"Honor Killings" On The Rise In Europe

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http://www.boston.com/news/world/eu...16/for_muslim_women_a_deadly_defiance?mode=PF

As Europe's Muslims become increasingly conservative, growing numbers of women are being killed or mutilated in the name of ''family honor," according to law enforcement agencies, women's activist groups, and moderate Islamic organizations. These cases usually involve an attack on a Muslim woman by a close relative -- typically a brother or father -- angered by her refusal to accept a forced marriage or her insistence on leading a Western-style life.

There were at least eight such slayings in Berlin alone in 2005, and 47 honor killings of Muslim women across Germany in the past six years, according to police, media reports, and activist groups. Not coincidentally, activists say, tens of thousands of European-born Muslim women are annually forced into unwanted marriages, often to much older men, in their family's home countries. Refusal to submit to such marriages can bring a death sentence.

The violent trend, say authorities, reflects the strengthening grip of religious fundamentalism among the continent's 16 million Muslims, many of whom suffer from rising unemployment, inadequate education, and -- perhaps above all -- the sense of being unwelcome outsiders in their adopted homes. As Muslim men embrace radical Islam and return to age-old customs, women are paying a cruel price

''There is a lost generation of Muslims in Europe," said Eren Uensal, spokeswoman for the Turkish Federation of Berlin. ''Ten years ago, Muslims here were more modern, more secular than those 'back home.' Now the situation has reversed. The younger men feel there is no place for them in Europe, but they also feel there is no place else for them."

Islamic radical groups are filling the vacuum. ''The most alarming thing they teach is that violence is an acceptable way to enforce religious views or social customs," Uensal said. ''Much of that violence is against women."

Britain opened a review of the suspicious cases after a Kurdish immigrant from Iraq, Abdullah Yones, held his 16-year-old daughter over a bathtub and slashed her throat in 2004 after discovering that she was trading love letters with a boy in her high school class in London. In court last year, Yones insisted that his daughter brought her fate on herself. On the day he was sentenced to life imprisonment, dozens of approving Kurdish men came to court to show solidarity with Yones, according to media accounts.

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A mourner laid flowers at the spot in Berlin where 23-year-old Hatun Surucu, a single mother, was gunned down by her brother.
 
Sorry if this may sound harsh, but when will the muslim religon start changing? Same goes for the Christian religon. Honor Killings will only make your religon look worse off.
 
Ooh, this is bad news. It's not the "Islamic religion", Justin. It's a particularly conservative approach to the Islamic religion. Plenty of Muslims have managed to find a synthesis between their traditions and more Western-style notions of freedom. These are people who haven't been able to do this.
 
Oh I know, but its a group of individuals who make the religon bad. I am wondering in the Quran does it allow Honor Killings? One Janitor I worked with who is a Sunni Muslim said if he found out his daughter was dating someone he would kill her.
It's the same with the Catholic Religon, Priests who molest children is just as bad. The church should reform and allow priests to marry.
 
I'm Catholic, and I think celibacy should be optional. We haven't always had a celibate clergy. The idea was first adopted by a council in the fourth century, but didn't become a rule until the twelfth century. Then things were getting messy because of heredity issues. The children of bishops were getting bishoprics. Another issue was the claim that a priest shouldn't have his attention divided between his work and his family. Protestant ministers, rabbis and other married clergy seem to do just fine. Why can't ours?
 
financeguy said:
They should do things our way or be expelled.

I'm not implying that they should do things "our way". I'm talking about things that cause much suffering, like honor killings and forced marriages. I read about an American Muslim woman who wears a headscarf, but also has a master's degree in chemical engineering, works, and chose her husband. She faces Mecca five times a day for prayer, follows the Muslim dietary rules, etc, etc. Anyone and everyone should stop doing things that cause suffering, if it can be stopped. I think honor killings and forced marriages can be and should be stopped.
 
financeguy said:
They should do things our way or be expelled.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic, but to some extent, yes. If people commit "honor killings" they shouldn't be expelled but they should be jailed for premeditated murder. And forcing women into marriages isn't a legitimate form of cultural diversity or something in most Western countries...a certain amount of assimilation has to be expected when you come to another country. That's not to say they can't pray 5 times a day, wear headscarves, etc.
 
verte76 said:
I'm not implying that they should do things "our way"

No, but I am. You thought I was being sarcastic? I wasn't. If they want to live in the West they should live by our rules.
 
financeguy said:

If they want to live in the West they should live by our rules.

I agree. If we go and visit their countries, were expected to live by there rules. So should they in some sense.
 
Justin24 said:
Sorry if this may sound harsh, but when will the muslim religon start changing? Same goes for the Christian religon. Honor Killings will only make your religon look worse off.

:confused: What does the Christian religion have to do with "honor killings"?

Back OT, I have a question for someone who's read the Koran: are "honor killings" officially sanctioned in the Koran, or not?
 
I ment that if they have honor killings which make the muslim religon look bad, then the christians have corrpution, which make them look bad.
 
No, honor killings are definitely not sanctioned by the Koran. Islamic law does permit capital punishment in the specific case of married adulterers (female or male), but it is never required, and in fact the constitutions of most Muslim countries explicitly forbid this practice. Furthermore, "honor killing" as defined by sharia--i.e., participation in the killing of a woman by her family members in any situation besides the above--is expressly forbidden by Islamic law. A small handful of radical clerics tout the sharia precedent of al-urf--i.e., legitimacy of custom and cultural traditions as sources of legislation in situations where the Koran and Sunnah do not provide a comprehensive legal framework--as justification for the legality of such killings in countries otherwise committed to sharia. But this interpretation is soundly rejected by most clerics, and so far as I know, Jordan is the only Muslim country which legally permits (sharia-defined) "honor killings" based on the al-urf rationale.

Incidentally, "honor killings" as defined by the UN--i.e., acts of violence committed by male relatives against female relatives in retaliation for acts perceived as dishonoring the family--result in the deaths of some 5000 women worldwide every year, including many from the non-Muslim communities of such countries as India, Brazil, Colombia, Ecuador and Haiti. Demographically speaking, it probably makes most sense to correlate such "honor killings" not with any particular religious community, but rather with a more general context of rigidly patriarchal, clan-based sociteties in which "family honor" (as opposed to individual integrity) is regarded as the prime measure of individual worth, and where such entrenched customs rest uneasily alongside the much newer traditions of civil society, individual freedoms, and the rule of law. And certainly, such a description would also apply to large sectors of (for example) Pakistani society--Pakistan being one of the most oft-cited examples of a Muslim country in which "honor killings" occur with disturbing frequency, despite being grounds for murder charges and capital punishment (at least, according to the law books).

And a final note, for perspective's sake. Every year in the US, some 1300 women are murdered by their male partners, while some 3 million are assaulted by them. Most Americans--myself included--would be both repulsed and offended by the suggestion that these statistics in any way reflect the influence of any sort of "cultural" or "traditional" mores endemic to us. Or by any insinuation that we are thereby unworthy to call ourselves a society which cherishes and protects the right of women to pursue life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. But 1300 murders yearly! 3 million assaults! These numbers ought to give us some pause when proffering our diagnoses of the "causes" of such brutality elsewhere. Is the mere presence or absence of some conveniently nameable and treaceable cultural precedent really all that is needed to explain, and more importantly put an end to, such awful crimes? Are we really in a postion to confidently assert that having all the "right" politico-ethical values in place--and all the "wrong" ones formally discredited--is a reliable remedy for such problems? We don't, and shouldn't, let Muslim leaders off the hook merely for making the brutalization of women punishable under law, but do we really extend the same standard of scrutiny to ourselves?
 
yolland said:
We don't, and shouldn't, let Muslim leaders off the hook merely for making the brutalization of women punishable under law, but do we really extend the same standard of scrutiny to ourselves?

No we don't extend that, and I don't want to imply for one second that we shouldn't. Some of the very same people who are outraged by these "honor killings" would want to gloss over the problems we have in the US with violence against women and the murder of women by their husbands/boyfriends. All of this violence is equally horrific and needs to be condemned.

That was a very informative post you wrote, thanks. It's nice to see you back here.
 
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