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Old 08-07-2009, 06:16 PM   #871
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I'm no Bush fan but I'm just wondering if there are independent sources to verify this "Agog/Magog" story. I'm don't buy it. Because, from the tone of the article it sounds like the sort of hyperbolic "news" we've normally come to expect from the Right.
I posted the same story several months ago. I believe the source at the time might have been GQ? And I think it was in one of the Bush threads. I'll have to look for it. Anyway, it sounded credible to me.


Eta - Ah, here it is: The legacy of President George W. Bush

It's from the Toronto Star, citing the GQ article. A link to the original article is in the post.
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Old 08-07-2009, 08:34 PM   #872
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Really? I didn't think so.

You know they did something similar during the campaign to combat all the spurious things being intimated about Obama, right?

Now I'd be worried if that post had read like this:

"There is a lot of disinformation about health insurance reform out there, spanning from control of personal finances to end of life care. These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. As innocent as they may seem these views are dangerous to the security of our nation. Since we can’t keep track of all of them here at the White House, we’re asking for your help. Do you have friends, work colleagues, or other associates who have been spreading disinformation about healthcare reform? If so, get their name, address, and phone number and send it to flag@whitehouse.gov. Or contact your local law enforcement agency. And remember, even uneducated family members can be a threat."

Now THAT would be Orwellian!

(Now watch some unscrupulous right winger take my modified quote and spread it around as if it's real).
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Old 08-07-2009, 11:27 PM   #873
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Violence At Townhall - Against A Conservative; Six Arrested, Including a Reporter | NewsBusters.org

We have some video of the attack. It appears that it is members of the Service Employees International Union (SEIU) doing at least some of the dirty work.

But it's conservatives who engage in violence and hate speech, right?

The Saint Louis Post-Dispatch is reporting that one of their own, reporter Jake Wagman, was one of six people arrested in connection with the beating of a conservative activist outside of a town hall forum held by Democrat Congressman Russ Carnahan.

According to Dawn Majors, a Post-Dispatch photojournalist who witnessed everything unfold, an officer said that Wagman had been "interfering."

From the article:

Kenneth Gladney, a 38-year-old conservative activist from St. Louis, said he was attacked by some of those arrested as he handed out yellow flags with “Don't tread on me” printed on them. He spoke to the Post-Dispatch from the emergency room of the St. John's Mercy Medical Center, where he said he was waiting to be treated for injuries to his knee, back, elbow, shoulder and face that he suffered in the attack. Gladney, who is black, said one of his attackers, also a black man, used a racial slur against him before the attack started.

"It just seems there's no freedom of speech without being attacked," he said.

That is some list of injuries, which means it must have been some beating. And Gladney says he was attacked by "some of those arrested," which means there were probably more in the mob than just that.

And let us not overlook nor forget the racial slur Gladney additionally endured.

Two of those were arrested on suspicion of assault, one of resisting arrest and three on suspicion of committing peace disturbances.

To be very fair, Wagman of the Post-Dispatch could have simply been in the way while trying to shoot video of the assault; the article does not say.

We'll see how widely this is reported by the Lamestream Media, as it certainly fails to fit into their Conservative Haters template.


------------

I can't wait to hear what Olbermann and the Daily Kos say about this!

So comparing these protesters to Nazis, Brownshirts, political terrorists and Timothy McVeigh wasn't enough? They have to start physically attacking them now? Is it November 2010 yet?
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Old 08-07-2009, 11:32 PM   #874
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Another article on the story:

http://www.dakotavoice.com/2009/08/i...-at-town-hall/

By now you have probably heard about the incident last night in Gadsden, the suburb of St. Louis where a man handing out flags at a health care town hall meeting was assaulted by union thugs from Service Employees International Union SEIU.

Yesterday, union bosses called out the dogs to defend socialism against the freedom-loving Americans who have been speaking out against the government health care plan at town hall meetings. It didn’t take long for a pack of them to show up in St. Louis last night and start causing trouble.

Neil Cavuto interviewed Kenneth Gladney this afternoon about the incident.

Gladney said he was giving out the “Don’t Tread on Me” flags when someone walked up to him and asked, “Who in the &%* is selling this @&%! here?”

Gladney said he asked him if he wanted one of his flags, and the man (who was also black) asked Gladney, “What kind of n_____ are you to be giving out this kind of stuff?”

Gladney said he snatched a board of political buttons from him, Gladney grabbed it back from him and according to Gladney that is when the union thug hit him in the face. Then another union thug came up and started hitting Gladney in the face. At this point, Gladney fell down and then someone else started hitting him in the face and kicking him while he was on the ground.

David Brown, Gladney’s lawyer, released this statement earlier today:

Kenneth was attacked on the evening of August 6, 2009 at Rep. Russ Carnahan’s town hall meeting in South St. Louis County. I was at the town hall meeting as well and witnessed the events leading up to the attack of Kenneth. Kenneth was approached by an SEIU representative as Kenneth was handing out “Don’t Tread on Me” flags to other conservatives. The SEIU representative demanded to know why a black man was handing out these flags. The SEIU member used a racial slur against Kenneth, then punched him in the face. Kenneth fell to the ground. Another SEIU member yelled racial epithets at Kenneth as he kicked him in the head and back. Kenneth was also brutally attacked by one other male SEIU member and an unidentified woman. The three men were clearly SEIU members, as they were wearing T-shirts with the SEIU logo.

Kenneth was beaten badly. One assailant fled on foot; three others were arrested. Kenneth was admitted to St. John’s Mercy Medical Center emergency room, where he was treated for his numerous injuries. Kenneth was merely expressing his freedom of speech by handing out the flags. In fact, he merely asked people as they exited the town hall meeting whether they would like a flag. He in no way provoked any argument or altercation, as evidenced by the fact that three assailants were arrested.

These union goons had better hope they have plenty of cannon fodder, because this kind of Chicago-style intimidation isn’t going to stop Americans from speaking out against the planned socialist takeover of the health care industry.

Our freedoms as Americans are far too precious to surrender to elitist socialists in Washington, or to brutish thugs who think they are entitled to kick around other Americans.

And we won’t.
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Old 08-07-2009, 11:33 PM   #875
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I can't wait to hear what Olbermann and the Daily Kos say about this!

They'll say, "this is about hating a black man in the White House."
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Old 08-08-2009, 12:20 AM   #876
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actually the whole email the white house thing is not "big brother like" at all. Basically if you hear misinformation about health care, you email the white house so the white house can help stop false rumors. There is actually going to be a new website coming up trying to educate people on the new health care plan and stop the rumors that have been going around (hence email them the rumors/ concerns people are having). It has nothing to do with "reporting enemies" and its the same thing that they did on the campaign with fightthesmears.com

If you want to talk about "big brother" - well then look at W's Patriot Act.
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Old 08-08-2009, 12:57 AM   #877
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If you want to talk about "big brother" - well then look at W's Patriot Act.
But you're okay with the same government having the complete health records of each and every American?
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Old 08-08-2009, 12:59 AM   #878
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So comparing these protesters to Nazis, Brownshirts, political terrorists and Timothy McVeigh wasn't enough? They have to start physically attacking them now? Is it November 2010 yet?

Who really made these comparisons?

All sides have violent people, it's just a sad fact of humanity...
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:01 AM   #879
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But you're okay with the same government having the complete health records of each and every American?
millions and millions of people are already on government healthcare. i really doubt they're concerned with obama snooping through their files to see if they have any embarrassing health problems, nor do i think anyone in the government is bored enough to read files unless they need to.
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:02 AM   #880
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But you're okay with the same government having the complete health records of each and every American?
How many citizens do they have access to medical records now?

Indy, I could look up your medical records if I knew your name and date of birth, in my field I don't even need a SSN all the time. Anyone who thinks their records are some kind of sacred cow under a private industry are fooling themselves.
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:18 AM   #881
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How many citizens do they have access to medical records now?

Indy, I could look up your medical records if I knew your name and date of birth, in my field I don't even need a SSN all the time. Anyone who thinks their records are some kind of sacred cow under a private industry are fooling themselves.
There currently is no central system for all health records which is why the Obama team is pushing to "save money with electronic health records for all Americans within five years."

There no doubt are cost and healthcare advantages to such a system but concerns about privacy and the potential for abuse are certainly valid as well.
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:20 AM   #882
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There no doubt are cost and healthcare advantages to such a system but concerns about privacy and the potential for abuse are certainly valid as well.
in all seriousness, what is some low level government employee (if they can really even be bothered looking) going to do with the knowledge that someone has herpes, for example?
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:35 AM   #883
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There currently is no central system for all health records which is why the Obama team is pushing to "save money with electronic health records for all Americans within five years."

There no doubt are cost and healthcare advantages to such a system but concerns about privacy and the potential for abuse are certainly valid as well.
It really isn't that valid when you really know how it all works... If you've ever had a brace put on or had any kind of surgery done where a rep was involved, they are now driving around with your medical records in their trunk. It's that easy. So your concerns about "privacy" are really just old school boogie man myths.
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:46 AM   #884
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in all seriousness, what is some low level government employee (if they can really even be bothered looking) going to do with the knowledge that someone has herpes, for example?
Question
How long did it take to find out last fall that Joe The Plumber owed back taxes in the state of Ohio?

Answer
As long as it took for "some low level government employee" (a Democrat as it turns out) to access the state's electronic records and leak it to the press.

Anyway, my concern isn't about herpes -- it's about the possibility of centralized bureaucrats making objective, one-size-fits-all healthcare decisions instead of the treating physician making more subjective decisions.
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Old 08-08-2009, 01:48 AM   #885
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Question
How long did it take to find out last fall that Joe The Plumber owed back taxes in the state of Ohio?

Answer
As long as it took for "some low level government employee" (a Democrat as it turns out) to access the state's electronic records and leak it to the press.

Anyway, my concern isn't about herpes -- it's about the possibility of centralized bureaucrats making objective, one-size-fits-all healthcare decisions instead of the treating physician making more subjective decisions.
he was a pretty public person. you know anyone who releases medical records is going to get severely bitch slapped.

if it's done properly, that won't be an issue. you could make a similar argument for what insurance companies do right now.
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