Gay Coercion?

[Irvine511]

What you and Lies say does make sense. If it is part of the job description than I guess there´s no discussion.

P.S. I have nothing against homosexuals. My problem comes when I thought things were being forced upon others for no reason.

fair enough, and thank you for conceding a point, and i'm sorry if i come off strongly, but i get really exasperated at things like this. we're not talking about forcing a church to marry gay people.

how does a gay pride parade "force" something upon someone?

 

[BrownEyedBoy]

Hmm, it would be kind of like if I were forced to watch a Celine Dion DVD (whom I despise). Constant reminder of something you don´t agree with. You know?

 

[Liesje]

Hmm, it would be kind of like if I were forced to watch a Celine Dion DVD (whom I despise). Constant reminder of something you don´t agree with. You know?

But why would you watch it then? Who's doing the forcing? Just don't watch the movie, or don't attend the parade

 

[Se7en]

so is performing oral sex on a woman!

but you don't see me condemning anyone for it or using various religious texts to justify my own personal tastes or saying that woman have to right to receive, let alone enjoy, having someone perform oral sex on them. in fact, it makes me HAPPY when other people are happy and have fun and feel fufilled even if i think that one specific activity to be a bit of a stomach-turner.

but i suppose we cannot expect straight men to ever have to countenance the toleration of things that they themselves deem to be "gross."

you know i was being facetious, right?

 

[Irvine511]

you know i was being facetious, right?

yes.

was just using it as a jumping off point.

 

[Se7en]

yes.

was just using it as a jumping off point.

(do you like tuna? )

 

[Irvine511]

(do you like tuna? )

i have a whole can of tuna on my salad today. with olive oil and lemon juice and an avacodo.



in all seriousness, i'm so sick of how compelled many straight men feel to express their distaste for homosexual romance/physicality. i'm asking no one to like it. i even understand when people think it's gross. i really do. there are sexual things that i think are gross. but i don't think it's wrong, firstly, and secondly, i don't feel as if my identity is predicated upon just how loudly i can exclaim just how gross i think something is.

 

[Se7en]

in all seriousness, i'm so sick of how compelled many straight men feel to express their distaste for homosexual romance/physicality. i'm asking no one to like it. i even understand when people think it's gross. i really do. there are sexual things that i think are gross. but i don't think it's wrong, firstly, and secondly, i don't feel as if my identity is predicated upon just how loudly i can exclaim just how gross i think something is.

i completely agree,

there are plenty of heterosexual acts that gross me out...

 

[BrownEyedBoy]

 

[JCR]

The part that got me in the article was when they said the firefighters "cannot be SEEN to discriminate." So they can discriminate all they want, just don't be seen doing it!!!!
The analogy with pharmacists refusing to do their job b/c of their personal/religious beliefs is right on target--if you can't put your biases? opinions? views? aside then quit the job (or volunteer position).
It is pretty apparent that the firefighters in question were being homophobic--they had their own little protest (refusing to hand out the leaflets) during the parade and got fired. So their little temper tantrum didn't pay off this time.

p.s. i marinate my tuna, so it's always delicious

 

[phillyfan26]

I don't like tuna.

I wouldn't feel homosexual by going to a parade for my company. Respecting the fact that it exists and that they have the same human rights as others doesn't mean I'm gay. I would go to it, and just do my job. No problems.

 

[BVS]

Hmm, it would be kind of like if I were forced to watch a Celine Dion DVD (whom I despise). Constant reminder of something you don´t agree with. You know?

There's a difference in personal taste(as in not liking Celine Dion) and not agree with something.

 

[80sU2isBest]

Why is a gay pride parade ANY different from ANY other cultural festival?

I guess it depends on what type of gay pride parade you're referring to. The ones that make the news (you know what kind of behavior I'm speaking of) aren't like other cultural festivals. I'm not saying that all gay pride parades are like that. I'm saying that some are, and that those are very different from other cultural festivals.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

The ones that make the news (you know what kind of behavior I'm speaking of) aren't like other cultural festivals. I'm not saying that all gay pride parades are like that. I'm saying that some are, and that those are very different from other cultural festivals.

Well even so, the firefighters still should be there to establish good relations with the community. Whether they're uncomfortable or not. What do they think is going to happen? I would think most of the gay people there have zero interest in "bothering" the firefighters or anyone else, if that's what they're afraid of.

There could be many aspects of other cultural festivals that might be deemed inappropriate or whatever word you want to use by individual firefighters - for personal, moral, or whatever reasons-would they object to leafleting those too?

Is that what it comes down to, that the gay people are acceptable only if they celebrate their pride in a way that is acceptable to straight men-firefighters or otherwise?

 

[Irvine511]

I guess it depends on what type of gay pride parade you're referring to. The ones that make the news (you know what kind of behavior I'm speaking of) aren't like other cultural festivals. I'm not saying that all gay pride parades are like that. I'm saying that some are, and that those are very different from other cultural festivals.

i understand that some aspects of some gay pride parades are different than other cultural festivals (though i would say that Gay Pride in general is losing relevance), but does the celebration of different sexual activities and preferences make it any less cultural?

(seriously, a philosophical question)

 

[80sU2isBest]

Is that what it comes down to, that the gay people are acceptable only if they celebrate their pride in a way that is acceptable to straight men-firefighters or otherwise?

Some of the acts that go on at some of the parades could violate public lewdness laws. Firefighters should not be expected to hand out leaflets at any event that is violating law.

If the parade is not that way, and if the leaflets contain public service info, such as fire safety, then I see no problem expecting firefighters to hand them out.

 

[80sU2isBest]

but does the celebration of different sexual activities and preferences make it any less cultural?

(seriously, a philosophical question)

I would think that the celebration of a sexual preference doesn't need to include the celebration of different sexual activities. If sexual activities are acted out or portrayed or whatever in a public setting, that could violate public lewdness laws.

 

[Irvine511]

Some of the acts that go on at some of the parades could violate public lewdness laws. Firefighters should not be expected to hand out leaflets at any event that is violating law.

If the parade is not that way, and if the leaflets contain public service info, such as fire safety, then I see no problem expecting firefighters to hand them out.

also, just for everyone's clarification, Gay Pride is usually a weekend long event, with a parade followed by a more typical "festival" where there are many booths, food, activities, organizations recruiting members (like a gay rugby team, gay swim team) and it is probably at the "festival" portion of a Gay Pride weekend that the firefighters would be asked to pass out pamphlets, and this is where i got information on the police department in DC and in Arlington, VA.

the parade itself has some people passing out pamphlets, but it is usually of a less serious nature -- i've pamphleted a pride parade, but for a film festival i was helping to promote.

as for the lewdness ... hard to say, though there are cops there and i'm pretty sure everyone is made aware of the laws, but i cannot speak from experience.

 

[JCR]

I would think that the celebration of a sexual preference doesn't need to include the celebration of different sexual activities. If sexual activities are acted out or portrayed or whatever in a public setting, that could violate public lewdness laws.

What about Mardi Gras? Are the hets violating public lewdness laws? or is the celebration of sexual activities reserved for hets only?

 

[80sU2isBest]

What about Mardi Gras? Are the hets violating public lewdness laws? or is the celebration of sexual activities reserved for hets only?

I would never attend Mardi Gras, and it's mainly because of those kinds of things. I think all of those types of public "celebration" are wrong, whether gay or hetero.

 

[JCR]

'kay, thanks 80s, just curious. guess I won't be running into you on any nude beaches!

 

[80sU2isBest]

'kay, thanks 80s, just curious. guess I won't be running into you on any nude beaches!

Nope, that's for sure!

 

[anitram]

also, just for everyone's clarification, Gay Pride is usually a weekend long event, with a parade followed by a more typical "festival" where there are many booths, food, activities, organizations recruiting members (like a gay rugby team, gay swim team) and it is probably at the "festival" portion of a Gay Pride weekend that the firefighters would be asked to pass out pamphlets, and this is where i got information on the police department in DC and in Arlington, VA.

the parade itself has some people passing out pamphlets, but it is usually of a less serious nature -- i've pamphleted a pride parade, but for a film festival i was helping to promote.

as for the lewdness ... hard to say, though there are cops there and i'm pretty sure everyone is made aware of the laws, but i cannot speak from experience.

The Toronto Gay Pride parade is a huge event and it's true, during the week there are tons of different things going on. Like a mini film festival, art galleries that feature works of gay artists, theatre shows, equality panels, and so on. It's just that the only thing you end up seeing on TV are guys in assless pants and that's probably what your average person thinks the pride week is about. The other stuff obviously doesn't get as much coverage.

 

[JCR]

Sooooo, when's the next Toronto Gay Pride parade? It sounds like great fun--I'mmm all over it like stink on a monkey! film? art? theatre? Ah but you can't beat the assless pants! Someone toss me a pair! Any vino at these parades? Does anyone know what goes on with the equality panels? I've done a little free lance journalism, maybe I can cover something other than the assless pants...but man, I really would like to keep them in somehow. Who doesn't LoVe the assless pants?

ANyone/everyone familiar with the works of David Wojnarowicz?