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Old 06-08-2005, 08:36 AM   #1
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For Melon and Irvine

Melon and Irvine,

First I want to apologize to both of you for the times I have replied in anger toward you. I don't reach the level that some do, calling people names (and no I'm not talking about you two), but I do go off on angry rants, and invariably, it makes me feel bad when I do that.

Secondly, I'd like to tell you that I have come to an understanding that I didn't have at the beginning of our battles. While I still believe that homosexual relationships are wrong, I can now say that since you don't believe it is, I can understand why you would be so mad at conservative politicians. My equally conservative Christian friend has helped guide me to that realization. She has has this amazing ability to step into other people's shoes, which is a quality I lack. The truth is that if I thought my rights were being denied, I'd be mad, also.

But I would not be honest with you if I didn't offer this bit of what I hope is constructive criticism. The whole thing I have objected to the most in all our battles is that you two keep bringing up your hatred of the religious right, even in conversations that previously didn't deal with the issue. I've got to say, I don't think this is an effective manner of getting your point across. It tends to alienate those you should be trying to reach with your ideas, those of us who disagree. The majority of people in this forum agree with you, so if you keep up the constant, incessant bashing, you're only preaching to the choir. If that's your intention, fine, but don't be surprised if others get upset with you about it, as I have.

I should have just said these things from the very beginning. It is calm, rational, and goes a longer way toward bridging the gap between people who have differing opinions. I couldn't have said some things, because I didn't understand them at first - I learned them. But I should have reacted more calmly; a a caalm word turns away wrath, not anger.
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Old 06-08-2005, 10:31 AM   #2
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Well said
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Old 06-08-2005, 01:01 PM   #3
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Took guts to post this, 80s,
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Old 06-08-2005, 01:37 PM   #4
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Took guts to post this, 80s,
Absolutely.
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Old 06-08-2005, 01:50 PM   #5
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Thanks.

I've been very high-strung and angry lately, and I hate that feeling.
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Old 06-08-2005, 01:55 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by 80sU2isBest
Thanks.

I've been very high-strung and angry lately, and I hate that feeling.
I have felt that way too recently....

Psalms...have helped for some reason.
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Old 06-08-2005, 03:52 PM   #7
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Re: For Melon and Irvine

Quote:
Originally posted by 80sU2isBest
But I would not be honest with you if I didn't offer this bit of what I hope is constructive criticism. The whole thing I have objected to the most in all our battles is that you two keep bringing up your hatred of the religious right, even in conversations that previously didn't deal with the issue. I've got to say, I don't think this is an effective manner of getting your point across. It tends to alienate those you should be trying to reach with your ideas, those of us who disagree. The majority of people in this forum agree with you, so if you keep up the constant, incessant bashing, you're only preaching to the choir. If that's your intention, fine, but don't be surprised if others get upset with you about it, as I have.
Allow me to substitute the phrase "Religious Right" for "homosexuality," and you'll see why most of us have abandoned religion en masse. Rather than accepting us for who we are, a lot of religious folk create these nonsensical arguments that flat-out don't hold up from our side of the aisle.

You cannot reach out to an entity disinterested in compromise or learning. My only solace, apparently, is that people die. And with each day that passes is one day closer to younger generations taking control, the vast majority of who have been able to reconcile faith with reason.

In the meantime, I guess I'll have to continue my solitary study of religion. It's quite satisfying, even if it is a bit too solitary, at times.

Melon
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Old 06-08-2005, 03:57 PM   #8
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The problem is that we seem to have two irreconcilable positions here. I would add my voice to those who thanked 80sU2isBest for posting this thread but I can see Melon's point of view that it is difficult to compromise with people (I don't mean 80s) who say that if you're a homosexual, you are fundamentally 'disordered', as for example the Vatican has said.
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Old 06-08-2005, 04:00 PM   #9
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All I can think of is the fact that Jesus never ever saw a person by thier labels, but by there hearts.

I hope you both can find some comfort somewhere where you both overlap.
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Old 06-08-2005, 07:15 PM   #10
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I think what we all need is a few decent threads without the whole homosexuality debate being thrown into the mix. I support gay rights 110%, but it seems like any thread on anything turns into a gay rights/gay marriage debate. I think we all know where we stand on this issue and it would be nice to have a break.
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Old 06-08-2005, 07:43 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by starsgoblue
All I can think of is the fact that Jesus never ever saw a person by thier labels, but by there hearts.

I hope you both can find some comfort somewhere where you both overlap.
I'll second this post.

Everyone just needs some deep breaths and some stress-free talk and time out and everything . It's nice to see some peace trying to be made here .

Angela
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Old 06-08-2005, 07:55 PM   #12
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Humility is a very valuable virtue.
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Old 06-09-2005, 01:49 AM   #13
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Re: Re: For Melon and Irvine

Quote:
Originally posted by melon

You cannot reach out to an entity disinterested in compromise or learning.
Perhaps not but it is commendable that 80sU2isBest tried.
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Old 06-09-2005, 06:35 AM   #14
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Props to 80'sU2isBest for his heartfelt attempt at reconciliation.

Melon- your only solace is that people die?
Let me commend you on such a positive and progressive outlook to solving such a difficult issue.
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Old 06-09-2005, 09:23 AM   #15
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Nice job 80's.
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