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Old 12-18-2006, 10:11 PM   #196
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Not even confessions are 100%. Ever heard of the Jon Benet Ramsey case?
Or the Boston Strangler.
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Old 12-18-2006, 10:55 PM   #197
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Justin, I simply cannot believe that you would think that a little compensation would be enough for the wrongful murder of an innocent person on death row. I thought you were vehemently against the murder of innocent people, yet these people are ok so long as someone gets some money?

That makes absolutely no sense.
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Old 12-18-2006, 11:59 PM   #198
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


I'm sure you have a point somewhere.
He's a fucking cold blooded murder and her still got off with DNA evidence. Like what you said. It's not always 100%
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Old 12-19-2006, 08:23 AM   #199
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What if the culprit is known to be guilty without a shadow of a doubt? Like a confession or being caught in fraganti? In that 5% of cases what's your case against a death penalty?
"Guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt" is not the burden of proof in the United States. If it was, these arguments would be more credible, but it's not. We don't require absolute proof in any cases, including capital murder cases.
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Old 12-19-2006, 10:49 AM   #200
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Quote:
Originally posted by gherman


He's a fucking cold blooded murder and her still got off with DNA evidence. Like what you said. It's not always 100%
DNA and juries were much different then, he more than likely wouldn't get off today.

Regardless you missed my point.
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Old 12-19-2006, 04:45 PM   #201
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


DNA and juries were much different then, he more than likely wouldn't get off today.

Regardless you missed my point.
Explain to me your point then
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Old 12-19-2006, 04:48 PM   #202
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Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


DNA and juries were much different then, he more than likely wouldn't get off today.

Regardless you missed my point.
Also, its not nessecarilly the DNA evidance. Even then. Even if the DNA is accurate. The fact is that our jury system is messed up. It was the layers and jacked up justice system that got O.J. off.
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Old 12-19-2006, 05:04 PM   #203
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And the celebrity.
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Old 12-19-2006, 05:32 PM   #204
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Originally posted by gherman


Explain to me your point then
My point is that even in the best trials, DNA can be tainted or tampered with and the 99% of accuracy will still never be enough to send someone to death.
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Old 12-19-2006, 05:39 PM   #205
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Originally posted by gherman
The fact is that our jury system is messed up. It was the layers and jacked up justice system that got O.J. off.
The jury didn't make a mistake. Most of the evidence was circumstantial and yes, the prosecution made fatal mistakes. Why does that mean the jury system is what's messed up? Is there a better alternative? We already sent innocent people to prison for capital murder. If we lessen the burden of proof any farther, imagine where we'd end up....

No system can be perfect, just like no evidence can be absolute. Our system works as well as any other alternative.
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Old 12-19-2006, 07:51 PM   #206
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I haven't posted in this thread yet, but I wanted to share an e-mail I received tonight. I thought it was related:

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Opponents of Maryland's death penalty won a big victory today! The Maryland Court of Appeals ruled that, because they weren't developed in compliance with the state's Administrative Procedures Act (APA), Maryland's lethal injection protocol is essentially invalid and must be rewritten. This decision effectively halts all executions in Maryland indefinitely, as redeveloping the procedure will require input from the legislature and attorney general's office, as well as a period of public comment - all long and costly endeavors.

The ruling also further bolsters our collective call for the repeal of Maryland's death penalty. Developing acceptable lethal injection procedures won't be easy and will take lots of our state's resource. The process will also raise complicated questions for medical personnel who might be tapped, as well as others.

Yay!
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Old 12-19-2006, 08:58 PM   #207
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liesje


The jury didn't make a mistake. Most of the evidence was circumstantial and yes, the prosecution made fatal mistakes. Why does that mean the jury system is what's messed up? Is there a better alternative? We already sent innocent people to prison for capital murder. If we lessen the burden of proof any farther, imagine where we'd end up....

No system can be perfect, just like no evidence can be absolute. Our system works as well as any other alternative.
I actually meant the justice system. Typing error. The fact is that people with money and celebrity get off.
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Old 12-19-2006, 09:16 PM   #208
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Quote:
Originally posted by gherman


I actually meant the justice system. Typing error. The fact is that people with money and celebrity get off.
Money and celebrity....or circumstantial evidence and a botched prosecution? Money and celebrity should only cause the jury to make even more damn sure there is no doubt. His case really proves to what extent the burden lies with the prosecution, not the defense.

(for the record, I'm convinced he did it. IMO, innocent people don't lead dozens of police cars down a six-lane highway for a long high speed chase. But, if I sat on that jury based on that trial, I can't say for sure I'd convict...)
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Old 12-19-2006, 09:35 PM   #209
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Quote:
Originally posted by Liesje


Money and celebrity....or circumstantial evidence and a botched prosecution? Money and celebrity should only cause the jury to make even more damn sure there is no doubt. His case really proves to what extent the burden lies with the prosecution, not the defense.

(for the record, I'm convinced he did it. IMO, innocent people don't lead dozens of police cars down a six-lane highway for a long high speed chase. But, if I sat on that jury based on that trial, I can't say for sure I'd convict...)
Yeah, the funny thing about it is that we all KNOW he did it. But based on what? Surely nothing that would hold up in court. We just all FEEL in our guts that he's guilty sumbitch who managed to get away with it. And his latest attempt at a book only confirms our suspicisons. But none of that could ever be considered any real evidence.

(And I say this as someone who also believes he's guilty).
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Old 12-19-2006, 09:44 PM   #210
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I oppose the death penalty, largely because I believe humans don't have the moral authority to end the lives of other humans and because of the possiblity of executing innocent people.

The second argument is the stronger one for me, because I could see an argument where sometimes the ending of human life is necessary (as in warfare, some cases of abortion, and perhaps even the death penalty etc). However when it becomes necessary, I think it would be important to recognize the tremendous cost, not only to the person whose life is lost, but also to those that take the life. Taking a human life is always wrong, and even when it is "necessary", I believe there are huge costs to those who do it. What I find particularly reprehinsible is the glee that so many death penalty supporters take in the death of the criminal. The whole "let em fry, hang 'em high" celebrating-the-death-of-the-criminal mentality is really disturbing.

If you're going to support the death penalty, at least recognize the magnitude of what you're doing, the severity and finality of it, and have the appropriate solemnity about it. The taking of another human life is serious, ugly business and should be treated as such.
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