any thread about Moore myself), but I don't think people were praising him back then
some people did appreciate it that he at least recognized that US foreign policies in the middle east over the years contributed to the hatred that certain groups over there feel re. the US
I agree with Lemonite on this one, but I also would like to add the following observation:

Cops are often hated by criminals because they enforce the law - often to the point that criminals try to exact revenge by killing the law enforcement officials that arrested them to begin with. Does that mean the cops should re-examine their duties, and maybe apolgize for arresting the criminals to begin with? No, certainly not. The reason is this: the cops ARE pissing off the criminals, but they're doing the right thing in the process.

Our foreign policy has upset a couple thugs who've decided to try to kill as many of us as possible. But until one can demonstrate that the policy was WRONG, the fact the we upset the thugs means nothing.

My disagreement with Moore is that he thinks our foreign policy - which includes defending the only democratic government in the Mideast AND protecting Muslims in Somalia and the fomer Yugoslavia - is wrong to begin with, assuming he's considered the issue with that level of logic.

More likely, he's going on this assumption:

* The U.S. does X.
* Somebody else gets mad about it.
* X MUST THEN BE WRONG, and the U.S. should immediately apologize, pull out, and pull up the drawbridge.

From what I've read, Moore strikes me as a guy who hates America regardless of what it does, who would call us "heartless" for doing nothing abroad and "imperialists" for trying to help.

For THIS reason, I think he's an idiot (gasp!), anti-American (SHOCK!), and a Judas to the system of free speech and free enterprise that allows him to say such trash AND make a good deal of money because of it.
__________________
Achtung Bubba is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 01:34 PM   #40
ONE
love, blood, life
 
melon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 11,781
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Achtung Bubba:
My disagreement with Moore is that he thinks our foreign policy - which includes defending the only democratic government in the Mideast AND protecting Muslims in Somalia and the fomer Yugoslavia - is wrong to begin with, assuming he's considered the issue with that level of logic.
There used to be another democratic government in the Middle East a long time ago. The Eisenhower administration's CIA brought down a popular representative government in Iran, in 1953, because Mosaddeq, the prime minister, wanted to nationalise Iran's oil. America installed, nurtured, cradled, and propped the Shah for the next 25 years no matter how dictatorial and oppressive he became. This behavior, of course, led to the bloody Islamic revolution in Iran.

Lest we also forget where the whole "jihad" term resurrected. "Jihad" as political holy war had been a dead concept in Islam for centuries. When a few crackpots in Pakistan and Afganistan started talking about a holy war against the Soviet imperialists, the US encouraged and funded this movement (the mujahideen [sp?]) to attack the Soviet Union. Osama bin Laden was our ally, spending his own money and organizing people on the ground, as well as bringing them from all parts of the Islamic world. What do you think this created? Al-Qaeda.

Of course, America neither provoked nor deserved 9/11, but if we are ever to, once and for all, end the cycle of terrorism, we need to confront the truth and learn from our mistakes. If anything, the lesson is not to ally ourselves with fanatics or people of questionable allegiances just because, at that very moment, we think they serve our interests. On the contrary, they may have an agenda all their own, as we have come to see.

I'm hoping that, in our quest to end terrorism and Al-Qaeda, we won't foster a new enemy, just like in our former war against communism and the Soviet Union.

Melon

------------------
"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time
__________________
melon is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 01:39 PM   #41
ONE
love, blood, life
 
melon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 11,781
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Achtung Bubba:
If you want talk about unbalanced opinions, I could remind you about your tendency to link President Bush with dictators of the last century.
If he wishes to keep secrets and pass legislation without approval of Congress under the guise of "national security" and the "war on terrorism," he should expect such criticism. But that's right...Republicans are for "freedom."

Quote:
The fact remains, calling someone a NAZI is a serious, serious accusation. Other names aside, you should have the cajones to either condemn the accusation or defend it.
Amusing...conservatives should have free range to label people "communist," which they did for decades, but now, especially when we have such crackpots as Pat Buchanan in the world, we're supposed to not use the word "Nazi"? If the shoe fits...

Melon

------------------
"He had lived through an age when men and women with energy and ruthlessness but without much ability or persistence excelled. And even though most of them had gone under, their ignorance had confused Roy, making him wonder whether the things he had striven to learn, and thought of as 'culture,' were irrelevant. Everything was supposed to be the same: commercials, Beethoven's late quartets, pop records, shopfronts, Freud, multi-coloured hair. Greatness, comparison, value, depth: gone, gone, gone. Anything could give some pleasure; he saw that. But not everything provided the sustenance of a deeper understanding." - Hanif Kureishi, Love in a Blue Time
__________________
melon is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 02:18 PM   #42
Refugee
 
Achtung Bubba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: One Nation. Under God.
Posts: 1,513
Local Time: 06:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by melon:
Amusing...conservatives should have free range to label people "communist," which they did for decades, but now, especially when we have such crackpots as Pat Buchanan in the world, we're supposed to not use the word "Nazi"? If the shoe fits...
Finally, someone actually addresses my complaint. Thank you.

If I may paraphrase, it appears you're defending the accusation on two fronts:

1. Conservatives call liberals "Communists."

2. Pat Buchanan.

Let's tackle them in that order.

1. I will first of all freely admit, conservatives do think liberals subscribe to a less extreme version of socialism - an economic theory whose most extreme application is Communism.

But there's a reason we say that.

IT'S TRUE.

On the whole, liberals support so-called "progressive" taxation, where the rich pay a higher PERCENTAGE of taxes: "their fair share" is the common term.

Or do you deny that?

Liberals also support large social programs ("safety nets") to ensure that people recieve a certain amount of money. "Working families deserve a living wage", etc.

Or do you deny that as well?

From both ends (taxation and welfare), liberals support a mechanism that pulls economic power into the federal government and redistributes wealth among the population. Even the language of liberals ("the rich must pay their fair share", etc.) REEKS of an earlier phrase:

From each according to his means.
To each according to his needs.


Melon, that IS socialism leading into Communism.

And I defy you to make a similar link between American conservatism and fascism.

2. Admittedly, Pat Buchanan is wondering out into the intellectual wilderness, but he's ABANDONING the conservative movement to do so.

In his most recent book, Buchanan implies that "America" is inherently white, that every non-white nation on Earth is the "Third World", and that America needs to close up its borders - and National Review and others TOOK HIM TO TASK FOR IT. The bottom line is that his views are not a bizzare extension of conservatism - they directly contradict the mainstream conservative values of merit-based equality and free trade.

Rather than point to Buchanan, who's long since walked off into his own little world, explain how Buckley or Limbaugh are Nazi's (or, to use the infamous epithet, "crypto-fascists").

Or, better yet, explain which conservative IDEAS lend themselves to fascism.

You imply the shoe fits.

PROVE IT.
__________________
Achtung Bubba is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 04:40 PM   #43
Registered User
 
chain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Huntington Beach
Posts: 126
Local Time: 11:05 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Lemonite:
Don't forget his age old Joke of calling Bush a 'Monkey'.. oh.. excuse me ... 'Trained Chimp'... (In regards to his Implementation of various policies.. Not mention his latest a thread over or so).

Hahaha.. (Insert Smiley with 'Shit Eating Grin' Here).. I think I saw Z Edge use it to perfection somewheres else.. it's the Green faced one...

L.Unplugged

Here is the evidence?
http://homepage.mac.com/gwchimp/
http://www.bushorchimp.com/

__________________
chain is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 05:05 PM   #44
Blue Crack Addict
 
joyfulgirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 16,615
Local Time: 04:05 AM
Rush's comments about Bono don't offend me. They're stupid, but relatively benign.

It's his tendency to make inflammatory racist remarks that offend me.
__________________
joyfulgirl is offline  
Old 03-17-2002, 05:08 PM   #45
War Child
 
Matthew_Page2000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Seattle
Posts: 873
Local Time: 04:05 AM
We're taking Rush Limbaugh seriously?
What's next? Daffy Duck on abortion rights and the American tax burden?

MAP
__________________

__________________
Matthew_Page2000 is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:05 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com