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Old 10-18-2006, 12:10 PM   #16
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also, since this is a much wider discussion that has nothing to do with technical issues, i think this thread should be moved back, or maybe to FYM.
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Old 10-18-2006, 12:14 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Man
The Gap is only donating 50% from their sales of RED products.

There's no way Apple could donate 50% of the sales from iPods, not even if they wanted to.

Also, it is quite funny how easily Gap has improved their image now, apparently. Has anyone read Naomi Klein's No Logo? Her description of the way The Gap has made their money isn't nice at all, I tell you. Slave factories all over South East Asia, children down to the age of eight working there, the workers are not allowed to leave the factory, payment that they cannot even pay their food with...

Have you guys considered that The Gap is doing this because they have an image problem that Apple doesn't have?
Yes - Apple is donating 5% of sales from the one RED iPod nano only. And obviously the shirt has a higher profit margin than an iPod. However, iPod accessories have a very high margin.

Apple does in fact have its own labor controversy with iPods - just search the net for "ipod labor"
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Old 10-18-2006, 12:45 PM   #18
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all major multinational companies have had controversies and image problems, whether that's abusing their workers, polluting or cooperating with brutal regimes. However, I do think that among the general public, the textile industry has a bigger image problem than Apple.

But of course, Apple is doing this to improve their image and sell more products too. That's the idea of the Red campaign, so you cannot blame any of these companies. If you think their agenda is way too palpable, you can choose not to buy their products. Any other kind of attempt at intervening in their decision process is silly, imo.
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Old 10-18-2006, 01:21 PM   #19
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That's the idea of the Red campaign, so you cannot blame any of these companies. If you think their agenda is way too palpable, you can choose not to buy their products. Any other kind of attempt at intervening in their decision process is silly, imo.
Although I won't be participating in a campaign, I support the rights of others to do so. That's how change occurs frequently - by letting one's opinion be known. I see nothing wrong with telling one's opinion to politicians, corporations, etc.
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Old 10-18-2006, 01:37 PM   #20
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well, yes. if you want to protest a company's abusing of workers, polluting, or cooperating with dictators. in this case, protesting publicly or privately would even be the right thing to do. but we were talking about their decision about how much to donate to a charity organization. and that is indeed their own decision.
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Old 10-18-2006, 03:13 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Man
also, since this is a much wider discussion that has nothing to do with technical issues, i think this thread should be moved back, or maybe to FYM.
Well, it really has nothing to do with U2, so I don't want to put it back in EYKIW...but I like the FYM suggestion.
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Old 10-18-2006, 05:58 PM   #22
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I'm just glad that Apple is participating.
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Old 10-18-2006, 06:01 PM   #23
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I'm just glad that Apple is participating.
They should - it adds to their bottom line.
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Old 10-18-2006, 06:35 PM   #24
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They should - it adds to their bottom line.
Right. Personally, I am fine with them contributing "only" $10 per iPod. The POINT of (RED) was to establish a model that proves you CAN be profitable while still being charitable and practicing fair trade. There are already gazillions of companies that do things like sell products made by poor craftsmen and women in Africa and Asia and then donate most of the profits back into charities and relief programs. Our church has had a store like this for over a decade now. (RED) is different because making profit is one of the goals.

Personally, I'd like to see them eventually move away from the novelty items and into consumable goods markets. It may not seem like it on a U2 forum, but MOST people were not going to already buy expensive clothes from the Gap, $200 sun glasses, or yet another iPod. How about the stuff we really do buy for use on a daily basis?
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Old 10-18-2006, 06:40 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Man
Also, it is quite funny how easily Gap has improved their image now, apparently. Has anyone read Naomi Klein's No Logo? Her description of the way The Gap has made their money isn't nice at all, I tell you. Slave factories all over South East Asia, children down to the age of eight working there, the workers are not allowed to leave the factory, payment that they cannot even pay their food with...
Okay good I'm glad someone else remember this. I was really thrown when I found out GAP was participating, (LOVE No Logo, btw). I remember the boycotts and protests quite well. I haven't shopped there in ages.

But I guess I can't criticize them for wanting to change their ways.
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Old 10-18-2006, 06:41 PM   #26
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Okay good I'm glad someone else remember this. I was really thrown when I found out GAP was participating, (LOVE No Logo, btw). I remember the boycotts and protests quite well. I haven't shopped there in ages.

But I guess I can't criticize them for wanting to change their ways.
Yeah, I was originally very surprised as well. I remember calling them hypocrites. A friend told me they've been cleaning up their act for the past few years, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt.
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Old 10-18-2006, 09:24 PM   #27
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Originally posted by LivLuvAndBootlegMusic


Right. Personally, I am fine with them contributing "only" $10 per iPod. The POINT of (RED) was to establish a model that proves you CAN be profitable while still being charitable and practicing fair trade.
But RED didn't necessarily pioneer that approach. 3M has had the campaign with pink notes for breast cancer research for example. Although they donate a portion of sales, it has increased the bottom line for 3M quite a bit. $10 is better than nothing, but the issue I have with it is that they receive more than that amount back in free advertising, a free Bono endorsement (any company would pay millions for that), and increased iPod/accessory sales, while trying to establish a caring, charitable image. Some have asked why consumers don't just donate to the charity. The same should be asked of the corportations - why they need to tie their contributions to associations with hip celebrities and product sales.
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Old 10-19-2006, 11:54 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by ntalwar


But RED didn't necessarily pioneer that approach. 3M has had the campaign with pink notes for breast cancer research for example. Although they donate a portion of sales, it has increased the bottom line for 3M quite a bit. $10 is better than nothing, but the issue I have with it is that they receive more than that amount back in free advertising, a free Bono endorsement (any company would pay millions for that), and increased iPod/accessory sales, while trying to establish a caring, charitable image. Some have asked why consumers don't just donate to the charity. The same should be asked of the corportations - why they need to tie their contributions to associations with hip celebrities and product sales.
Apple doesn't email us asking us to donate anything.
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Old 10-19-2006, 12:00 PM   #29
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Quote:
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They should - it adds to their bottom line.


but that's the whole idea of the RED campaign!
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Old 10-19-2006, 12:03 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by ntalwar


But RED didn't necessarily pioneer that approach. 3M has had the campaign with pink notes for breast cancer research for example. Although they donate a portion of sales, it has increased the bottom line for 3M quite a bit. $10 is better than nothing, but the issue I have with it is that they receive more than that amount back in free advertising, a free Bono endorsement (any company would pay millions for that), and increased iPod/accessory sales, while trying to establish a caring, charitable image. Some have asked why consumers don't just donate to the charity. The same should be asked of the corportations - why they need to tie their contributions to associations with hip celebrities and product sales.
But how would they get around that? The campaign was Bono's idea, but you'd rather he not endorse it?
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