Hitchens is not great! Sharpton is ? - Page 4 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 05-24-2007, 09:10 PM   #46
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
coemgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Black and White Town
Posts: 3,962
Local Time: 03:10 AM
Wow. It's a group conversation now.

First off, let me say that I've been speaking from a general perspective that many Christians have on homosexuality. Like I've said before, I'm on the fence with the issue and can see both sides. I'm still forming my own personal belief on the issue.

That said, from the general perspective I was using to explain where some Christians come from, it's getting into the apples to oranges debate. I understand how you guys see it, but they don't see it as something homosexuals are born with, so therefore it is a sin to them. You can't say they're hateful or discriminatory when their opinion, no matter how wrong or right it is, differs from yours as far as why people are homosexual. If they believed they were born that way AND continued to call it a sin and/or were to discriminate, then yeah, there's a bigger issue to deal with. However, if they simply see it as a sinful lifestyle, then at best (or worst) they're ignorant. I don't think that equates to hate, especially if they're ultimately looking for that person to find salvation from their sins through Christ, like all of us need. Then they're still just hoping for the best for that person. Does that make sense?
I think that's some of why there's so much tension and a lack of meaningful dialogue between the two sides is because both sides are failing to understand that the other side has a different definition of homosexuality and it's a view they hold with some conviction. Then there's name calling comes from both sides.
Now, if they're discriminating regardless of what they believe, that's wrong. If they're using the term sin when they believe that's what it is though, I don't see it as hate. It may be wrong, but ultimately they want that person, I would hope, to find salvation through Christ for their sins and see that it, as well as every other sin, is detrimental to their lives. Again, whether it is sin or not is the truth we all need to arrive at through open minds, prayer and positive discussion.
__________________

__________________
coemgen is offline  
Old 05-24-2007, 09:17 PM   #47
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 06:10 PM
It doesn't matter if they are born gay or not, sexual activity between consenting adults does not justify government discrimination; not discriminating them from being members of a particular church thats fine, but not unequal rights under law.

I am going to say that I am quite pro-sin; blasphemy, sex before marroage, heathenism - I don't see how being hated by religious minded bigots reflects badly on you.
__________________

__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 05-24-2007, 09:23 PM   #48
Rock n' Roll Doggie
 
coemgen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Black and White Town
Posts: 3,962
Local Time: 03:10 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by deep


I reject this

the whole sin concept

I do believe in right and wrong behavior
decency and so forth

sin is a weapon used by religious groups

I believe it is just a way of shaming and controlling people

you calling me a sinner,
is as legitimate as a Muslim calling you an infidel
If you reject that, that's your decision. However, for the millions of Christians around the world, including myself, it's a central component to our view of existence, eternity and our relationship with God.

As far as it being a "weapon used by religious groups" and a "way of shaming and controlling people," it hasn't been that way for me. In my life, understanding that God is holy, pure and equal to love itself and I am too often the opposite of those things has been the most freeing thing ever. Knowing I can be forgiven for any hate, rage, lust, bitterness, anger, judgement, jealousy, or whatever else that comes into my heart is the deepest form of liberation for me.

And, that said, I can honestly say there's been times here in FYM I've allowed some of these states of mind and heart to take over as I discuss/debate with you and others here. While I may stand by my perspectives and convictions, I know I may not always get it out in the right way or with the right heart. Therefore, I'm sincerely sorry and I ask for your forgiveness.
__________________
coemgen is offline  
Old 05-24-2007, 09:31 PM   #49
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 06:10 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by deep

you calling me a sinner,
is as legitimate as a Muslim calling you an infidel
But a Muslim is legitimate in calling you an infidel, well maybe not if your technically a person of the book but me definitely so. It isn't that they are incorrect it's just that the worldview is wrong and harmful.
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 05-24-2007, 09:37 PM   #50
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Tempe, Az USA
Posts: 12,856
Local Time: 01:10 AM

I'm kinda out on the whole Gay question, if it's genetic or not.

I've known a few gay LDS ppl, some have even died from HIV and despite that many have said they still love the Church, but don't agree with the policy.


I think a kind and loving Creator will sort things out in the next life.

One thing I so love about my Faith is that Mormons are not a "hell fire and brimstone" people.

We're taught to love, esp love the less fortunate, we're even encouraged to take a day off and volunteer at an AIDS or Cancer clinic to learn empathy and compassion towards our fellowman.

That my friends is what the Gospel of Jesus Christ is all about in a nutshell.


dbs
__________________
diamond is offline  
Old 05-27-2007, 07:28 AM   #51
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
maycocksean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: The Most Important State in the Union
Posts: 4,882
Local Time: 03:10 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by BEAL


While some will look towards a higher power that gives us this control, I just think from a survival level, it doesn't make any sense. If any one species were to start killing it's own, how would this species survive?
You would think. . .and yet, that's exactly what our own species seems to be doing to itself much of the time.

To explain that seemingly counterintuitive characteristic of human beings, some people of faith use the "s" word.
__________________
maycocksean is offline  
Old 06-04-2007, 01:18 AM   #52
ONE
love, blood, life
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Tempe, Az USA
Posts: 12,856
Local Time: 01:10 AM
Hitchens has a brother who doesn't agree with his views:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...7&in_a_source=
__________________
diamond is offline  
Old 06-04-2007, 01:46 AM   #53
Blue Crack Addict
 
deep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: A far distance down.
Posts: 28,501
Local Time: 12:10 AM
Brothers that do not think the same.

Is that possible?
__________________

__________________
deep is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:10 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com