Effectiveness of Gun Control?

[A_Wanderer]

The report by two Australian academics, published in the British Journal of Criminology, said statistics gathered in the decade since Port Arthur showed gun deaths had been declining well before 1996 and the buyback of more than 600,000 mainly semi-automatic rifles and pump-action shotguns had made no difference in the rate of decline.

The only area where the package of Commonwealth and State laws, known as the National Firearms Agreement (NFA) may have had some impact was on the rate of suicide, but the study said the evidence was not clear and any reductions attributable to the new gun rules were slight.

"Homicide patterns (firearm and non-firearm) were not influenced by the NFA, the conclusion being that the gun buyback and restrictive legislative changes had no influence on firearm homicide in Australia," the study says. . . .

The significance of the article was not who had written it but the fact it had been published in a respected journal after the regular rigorous process of being peer reviewed, she said.

Politicians had assumed tighter gun laws would cut off the supply of guns to would-be criminals and that homicide rates would fall as a result, the study said. But more than 90 per cent of firearms used to commit homicide were not registered, their users were not licensed and they had been unaffected by the firearms agreement.

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[dazzlingamy]

Well i'd still raher live in a country where owning a gun is illigal then in a country where its not.

Gun control is effective, it takes a weapon of death out of the hands of idiots and puts it into the hands of expert people. Sure there are some black market or stolen ones, but there are always a few bad apples no matter where you are.

 

[A_Wanderer]

What these studies show is that it takes the guns out of the hands of responsible registered legal owners and leaves them in the hands of idiots.

 

[dazzlingamy]

Hardly I believe. I'd rather no guns at all, every gun in australia melted down, and no guns coming in to australia, but this is the best we can do i guess.

 

[A_Wanderer]

I think that Switzerland offers an example of high rates of responsible gun ownership; gun violence is a function of a crime rate and that has more to do with socio-economic factors than the right of citizens to undergo background checks and own registered fireams.

 

[BVS]

But how many guns were taken out of circulation, not just legal hands?

 

[80sU2isBest]

But how many guns were taken out of circulation, not just legal hands?

It's a heck of a lot easier and less dangerous to take guns out of law-abiders hands' than it is to take them out of the hands of law-breakers.

 

[BVS]

It's a heck of a lot easier and less dangerous to take guns out of law-abiders hands' than it is to take them out of the hands of law-breakers.

No doubt, but that's not what I asked. This is what many pro-gun activists don't get. The guns on the black market are guns manufactured by legal manufacturers. For gun control to really work, they all need to be controlled not just the legally owned guns.

 

[80sU2isBest]

No doubt, but that's not what I asked. This is what many pro-gun activists don't get. The guns on the black market are guns manufactured by legal manufacturers. For gun control to really work, they all need to be controlled not just the legally owned guns.

Those who are against unreasonable gun control do get that point; in fact, that's the point we make. As you said, for gun control to really work, they all need to be controlled not just the legally owned guns. We add the point that it can't be done. Guns will never be eliminated from bad guys' hands, even if you shut down every legal manufactuing plant in the US. People will still get guns from other soyurces, including the ability to make guns themselves.

 

[BVS]

Those who are against unreasonable gun control do get that point; in fact, that's the point we make. As you said, for gun control to really work, they all need to be controlled not just the legally owned guns. We add the point that it can't be done. Guns will never be eliminated from bad guys' hands, even if you shut down every legal manufactuing plant in the US. People will still get guns from other soyurces, including the ability to make guns themselves.

Guns will never be eliminated because there are too many with big pockets that don't want them eliminated.

And yeah I really don't see street gangs in inner cities having the abilities to manufacture guns.

 

[80sU2isBest]

And yeah I really don't see street gangs in inner cities having the abilities to manufacture guns.

Not on a large scale, but they can certainly make dangerous guns and explosives on their own.

 

[BVS]

Not on a large scale, but they can certainly make dangerous guns and explosives on their own.

If we get to this point we have really fucked up. If inner-city kids living in the ghetto get to the point where they can manufacture their own guns then law enforcement and pro-gun nuts have screwed this country.

 

[A_Wanderer]

Guns are also manafactured outside the USA, believe it or not, and it can be lucrative to import them illegally for profit

 

[80sU2isBest]

If we get to this point we have really fucked up. If inner-city kids living in the ghetto get to the point where they can manufacture their own guns then law enforcement and pro-gun nuts have screwed this country.

Explain this, please. Explain how someone making his own gun can be blamed on law enforcement.

 

[80sU2isBest]

Guns are also manafactured outside the USA, believe it or not, and it can be lucrative to import them illegally for profit

It certainly is.

 

[BVS]

Guns are also manafactured outside the USA, believe it or not, and it can be lucrative to import them illegally for profit

And that's why I included LAW ENFORCEMENT...

 

[redhotswami]

Not on a large scale, but they can certainly make dangerous guns and explosives on their own.

What in the world? How? And with what resources??? The closest thing I've seen to homemade explosives in my inner city is diet coke & mentos rockets. How many of your guns were made in the basement of one of the projects downtown?

 

[80sU2isBest]

What in the world? How? And with what resources??? The closest thing I've seen to homemade explosives in my inner city is diet coke & mentos rockets. How many of your guns were made in the basement of one of the projects downtown?

Type in "homemade guns" in Google.

 

[redhotswami]

Type in "homemade guns" in Google.

Wow what a novel idea. Gee thanks I would've never thought of that.
I'm not saying they don't exist. My point is I'm not seeing them being made in the inner city projects. The notion of homemade guns appeals to a different demographic.

 

[BVS]

Type in "homemade guns" in Google.

Where are the parts coming from? These aren't people casting their own metal and parts.

Come on...

 

[80sU2isBest]

I'm not saying they don't exist. My point is I'm not seeing them being made in the inner city projects. The notion of homemade guns appeals to a different demographic.

Whether people in the "inner city projects" make their own guns or not, what does that have to do with the argument that people will make their own guns even if all the manufacturing plants in the US are shut down?

The people in the inner city projects aren't the only people who use guns in crimes, of course.

 

[80sU2isBest]

Where are the parts coming from? These aren't people casting their own metal and parts.

Come on...

So you're going to outlaw every metal tube that could possibly be used as a gun barrel?

Come on...

If you think that outlawing guns in the country would actually stop people from obtaining guns and using them in crimes, you are mistaken. Akll it would do is leave the law-abiders defenseless in their own homes.

 

[80sU2isBest]

Where are the parts coming from? These aren't people casting their own metal and parts.

Come on...

They are often made from common items. Just as an example, have you ever heard of a potato gun? That's very dangerous.

Are you going to outlaw metal tubes, because someone could use it as a gun barrel?

Come on...

If you think that outlawing guns in the country would actually stop people from obtaining guns and using them in crimes, you are mistaken. All it would do is leave the law-abiders defenseless in their own homes.

 

[BVS]

So you're going to outlaw every metal tube that could possibly be used as a gun barrel?

Come on...

If you think that outlawing guns in the country would actually stop people from obtaining guns and using them in crimes, you are mistaken. Akll it would do is leave the law-abiders defenseless in their own homes.

You are right in the sense that outlawing guns will not take weapons out of the hands of criminals. But no one will be manufacturing assault rifles or automatic weapons in their basements.

 

[BVS]

They are often made from common items. Just as an example, have you ever heard of a potato gun? That's very dangerous.

Yes, I've built one before. Do you know the accuracy of a potato gun? Do you know how easy it is to conceal one? Do you know the death rate?

answers: sucks, impossible, and very small...

 

[BVS]

All it would do is leave the law-abiders defenseless in their own homes.

Do you know the success rate of law abiding citizens who've defended themselves with a firearm?

 

[80sU2isBest]

Do you know the success rate of law abiding citizens who've defended themselves with a firearm?

Do you?

And what do you call success?

I'd call success "not being killed".

And I think you'd have a much better chance of "not being killed" by an attacker if you had a gun rather than if you didn't.

 

[BVS]

I'd call success "not being killed".

Well of course, and the numbers are small, for most attacks are surprises and reaction time is slow.

And I think you'd have a much better chance of "not being killed" by an attacker if you had a gun rather than if you didn't.

This is a misconception, for a gun in your hand will just raise the adreneline in the attacker causing them to shoot first most times.

 

[redhotswami]

All it would do is leave the law-abiders defenseless in their own homes.

I don't think this is all gun control will do. I don't share the same sentiments of paranoia and hopelessness for humanity.

 

[Liesje]

Personally, I think someone who needs to own a gun (a gun meant to kill a person, I'm not talking about hunting rifles) to feel safe and protect themselves is actually in FAR more danger than those who don't. Those guns get stolen, they mis-fire, kids play with them and end up dead, you name it.

In my experience, it's the people who aren't interested in advocating for the right to protect oneself with lethal force who get screwed. It's little kids who are just playing but then someone gets shot. It's not fair. If there isn't a way to be SURE that these types of weapons are ONLY kept by resposible people who have a need for them (law enforcement), then they need to go away. Also, of all the relatives I have who are raging pro-gunners, I've never met one who actually owns one or has even fired one or even would know how to fire one.

I agree w/ redhotswami. I grew up in the inner-city and I've never heard of the gangs actually manufacturing their own guns. Molotov Cocktails, yes, but guns, never.

On the street where I grew up, a kid shot and killed his 4 year old cousin. If I could go back and give up my right to own assault weapons so that that could've been prevented, I'm fine with it.

I'm all for the peoples' right to own hunting weapons, as long as they are strictly regulated. Hell, I'd even suppot a law that required them to be kept in certified, locked gun cabinets (where most responsible hunters keep them anyway). These aren't the types of weapons being used by people to kill other people.