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Old 06-23-2003, 08:38 PM   #61
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Ya but we all no that i am not alone in my thinking. I'm sure you could go to a site and have everyone disagree with you. It's all situational. But i fell that if i dont agree with same sex marriages it make me a bigot, well that what i fell others make me fell like.
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:04 PM   #62
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Originally posted by bonoman
Why is that everyone here says they have the right to marry but it seems that i or other people dont have the right to disagree. I dont think its natural. Thats my opinion. You think it is natural. We disagree. But the only man that made this decsion is Jean (even though it had to be voted on, his word carries alot of power.) I would love to see a national vote on this issue.
Nature even disagrees with you. Homosexual animals are well-documented.

A national vote? If we went to a "national vote" regarding de-segregation in the South back in the 1960s in the U.S., I'd venture to say it would never have happened. Human rights shouldn't be about "popularity," nor should democracy be reduced to "mob rule."

You also happen to forget that your Constitution was written with equal rights in it. That was your "vote."

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And to say a recent poll said 50% of people supported it i would like to see the territorial differences of that poll. For example, Alberta is much more conservative then say Quebec. That it is my right and the right of Alberta citizens to say we dont think it is right and not to have it in our provience.
Blah de blah blah. If you don't want a gay marriage, then don't have one. I would venture to say that your life hasn't changed one iota since the court rulings and nor would it change if gays were allowed to marry in Alberta. It's just like white supremacists blaming all their woes on Jews and blacks, when its their own stupidity at fault.

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Where the hell is my hetero-pride week!
Everyday. Walk down the street and count the number of heterosexual couples holding hands or kissing in public. Go to church and listen to the all the exultations of heterosexual marriage. Go to work and watch your colleagues randomly ask co-workers about their relationships--always assumed to be heterosexual. Watch TV. Look at advertisements.

If you are so threatened by *one* Gay Pride day or month, then count your blessings with the rest of the year and shut up.

Melon
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:05 PM   #63
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gay marriage... that's fine with me...

gay adoption... now that i have a big problem with.
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:15 PM   #64
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Originally posted by wall
gay adoption... now that i have a big problem with.
Right. Now tell me that all straight people are fit parents? And tell me that everyone here grew up with both their parents? Now, everyone here who didn't grow up with both their parents, tell me if you are defective as a result? No?

Ironically enough, this is already legal in every state but Florida. No, the world didn't implode, and, no, the children aren't turning gay.

Melon
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:24 PM   #65
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I agree, but wanted to point out the double standard that a lot of this society has. Why it would make one nervous is beyond me and why someone feels they have the right to outlaw others right to marry sickens me.
BonoVoxSupastar - I COMPLETELY agree with you, and I just had this same discussion with a friend a few days ago...I still don't know why straight men are so threatened by gay men and their lifestyle. It really has no barring on them or their lives. Yet, time and time again, we see straight men threatened by this very thing that has nothing to do with them. They aren't being asked to partake in homosexual activity or to go to gay bars or what have you. I find it very odd. It's really not logical. They are basically taking their own insecurities and stigmas and expecting everyone else (whether they've got the same insecurites and stigmas or not) to live according to those fears as well. It's really very strange when you think about it, isn't it? And you're right: it is sickening that people would take these fears so far as to use them as a "reason" to outlaw a common, basic human right. To quote a wise man, "Where's the reason in that?"
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:44 PM   #66
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Originally posted by melon


Nature even disagrees with you. Homosexual animals are well-documented.

Melon:

Although I agree with much of what you say from a fairness and human rights perspective, I do not think this is a very effective benchmark to use. Animals have also been observed in incestuous acts and in acts with other breeds (would we call that "beastiality"?).

bonoman:

You seem to be quickly learning that you are holding one of the "taboo" opinions amongst modern day social issues.

~U2Alabama
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:48 PM   #67
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I was going to mention that every single week is hetero-pride week, but melon put it much more eloquently.
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:51 PM   #68
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Originally posted by melon


Nature even disagrees with you. Homosexual animals are well-documented.

A national vote? If we went to a "national vote" regarding de-segregation in the South back in the 1960s in the U.S., I'd venture to say it would never have happened. Human rights shouldn't be about "popularity," nor should democracy be reduced to "mob rule."

You also happen to forget that your Constitution was written with equal rights in it. That was your "vote."



Blah de blah blah. If you don't want a gay marriage, then don't have one. I would venture to say that your life hasn't changed one iota since the court rulings and nor would it change if gays were allowed to marry in Alberta. It's just like white supremacists blaming all their woes on Jews and blacks, when its their own stupidity at fault.



Everyday. Walk down the street and count the number of heterosexual couples holding hands or kissing in public. Go to church and listen to the all the exultations of heterosexual marriage. Go to work and watch your colleagues randomly ask co-workers about their relationships--always assumed to be heterosexual. Watch TV. Look at advertisements.

If you are so threatened by *one* Gay Pride day or month, then count your blessings with the rest of the year and shut up.

Melon

I love arguing with you, you get so crazy!!

You saying that because i can walk down the street and see more heterosexuals that homosexuals is obsurd. I never said you cant hold hands or kiss. Just dont think you are special for doing it. I recently asked a very pretty girl at work why she didnt have a b/f and she said she wasnt into guys. No big deal, but she didnt start yelling it out and making a big deal out of it. Things are changing, i agree, but rapid change will be meet with a equal disagreement. Unless the Church changes their view there will always be people who dont agree with you (and i am not going by the Church, it is my personal view.) Gay Pride week is something that i really dont agree with. It agravates people who disagree with it. It would be like if people who didnt agree with homosexuality had a parade on how much they think it is wrong. It would agravate you.

I dont know this is a sensitive issue for you and for me for my own personal reasons.
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Old 06-23-2003, 09:53 PM   #69
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Originally posted by bonoman

Gay Pride week is something that i really dont agree with. It agravates people who disagree with it.
I'm sure the Ku Klux Klan was aggravated by all of Martin Luther King's parades too.

I say, who gives a shit?
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Old 06-23-2003, 10:40 PM   #70
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Originally posted by U2Bama
Although I agree with much of what you say from a fairness and human rights perspective, I do not think this is a very effective benchmark to use. Animals have also been observed in incestuous acts and in acts with other breeds (would we call that "beastiality"?).
I wouldn't bring up the "incest" argument yourself, U2Bama. Religion has conveniently ignored Biblical prohibitions of incest, defined to be something like up to the 13th cousin. So does that mean that the U.S. should be rotting in hell for allowing close cousins to marry? Heck, Kentucky allows you to marry your first cousin.

As for pedophilia (another stupid argument against gays), it was certainly not something that the heterosexual world gave a rat's ass about until the last century. Marriage was certainly not consentual at all times (arranged marriages) and nor was it proportionate in age. I cannot count the number of 30-40 year old monarchs who married nine year-old children.

Quote:
bonoman:

You seem to be quickly learning that you are holding one of the "taboo" opinions amongst modern day social issues.
Well, and watch you get all huffy when I call Southerners bigoted, ignorant redneck trailer trash, unemployed and on welfare who spend their daytime drinking and beating their wives in their left hand and preaching the Bible in their other with their Cracker Jack minister diploma.

Did I just say that?

Tolerance is a two-way street, and you know that isn't true of all Southerners, but prove me wrong. Any example you give, well, I can find a media stereotype to back me up.

And there's my frustration with these kinds of threads. I can tell people until I'm blue in the face that these are one-sided and ignorant generalizations about gay people, but no one seems to care. Of course, between this thread and the "negroes" thread, I can see that this world really is short of empathy and common sense these days.

Melon

P.S. I don't believe that about Southerners; it was a point that I was trying to make that I hope you understand the motivation for.
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Old 06-23-2003, 10:51 PM   #71
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Go, melon!

That's all I have to say.

Angela
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Old 06-24-2003, 07:06 AM   #72
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I don't disagree with it

but I do see an evolutionary argument to be made.

you look at the male and female bodies and it's obvious to see that naturally and biologically male belongs in female this is how the human race survives

of course, humans are capable of so many emotions and attachments, that this biological predisposition is not always the determining factor.
Love over biology

of course, if radical feminists have their way, males will be completely alienated from the reproductive process via artificial insimination.
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Old 06-24-2003, 08:01 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally posted by bonoman
I love arguing with you, you get so crazy!!


Do you take pride in the fact that homophobia is offensive to many people here?

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You saying that because i can walk down the street and see more heterosexuals that homosexuals is obsurd. I never said you cant hold hands or kiss. Just dont think you are special for doing it.


Firstly, I'm sure walking down the street, one would see more heterosexual couples than gay couples. Secondly, when lesbian and gay couples try to act in public in the same way heterosexual couples behave, they all too often face an onslaught of abuse for it. Do you know of any heterosexual couples who have been verbally abused for holding hands in public? How often are heterosexual couples assaulted because they display their affection for one another in public?

We're not asking for anyone to think we're "special." We're asking that if we wish to act in the same way as thousands of heterosexual couples do everyday, we're free to do so without the fear of being insulted or even physically assaulted for doing so.


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I recently asked a very pretty girl at work why she didnt have a b/f and she said she wasnt into guys. No big deal, but she didnt start yelling it out and making a big deal out of it.
One of my co-workers in my last job had about six or eight photographs of herself and her husband and children on her desk. She never stopped talking about her husband either. I'm fine with her being heterosexual, I just wish she didn't have to start yelling it out and making a big deal out of it.

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Gay Pride week is something that i really dont agree with. It agravates people who disagree with it.
And anti-racist marches aggravate racists. Does that mean we should stop opposing racism because it annoys the racists? Bigots are always going to be annoyed by those who believe in acceptance and diversity - that's not a reason to allow their prejudiced views to go unchallenged.
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Old 06-24-2003, 10:24 AM   #74
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homophobia...blah blah..

Look, you can't necessarily label people who think homosexuality is wrong as being "homophobic". Phobia means "fear". I'm sure some people are afraid of homosexuality, but many of us just think that it's wrong.

I think getting drunk is a sin...does that make me an "alcophobe"? I think adultery is wrong...does that make me an "adultephobe"?
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Old 06-24-2003, 11:08 AM   #75
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so you think that a person who dies a gay person is damned to hell?
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