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Old 07-24-2002, 02:58 AM   #16
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What a bunch of assumptions. None of us have an idea of the man's intelligence. Have we done an IQ test like z edge suggests? No, I think not, same goes for other members of the forum. Grand sweeping generalisations about people's intelligence.
Oh, unless of course we are simply talking about this silly and ridiculous question Bush asked...Yes, saying something stupid. We have all done that. Lets not assume we can gauge someone's intellectual capacity based on saying something stupid. It is something everyone does.
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Old 07-24-2002, 03:34 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by Angela Harlem
What a bunch of assumptions. None of us have an idea of the man's intelligence. Have we done an IQ test like z edge suggests? No, I think not, same goes for other members of the forum. Grand sweeping generalisations about people's intelligence.
Oh, unless of course we are simply talking about this silly and ridiculous question Bush asked...Yes, saying something stupid. We have all done that. Lets not assume we can gauge someone's intellectual capacity based on saying something stupid. It is something everyone does.
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Old 07-24-2002, 11:21 AM   #18
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Let's be realistic here people. This is not an isolated incident. He's said countless things that were either totally ignorant, or totally wrong. When asked about a website making fun of him, he said "There ought to be limits on freedom"... this is the same guy fighting the "War on Terror" in the name of our great American freedom... when in fact he thinks it should be restricted.

If it was just misprononunciations, that would be one thing (it would still be rather odd for someone who supposedly went to the colleges he did) but his lack of knowledge on the world is alarming. Bubba, trying to find missing hyphens and slight errors is not the same as a man asking questions so ridiciulous that it shocks his peers! It's not like Bush said "I hear you have almost as many blacks as the United States" At least that would have revealed some knowledge that Brazil had a lot of black citizens... but nope, he wasn't even sure if they were in the country... and he asked it in such a junior high way... "do you have blacks, too?" If Bush's only troubles were hyphens and remembering ages, then I would have no trouble with the guy.

But he's supposed to be the most powerful man in the world! I hold him to a much higher standard! Here's a man starting wars, spreading ridiculous propaganda ("you're with us or against us"), yet he doesn't know a thing about the world. He's campaigning across the world, promising to drive out a military group that until recently he hadn't heard of (sorry, he had, but he thought they were a band).

Bubba, clearly you're an intelligent man... how can you overlook such glaring ignorance from the leader of your country? Along with the many other shady things surrounding his term so far?

Z Edge, it appears your idea of a response to a challenge is to just laugh as if the other person is wrong. That doesn't cut it in a public forum.
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Old 07-24-2002, 11:24 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by z edge
So, if this is even true, this makes him dumb all of a sudden?
Not all of a sudden...
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Old 07-24-2002, 11:27 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by z edge
So, if this is even true, this makes him dumb all of a sudden?
his dumbness is not an 'all of a sudden' realization for many of us; it's been self-evident for quite some time
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Old 07-24-2002, 11:28 AM   #21
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oops-- didn't see DrTeeth's similar post.

but I am happy to have similar thoughts as the good doc
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Old 07-24-2002, 11:33 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by z edge
So, if this is even true, this makes him dumb all of a sudden?
This is a classic ...
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Old 07-24-2002, 11:46 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by rafmed


This is a classic ...
Yeah Rafi, remember it, copy it, paste it at the right time...
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Old 07-24-2002, 12:23 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by KingPin
Bubba, clearly you're an intelligent man... how can you overlook such glaring ignorance from the leader of your country? Along with the many other shady things surrounding his term so far?
I can overlook such "glaring ignorance" for a couple reasons.

First, I honestly think it's the exception, not the rule - it's simply being overreported. Part of this is a matter of technology: three national cable news networks and the ubiquitious internet.

But I also believe there's a bias on the part of the media: In 92/93, around the time of the inauguration, there was footage of Gore walking around Monticello (Thomas Jefferson's estate). He noticed a couple busts and asked who they were - and they were such inconsequential figures as George Washingtion. Such a faux pas made neither the nightly newscast or the late-night monologue. For certain Repbulicans (first Dan Quayle, now George W. Bush), reporters and commentators seem to look for any and every misstep. Others would have to make a VERY ridiculous claim in a VERY public place and other politicians would have to mention it before it would appear on the radar: see also, Gore's claim to have invented the Internet.

I do believe that President Bush is a very smart man - just not the most well-spoken. Sure, opponents will claim that people write his speeches, and that's true: but I believe, as is the case with MOST politicians, the speechwriters merely crystalize, organize, and strengthen what Bush himself wants to say; and Bush himself has final approval of every speech.

The alternative is ridiculous: it's difficult to suggest without evidence that some writer came up with the politically charged phrase "axis of evil" and Bush just nodded his head and went with it.

The second reason I accept the verbal missteps is that I do believe he's a fairly honest guy. It seems to me that the last President was Bush's opposite in two respects: President Clinton was an undeniably talented speaker but also a congenital liar. Certainly, he lied about his so-called private life, a life that was led in the public offices of the White House, a life he was compelled to explain under Oath; but he also lied about policy. He lied about the state of things ("worst economy in fifty years"), lied about his and his opponents' track records, and lied about what bills did. I was always under the impression that he never made a campaign promise he actually meant; and he met that low expectation.

(The latest edition of Bartlett's collection of well-known quotes contains, I believe, only three Clinton quotes: how he "didn't inhale," how he "didn't have sex with that woman, Miss Lewinsky," and his question about the meaning of the word "is." Granted, none of these were written by speechmakers, but they were all tied to Clinton's efforts to cover his own ass through deception.)

Almost everything Clinton said was witty, but also quite untrustworthy. Bush occasionally misspeaks, but we know what he meant, and I believe he means what he says. Certainly, his track record isn't perfect - particularly in backtracking on his opposition to McCain-Feingold and in his unwillingness to direct the domestic agenda so that he can fulfill his campaign promises - but I still think he's much more trustworthy than Clinton, and I'll take his foibles if that includes his honesty.


Regarding the "many other shady things" surrounding the Bush Administration, the ONLY thing that comes to mind is Enron. Bush knew those who ran Enron - but they were all in the Texas oil business, so that's not surprising. There IS NO evidence of wrongdoing on Bush's part - no evidence that his friendships involved the mishandling of Enron itself.

Sure, the administration could be more forthcoming with its information, but there are precedents for keeping some information internal - and the Democrats can always make efforts to force the White House's hand, and THEY HAVEN'T.

Truth is, Democrats don't want to find out the truth: the appearance of "shady things" is MUCH more politically useful (particularly if the truth is benign), and a thorough investigation is just as likely to cast a bad light on Democrats who are themselves closely tied to Enron - like Bill Clinton.

And another truth is that the Democrats don't even know what to charge Bush with: first, he was supposed to have helped Enron, but his policies did the opposite. Then, the accusation was that his efforts helped sink Enron - THEN the accusation was that, for some odd reason, Bush should have publically told Enron stockholders to sell.

At the moment, the accusations are nothing more than that: accusations, in this case perpurtrated by a party that's still pissed about the election and willing to do practically anything to win back political power.

It's like the accusations about Republicans wanting to kill the elderly and starve children. If the accusations were believable, then we'd have something to discuss. Until that point, they condemn the accusers much more than the accused.
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Old 07-24-2002, 12:30 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by MiniFly
Bush = MORON.

His numb-skullness has overshadowed even Dan Quayle, a truly great feat. This level of indiocy is rivaled, however, by our own Z Edge, who apparently doesn't share political ideologies or intelligence levels with his name sake.
Before you make such a bold statement, pointing out another person's alleged lack of intelligence, you might want to correct your own spelling errors.

Numb-skullness and indiocy are not words.
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Old 07-24-2002, 12:30 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Achtung Bubba


President Clinton was an undeniably talented speaker but also a congenital liar.

I agree with you there, Bubba.
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Old 07-24-2002, 12:39 PM   #27
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Why are we talking about Clinton all of a sudden?
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Old 07-24-2002, 12:42 PM   #28
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As always Bubba show how smart he is, I think is very hard to defend Mr. Bush intelligence (or lack of it), is more easy to attack someone else, I guess we all know who Bill Clinton was. this makes Bush IQ higher?
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Old 07-24-2002, 12:48 PM   #29
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Normal

Historians have let us know President Truman, a Democrat, was known to mangle words and sentence structure.
Made a few verbal blunders here and there
He went down in history as a great President.
So will GW.
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Old 07-24-2002, 12:55 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by rafmed
As always Bubba show how smart he is, I think is very hard to defend Mr. Bush intelligence (or lack of it), is more easy to attack someone else, I guess we all know who Bill Clinton was. this makes Bush IQ higher?
Raf-
Having the highest IQ doesnt necessarily make you the greatest world leader.
Jimmy Carter was brilliant
Bill Clinton was smart/savvy..

GW hs humbling came forward and sad many times he is a "plain speaking man"

This how he KICKED Al Gores ASS in the Presidental Debates..
Al Gore tried to out do himself and W made him his bitch
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