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Old 12-26-2001, 11:38 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by Michael Griffiths:
The real hypocricy for me, is when I hear the church saying that lust is evil, but sex between two, loving, married people okay. Now, does the church really believe that once two people get married, that there are no feelings of lust involved in the sexual act? Do they really believe that a man can "perform" without feeling the slightest bit lustful?
"But I say to you that every one who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart."- Matthew 5:28

Michael,

Jesus makes it clear that lust is the equivolent to sex because all actions begin with the thought and desire to commit them. Lust is often the root of the desire to have sex, but not always, many times sex is motivated by pure love.

He says the problem was not with two married people being unable to keep their hands off of one another, but with those who lusted after those they weren't married to.

That's impossible, you might say. Yes it is, but Jesus' point was to show the depth of humanity's problem with sin and by doing that to accent even further the absolute greatness of God's love and grace.
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Old 12-26-2001, 12:26 PM   #17
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"Greater love than this, he said, no man hath that a man lay down his wife for his friend. Go thou and do likewise."

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Old 12-26-2001, 06:07 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by ocu2fan:
"But I say to you that every one who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart."- Matthew 5:28

Michael,

Jesus makes it clear that lust is the equivolent to sex because all actions begin with the thought and desire to commit them. Lust is often the root of the desire to have sex, but not always, many times sex is motivated by pure love.

He says the problem was not with two married people being unable to keep their hands off of one another, but with those who lusted after those they weren't married to.

That's impossible, you might say. Yes it is, but Jesus' point was to show the depth of humanity's problem with sin and by doing that to accent even further the absolute greatness of God's love and grace.
On the first point you made, I do agree that pure love can motivate someone to have sex, but within the actual sexual act, itself, there has to be some hormonal (physical), psychological, sexual urge to carry it through, surely you must agree. That was my original complaint with what many churches teach: that sexual attraction on its own is evil, and somehow it becomes a non-issue when two people are married, like it just disappears or something. But it is still part of the equation, is it not?
It seems to be swept under the rug, like many other things. I only wish that the Church was more honest about sex. Why be so afraid of something so natural? And people wonder why North American society is immune to scenes of violence and killing (in movies, for example), but is afraid of nudity and anything to do with sex. Maybe the Europeans have it right? Guns are illegal, and gun violence is at a minimum. Teen pregnancy is lower, and they're all very open about sex. Hmmm...


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Old 12-28-2001, 02:47 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by ocu2fan:
Jesus makes it clear that lust is the equivolent to sex because all actions begin with the thought and desire to commit them. Lust is often the root of the desire to have sex, but not always, many times sex is motivated by pure love.
An interesting 20th/21st viewpoint. St. Augustine would have disagreed, though. The mere idea of wanting sex, regardless of motivation, was lust. In his mind, somehow, you were not supposed to even think about your wife while having sex...basically reducing it to the most mindless and banal of reasons: procreation. An idealistic quest of his, but I honestly don't know how he could even expect it to be enforceable.

Quote:
He says the problem was not with two married people being unable to keep their hands off of one another, but with those who lusted after those they weren't married to.
Another interesting 20th/21st century viewpoint. See above.

Quote:
That's impossible, you might say. Yes it is, but Jesus' point was to show the depth of humanity's problem with sin and by doing that to accent even further the absolute greatness of God's love and grace.
I find it interesting how man has chosen to cling to sex taboos, but when it came to His non-violent nature, we have ignored it. That, to me, is the most interesting quirk of all.

Melon

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Old 01-05-2002, 05:41 AM   #20
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my eldest brother actually is a roman catholic priest

he knows every act of love comes from beauty

he is a man himself, he doesn't nesecarely frown upon every act out of lust
but people should be able to control their lusts (in every area, not just sex)

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