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Old 01-11-2002, 03:33 AM   #16
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TheU2, I didn't find the question offensive, but KhanadaRhodes caught you out, big time!

As for the "gay voice", it is something which is learned, and many gay men are very annoyed by it because it stereotypes the whole group.

I personally think it can be quite funny. I have some gay friends who like to use it to make a particular point, and it can be hilarious! Think Will & Grace.

BTW, I don't think that we should be afraid of talking about such things, as long as it's done in a respectful manner. Political correctness often has the opposite effect of what it's meant to achieve.
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Old 01-11-2002, 03:39 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Klodomir:
TheU2, I didn't find the question offensive, but KhanadaRhodes caught you out, big time!
hehehe...i don't find it offensive either, i just wanted to point that out. sorry if you thought i was slammin ya, theu2 *hugs*

it is funny cuz the people i know who are gay do that do, like they're two different people...

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Old 01-11-2002, 07:26 AM   #18
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I don't find the topic particularly offensive, however I can see how some would, because it's just not a question most people would think to ask... and it is a question that may never be understood or able to be answered... but this is Free Your Mind, so why not?

Stereotypes suck because they hold the preconceived notion that every one that falls under a particularly group acts or talks a certain way. This doesn't sit well with the theory that we're all unique individuals. However in some cases this stereotypical attribute may be applied. I bet you can think up a 'voice' that society has applied for each of these types of people:

blacks
hicks
cheerleaders
surfers

you get my point. I think this 'voice' emerges due to simple social patterns. An image of the essence of a particular type of person is standardized in society. You have people walking the walk and talking the talk. It's all very subconscious and these types of learned behaviors can become almost instinctual. It's kind of like those who bear accents--it's due to the geographical area in which they live. Ask me how these 'voices' or attributes originate and it may be more difficult to explain. There's that whole "it's not a conscious effort, so surely it's in their genes" thing... but then maybe it's not--maybe it's just a social pattern.

Or maybe I've just been in Sociology class for too long

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Old 01-11-2002, 07:29 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by KhanadaRhodes:
no, you asked whether or not a gay person naturally has a "gay" voice or not, not whether or not they are born gay. say what you mean and mean what you say.

I was arguing whether talking with a "gay" voice is a natural extension of them being born gay (my opinion, some differ and think that a person chooses to be gay) or is it a learned behavior. I apologize if my logic got a little muddy.

CK

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Old 01-11-2002, 08:42 AM   #20
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Great post, Bebe!
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Old 01-11-2002, 10:02 AM   #21
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well it appears i was dead wrong.
i must say, i'm surprised.
i wouldn't say i personally am that offended by it, i just figured a lot of others would take great offense to it.
well a lot of others have responded and none have been that offended besides one, april.

*is tempted to see how far he can push this offensive trend...by proclaiming Pop to be the most rockingest thing ever.

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Old 01-11-2002, 10:07 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by kobayashi:

*is tempted to see how far he can push this offensive trend...by proclaiming Pop to be the most rockingest thing ever.

"We don't want the flying pig - we want the lemon!" - Bono.
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Old 01-11-2002, 10:51 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by KhanadaRhodes:
no, you asked whether or not a gay person naturally has a "gay" voice or not, not whether or not they are born gay. say what you mean and mean what you say.

Its related. People are born gay. But are gay men born with a gay voice that will become apparant when they mature?

I have another twist to the discussion. Do gay men speak with the a "gay" voice to let other gay men know that they are gay. Traditionally, it has been much more difficult to seek a gay partner since 95% (guess) of the population is heterosexual. It has become easier though with the advent of gay bars and the internet. Did this "voice" evolve to counter that problem.

I would love to get a response from a gay person regarding these issues. I know however, that many gay people on this forum are not "out" to the forum so don't feel obliged to post.

CK
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Old 01-11-2002, 11:01 AM   #24
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kobayashi, I can see your point, and I will admit that the topic is discomifiting to me. Mainly because it assumes that gay people speak with "gay" voices. I have several gay friends and they don't have that feminine "cutesy" voice at all. So to me, it seems like a stereotype. I also have a few guy friends that are very much straight that speak with a lisp and sound "gay". So I dunno. Seems like a bit of a broad generalization to me.
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Old 01-11-2002, 11:18 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by sulawesigirl4:
kobayashi, I can see your point, and I will admit that the topic is discomifiting to me
that's all i'm askin' for. someone finally threw me a bone!

CK i think muc of the debate surrounding your post stems from the way in which you have framed the question. by beginning the post with a rash generalization such as
Quote:

'You ever hear a guy who sounds completely gay? Its that tone....that just tells you that he's gay.'
you are immediately going to turn off a certain # of people, i guess that is what put me off as well. perhaps if the same question had been stated as your belief that homosexuality is genetic, are then it's extensions that are present within the gay community also genetic?

you are still making the rash generalization in my example but it's not as overt.
this is all rhetoric however since, imo, you have answered the question: working from your basis that homosexuality is genetic and your own admission that you are sure some homosexuals do not have the lisp to which you are referring, would that not prove to you that the lisp then is learned and not genetic?


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[This message has been edited by kobayashi (edited 01-11-2002).]
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Old 01-11-2002, 11:25 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by sulawesigirl4:
kobayashi, I can see your point, and I will admit that the topic is discomifiting to me. Mainly because it assumes that gay people speak with "gay" voices. I have several gay friends and they don't have that feminine "cutesy" voice at all. So to me, it seems like a stereotype. I also have a few guy friends that are very much straight that speak with a lisp and sound "gay". So I dunno. Seems like a bit of a broad generalization to me.

You are absolutley right, we are generalizing here. I'm only commenting on why there is a greater percentage of gay men who have that "feminine 'cutesy' voice" when compared to heterosexual men.

Have you ever met a person who you thought was gay without actually knowing for sure? If you did, how did you come up with that assumption. Was it the way they spoke, acted, dressed, etc. Are those signals being emitted for the purpose to let you or a prospective partner know that they are gay?

CK
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Old 01-11-2002, 11:30 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by kobayashi:

CK i think muc of the debate surrounding your post stems from the way in which you have framed the question. by beginning the post with a rash generalization such as

Quote:
'You ever hear a guy who sounds completely gay? Its that tone....that just tells you that he's gay.


How is a rash generalization if I'm referring to one guy?

CK
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Old 01-11-2002, 12:03 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by TheU2:
[BHow is a rash generalization if I'm referring to one guy?

CK[/B]
i apologize. i didn't realize this is whole discussion was based on one individual who is gay by way of his voice according to you. i assumed your question was rhetorical and we were referring to the gay community.

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[This message has been edited by kobayashi (edited 01-11-2002).]
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Old 01-11-2002, 01:44 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by TheU2:
I'm only commenting on why there is a greater percentage of gay men who have that "feminine 'cutesy' voice" when compared to heterosexual men.CK
Whoa there, sonny! I completely disagree here. I do not believe that the majority of gay men have that voice. Maybe that's just the ones you notice?
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Old 01-11-2002, 02:24 PM   #30
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Well I wasnt going to reply to this. And my initial reaction when I read this thread last nite + Kobayashi's one reply made me feel like I should close it. Only for the reason that TheU2, you have no tact. You really need to work on how you present a question and maybe stop to think that it might indeed offend some people. It's all how you say things, not always what exactly is said.

But since so far it seems the debate is under control, carry on. Just think about what I said for next time please.

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