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Old 05-10-2005, 08:02 AM   #16
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Originally posted by melon
Creationism and ID have no scientific basis.
Only to the extent that (i) science will not consider the concept of God and/or (ii) such concepts are beyond our ability to understand through scientific theory.
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Old 05-10-2005, 08:13 AM   #17
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I dont understand why if macroevolution can be taught as fact in school when its not proven, then the alternative side cant be taught as well.
Shouldnt kids be given a choice?
Why are people so afraid to allow this?
As somebody who believes in microevolution but also creationism, should I have been forced to attend classes that taught something that went directly against what I believe in?
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Old 05-10-2005, 09:53 AM   #18
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ID is philosophy, not science. I was a philosophy minor in college. There's nothing wrong with the ID approach, it's just that it doesn't belong in a science class.
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Old 05-10-2005, 10:10 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
Only to the extent that (i) science will not consider the concept of God and/or (ii) such concepts are beyond our ability to understand through scientific theory.
No, it's because science only approaches subjects that can be observed and tested or may be observed and tested. "God" cannot be observed and tested in the concrete realm. It has no place in science class.

Would you support watering down math class with religious precepts? I hear the Bible says "pi" is 3.2, which is wrong.

Melon
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Old 05-10-2005, 10:12 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by u2bonogirl
I dont understand why if macroevolution can be taught as fact in school when its not proven, then the alternative side cant be taught as well.
Shouldnt kids be given a choice?
Why are people so afraid to allow this?
Shintoism holds that the Earth was created with a gigantic penis. Shall we consider that an "alternative theory" for evolution?

No. Creationism and ID aren't even in the realm of "theory," which is a strict scientific definition. Creationism and ID go into the realm of "guessing" with no proof. It has no place in science class. Period.

Quote:
As somebody who believes in microevolution but also creationism, should I have been forced to attend classes that taught something that went directly against what I believe in?
Yes. There is value in understanding mainstream academic knowledge. I took a class in microeconomics that was nothing more than a propaganda class for supply-side economics. Should I have been forced to attend a class that taught something that went directly against what I believe in? Yes. Now I am very well-informed about where supply-side ideology comes from, and I'm able to formulate intelligent criticisms of it.

Melon
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Old 05-10-2005, 12:18 PM   #21
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Originally posted by melon


Shintoism holds that the Earth was created with a gigantic penis.
I have now officially changed my view of how Earth was created.












I'll keep the jokes to myself.
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Old 05-10-2005, 12:39 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon


Shintoism holds that the Earth was created with a gigantic penis. Shall we consider that an "alternative theory" for evolution?

No. Creationism and ID aren't even in the realm of "theory," which is a strict scientific definition. Creationism and ID go into the realm of "guessing" with no proof. It has no place in science class. Period.



Yes. There is value in understanding mainstream academic knowledge. I took a class in microeconomics that was nothing more than a propaganda class for supply-side economics. Should I have been forced to attend a class that taught something that went directly against what I believe in? Yes. Now I am very well-informed about where supply-side ideology comes from, and I'm able to formulate intelligent criticisms of it.

Melon
I think what I gained from attending that class was a stronger belief in what I had believed in to begin with
I also got publicly taunted by my teacher for not believing in what most of the rest of the class believed in. There were a few others but they were too ashamed to speak up

I think Ive abandoned all belief now for the schlong theory
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Old 05-10-2005, 12:58 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by u2bonogirl
I think what I gained from attending that class was a stronger belief in what I had believed in to begin with
I also got publicly taunted by my teacher for not believing in what most of the rest of the class believed in. There were a few others but they were too ashamed to speak up
Well, it is science class. As long as you don't intend to have a career in biology, then it really doesn't matter if you disagree with evolution, ultimately. But now you know what science believes when it comes to the creation of life, and there is some value in that.

I still greatly believe that it would be a huge mistake to taint science with religious tenets. It would be a disaster.

Melon
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Old 05-10-2005, 01:02 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon


Well, it is science class. As long as you don't intend to have a career in biology, then it really doesn't matter if you disagree with evolution, ultimately. But now you know what science believes when it comes to the creation of life, and there is some value in that.

I still greatly believe that it would be a huge mistake to taint science with religious tenets. It would be a disaster.

Melon
Theres no way Im going into science. Im too bad at math

I guess I see more reason in creationism than the big bang or darwinism, or anything like that.
Even if I didnt believe in God I think I would still find more reason in it.
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Old 05-10-2005, 01:10 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by u2bonogirl
I guess I see more reason in creationism than the big bang or darwinism, or anything like that.
Even if I didnt believe in God I think I would still find more reason in it.
I believe in God, and I think it makes infinitely more sense than creationism does. When I see such mathematical order in "chaos," it's a lot more beautiful to me.

Melon
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Old 05-10-2005, 03:05 PM   #26
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I think that ID/Creationism has no place in school at all. I think it is up to the parents of children to teach about creationsim, at home. If your doing your job as good parents, your kids should believe you more than some pin-head biology teacher. Its up the family to enoforce beliefs, not schools.
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Old 05-10-2005, 05:34 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


Only to the extent that (i) science will not consider the concept of God and/or (ii) such concepts are beyond our ability to understand through scientific theory.
Nobody in the history of the world has been able to come up with an empirical test for the existence of God, hence as an element God is unfalsifiable and therefore having God or any unfalsifiable being in the equation makes it unscientific.
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Old 05-10-2005, 05:52 PM   #28
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my own personal belief is that god created evolution, and that the creationism story is symbolic for what really happened. so, i accept both the scientific and religious theories. however, my own personal belief is that if people want to learn creationism, go to sunday school.
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Old 05-10-2005, 06:13 PM   #29
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It takes a lot of faith not to believe in a God.

It takes a lot of faith to believe in a God.
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Old 05-10-2005, 06:23 PM   #30
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It takes a lot of faith not to believe in a God.

It takes a lot of faith to believe in a God.
tis true
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