Fairy Tales Linked To Violent Relationships

[MrsSpringsteen]

LONDON (AFP) - Young girls who enjoy classic romantic fairy tales like "Cinderella" and "Beauty and the Beast" are at greater risk of becoming victims of violent relationships in later life, a British researcher says.

A study of both parents of primary school children and women who have been involved in domestic abuse claims than those who grew up reading fairy tales are likely to be more submissive as adults.

Susan Darker-Smith, a graduate student who wrote the academic paper, said she found many abuse victims identified with characters in famous children's literature and claimed the stories provide "templates" of dominated women.

A more senior academic at the University of Derby said the topic was sure to spark debate but merited further research.

"They believe if their love is strong enough they can change their partner's behaviour," Darker-Smith said. "Girls who have listened to such stories as children tend to become more submissive in their future relationships."

The research, conducted in Leicester in the east of England, is to be presented to the International Congress of Cognitive Therapy in Gothenburg, Sweden, next month.

Her study, entitled "The Tales We Tell Our Children: Overconditioning of Girls to Expect Partners to Change", will be discussed by many of the world's most influential therapists.

Darker-Smith said she believed younger generations exposed to television and other entertainment media may react differently and be less submissive than those weaned solely on literature.

Her work found the most popular bedtime stories for girls were "Cinderella" and "Rapunzel", while boys were more likely to hanker for "Paddington Bear" or "Thomas the Tank Engine".

Darker-Smith, a masters student in cognitive behavioural psychotherapy at the University of Derby, will also submit other abstracts to the conference, examining ideas about anorexia and post-traumatic stress disorder.

Michael Townend, senior lecturer in psychotherapy at the university said: "We know that storytelling is an important way that children form beliefs about themselves and relationships."

"Susan's work is an interesting study which is sure to spark debate, but further research is required in this area."

 

[MadelynIris]

BS

 

[BonosSaint]

Interesting. There is a passivity inherent in those stories--that all girls need is to be saved by a prince.

Me, I favor the Brothers Grimm

 

[A_Wanderer]

I like the mentions of Thomas the Tank Engine and Paddington Bear ~ they were both my favourites as a kid, in addition to Transformers and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles

 

[Anthony]

What a fascinating thread. I am absolutely OBSESSED with fairy tales and how they influence the modern psyche. And they do, you know. Maybe that could be another thread?

Concerning this one, I'm not surprised. Its common sense that a woman will probably hang around a no-good wife-beater if she believed that a) her prince in shining armour will eventually come along to rescue her or b) that this deadbeat IS her knight in shining armour.

I too have always adored Brothers Grimm fairy tales... I adore how wonderfully sinister and grotesque they are, and yet, we have this insane notion that they're all 'nice' tales.

Fascinating subject.

Ant.

 

[Macfistowannabe]

I don't know that it has a LOT to do with being submissive -- with the exception of Beauty and the Beast, but probably more with being a dreamer. They might be led to believe that they either have the perfect man, or that there are few if any good men, most of them all taken.

 

[dandy]

this is something i've thought for a long time. the message in these stories sets out societal ideals of how a woman should be--the helpless innocent maiden who needs a big strapping man to rescue her. they fall madly in love and live happily ever after.



sure, they're fantasies, meant to be taken with a grain of salt, but that underlying premise that women should be a certain way and need a knights in shining armour to rescue them and make them happy and complete seeps into the minds of little readers, planting pre-conceived notions of unrealistic and even dangerous gender roles.

 

[Abomb-baby]

Oh God, now we're attacking FAIRY TALES. Will this PC Bullshit ever end?

 

[melon]

Oh God, now we're attacking FAIRY TALES. Will this PC Bullshit ever end?

I ask the same question over small-mindedness and intolerance in America.

Of course, "fairy tales" are merely scraping the bottom of the barrel. You'll find this same kind of expected behavior in TV and film, which are mimicking "fairy tales" in themselves.

I mean, really. Guys are told that "no" means "playing hard to get" and female heroines are expected to break down and cry, waiting for a man to give her that "boost" to save the day.

Melon

 

[U2democrat]

of all the female characters that i was introduced to as a kid princess leia was always my favorite

she was a good strong woman

 

[Anthony]

This is really a very interesting topic, and I could rant on about it for days - but I don't have time at the moment. In my defence though, I'm not 'attacking' fairy tales at all really, its more nuanced than that. And I wouldn't call myself or my approach to life PC either.

Ant.

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

...

Funny...I read fairy tales all the time as a kid, and I was in a non-abusive relationship, and hang out with guys who would never dream of hurting women. How'd I manage that?

Yeah...I don't agree with that statement at all. They're fairy tales. Nobody ever said you had to live that kind of life. There's many reasons why women get into abusive relationships...but I wouldn't say that fairy tales are one of them.

Angela

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

I don't know, maybe the fairy tales are part of a larger way certain parents raise their girls-to be more submissive, to be deferential to men, etc..or to think they can change the "bad boy" like it says in the article. After all, how do you explain all the women who are writing to and asking to visit Scott Peterson?

 

[Ft. Worth Frog]

of all the female characters that i was introduced to as a kid princess leia was always my favorite

she was a good strong woman

And looked great in a slave costume

 

[A_Wanderer]

of all the female characters that i was introduced to as a kid princess leia was always my favorite

she was a good strong woman

Princess Leia versus Marion Ravenwood, hmmm Marion every time.

 

[Liesje]

Isn't the first thing they teach you in intro to psych "correlation does not prove causation"?

 

[Saracene]

I don't know how much influence the fairy tales really have, but the bit about female passivity in many of them is definitely there. Personally as a kid I always preferred heroines like Gerda in Andersen's "Snow Queen" - she was NO pushover. I started to think about the fairy tales in a more critical light after reading Terry Pratchett's "Witches Abroad"; he does a great job of parodying fairy tales and their conventions. As one of the characters remarks, just because a guy can hack heroically through the bush and kiss a sleeping princess doesn't mean he's going to be a good husband.

It's funny, I knew a person once who was convinced that Cinderella was in fact a scheming little girl who knew very well how to keep a man hooked... running away oh so mysteriously and conveniently leaving a shoe behind and all,

 

[U2democrat]

Princess Leia versus Marion Ravenwood, hmmm Marion every time.

right! marion was awesome.

ever notice how my favorite female characters play opposite your favorite male characters?

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

In regards to the "females being passive" thing in the stories...course, then again, you gotta consider the time period a lot of these stories were written in. At that time, that is genuinely what people believed. Do I agree women should be passive? Uh, well, speaking as a woman, I'd definitely say no. But that's what the time period was like. Those stories are basically a reflection of a certain time period.

Angela

 

[Bono's shades]

I think blaming fairy tales for women getting into violent relationships is a little bit simplistic. I think the kind of family you are brought up in has a lot more to do with it. A girl who grows up with a father who doesn't treat females respectfully would be more likely to marry a guy like that because she would think that's "normal."

 

[sharky]

This is quite interesting. While I don't think this is just an A then B scenario, it does allude to a characteristic of someone who has bigger issues. It's as if the woman in that relationship as an adult doesn't want to live in reality and therefore falls back onto the submissive stereotype. That being said, how many women want to marry a guy like Lloyd Dobler, standing under our winder wooing us with a stereo playing "In Your Eyes" or wishing our lives were as romantic as those in a Sandra Bullock movie? How do you view a 25-year-old woman who has decided to have a Disney/Cinderella themed wedding? Same thing, different age level.

I don't think the fairy tales are causing the problem. But if you have a girl who won't let go of that fairy tale mentality when she gets older, that's where the problem lies. And you have to remember that as the girl gets older, the Cinderella story turns into a crush on the Backstreet Boys which turns into an obsession with chick flicks and chick lit which turns into a warped belief in how an adult relationship should be. The interesting thing would be to see what happens to the girls who liked fairy tales as kids, but are not in abusive relationships. What changed as they grew up to get them out of that mentality?

 

[verte]

Think about the fact that we, in the U.S. at any rate, live in an escapist culture. Some people fantasize about being rescued from some cruel fate by a prince or knight in shining armor.

 

[sharky]

Think about the fact that we, in the U.S. at any rate, live in an escapist culture. Some people fantasize about being rescued from some cruel fate by a prince or knight in shining armor.

Or being rescued by Tom Cruise, George Clooney or Ben Affleck. And seriously, who do you think reads those trashy Fabio books -- people in stable or unstable relationships? As I said, different age, same issue.

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

I think blaming fairy tales for women getting into violent relationships is a little bit simplistic. I think the kind of family you are brought up in has a lot more to do with it. A girl who grows up with a father who doesn't treat females respectfully would be more likely to marry a guy like that because she would think that's "normal."

Exactly.

Angela

 

[Liesje]

This thread just got me thinking about how maybe sometimes we're correlating things incorrectly. Let me offer a different example: many people believe there is a correlation between doing gymnastics for 40 hours a week and having stunted growth/puberty. The truth is that by the time girls train 40 hours a week, the ones capable of doing so typically ARE smaller and develop later on. Studies have shown that looking at the genes of the mother is the best indicator, not how much the training stunts growth.

The point? Maybe this thread is backwards. I've never had any interest whatsoever in "fairy tale" princesses that are being described here as weak and submissive. So, what if girls that are already predisposed to being victims of violent relationships are more likely to be interested in these fairy tale princesses? That makes more sense to me.

 

[beau2ifulday]

So, what if girls that are already predisposed to being victims of violent relationships are more likely to be interested in these fairy tale princesses? That makes more sense to me.

It makes more sense in general - I think it's a natural thing to turn away from reality, or at least the reality of the situation, when faced with any difficult circumstances (for many people, at least). Running with that idea, like the fairy tale princesses, the woman in question would also expect to be 'rescued' at some point, but I guess it is at that point that the fantasy of the situation breaks down.

I'm not sure what I think of that theory anyway - perhaps if the person was fascinated with the early version of fairy tales (Red Cap, etc) then it would seem a little more likely.

 

[verte]

I definitely think that violent behavior takes a predisposition, and the fairy tale link is most likely coincidental. These kids already have all sorts of problems.

 

[nbcrusader]

Is this a surprise? Do not fairy tales and nursery rhymes all have dark undertones?

 

[verte]

I'm not worth a damn at this kind of social science. There is definitely a difference between sociology, where this study comes from, and history, which is my background.

 

[starsgoblue]

Coming from somone who was in an abusive relationship.....I didn't find or stay in one because I watched too many older Disney movies or because I wasn't hugged enough growing up... It was because of one thing: fear. Fear of that one person.