Does Bono even understand how philosophical he can be?

[blueyedpoet]

Okay, I've been working on a couple of things lately. I was raised in a conservative Christian household (dad's a pastor), so naturally I considered myself a republican for most of my youth. Of course, if you asked me about the issues (abortion, death penalty, big business, civil rights etc) I sounded liberal - I just didn't know that most of my stances were at odds with conservatism.
Anyways, last quarter I took a LGBT post-Stonewall literature class because I realized that while I supported "gay rights" I still had residual prejudicial beliefs deep inside. The class, the professor, the students, the reading material, and the lectures and discussions all just blew me away. I learned so much about myself. Additionally, many of my beliefs that I thought were progressive were challenged.
Here's where Bono's lyrics come in:
"We're one, but we're not the same."
After reading Stone Butch Blues, I said in class that the book really made it clear that all of us are just humans. We're one. We all experience pain, heartbreak, failure, success etc. Thus, we are all just the same. We are one! Yay, right?
Through my personal discussions with the professor and some deep soul-searching (and a re-read of the book) I discovered how wrong I was. When I - a heterosexual, white, protestant male - try to label everyone the same, I'm in some ways trying to erase or look past the differences in others. By lumping everyone as one, we don't have to deal with differences that make us uncomfortable.
Racists, homophobes (and I really do believe people in church circles are ignorantly fearful - as sad as that may be), and other hateful groups recognize the differences between different people and despise the differences. Truly progressive people need to appreciate the differences and celebrate the beautiful diversity within our species. Is diversity always going to be easy to celebrate? No, it takes time for people to learn and appreciate one another. This is all really hard work, but we have to do this. The journey must continue.
Isn't it amazing how in the early 90s Bono understood this?

*This is posted in FYM because I want most of the discussion to be about the notion of being the same (one) but different (not the same).

 

[joyfulgirl]

I think that's why Bono says "but we're not the same." My hit on oneness is that we are all one in soul but not in the physical.

 

[joyfulgirl]

Oh, sorry...I missed your last line "... the notion of being the same (one) but different (not the same)." So my post was quite the revelation and really moved the discussion forward, eh?

 

[blueyedpoet]

I am agreeing with Bono's lyrics. One now has a deeper meaning to me.
I like that notion, one in soul but not one in flesh.

 

[djfeelgood]

Bono was no revolutionary for saying this. The idea has been known since the dawn of time that in order to co-exist , we must understand one another and accept each others differences.

 

[blueyedpoet]

Oh, sorry...I missed your last line "... the notion of being the same (one) but different (not the same)." So my post was quite the revelation and really moved the discussion forward, eh?

Of course =)

 

[blueyedpoet]

Bono was no revolutionary for saying this. The idea has been known since the dawn of time that in order to co-exist , we must understand one another and accept each others differences.

I wasn't claiming he was the first.
Has the idea really been around since the dawn of time? Having extensively studied the history of philosophy, I can honestly say that many philosophical positions throughout history have prevented this kind of thinking.

 

[verte76]

I grew up in a very conservative Southern town. The Ku Klux Klan was active in the area. I'm lucky that I had parents who taught me how to respect different people. That line from "One" is priceless, it's absolutely the truth.

 

[blueyedpoet]

Should we tolerate the KKK?
Should we bother to "carry" them?
I'm not sure I know the answers.

 

[verte76]

It depends on what you mean by "tolerating". They have a right to exist. They are U.S. citizens like you and me. Of course that doesn't mean we have to accept their ideas. So no, we don't have to "carry" them. Leave them to their own devices with their fd up ideas.

 

[hiphop]

Bob Marley said it too.

One love! one heart!
Let’s get together and feel all right.
Hear the children cryin’ one love
Hear the children cryin’ , one heart
Sayin’: give thanks and praise to the lord and I will feel all right;
Sayin’: let’s get together and feel all right.

Let them all pass all their dirty remarks, one love
There is one question I’d really love to ask, one heart
Is there a place for the hopeless sinner,
Who has hurt all mankind just to save his own beliefs?

One love! what about the one heart? one heart!
What about - ? let’s get together and feel all right
As it was in the beginning, one love
So shall it be in the end, one heart, all right!
Give thanks and praise to the lord and I will feel all right;
Let’s get together and feel all right.

One more thing!
Let’s get together to fight this holy armagiddyon, one love
So when the man comes there will be no, no doom, one song
Have pity on those whose chances grows tinner;
There ain’t no hiding place from the father of creation.

Sayin’: one love! what about the one heart? one heart
What about the - ? let’s get together and feel all right.
I’m pleadin’ to mankind! one love
Oh, lord! one heart

Give thanks and praise to the lord and I will feel all right;
Let’s get together and feel all right.

 

[nbcrusader]

Should we tolerate the KKK?
Should we bother to "carry" them?
I'm not sure I know the answers.

Demonstrating love does not always mean showing approval.

 

[blueyedpoet]

^ good point

 

[verte76]

Demonstrating love does not always mean showing approval.

I agree.

 

[Liesje]

Demonstrating love does not always mean showing approval.

Just look at MLK.

 

[Irvine511]

i've always taken that line -- probably the line, along with "i still haven't found what i'm looking for," that bono will be most remembered for -- in exactly the same way that you do, only i think it's Bono trying to do that "titanium soul/love" thing. it's one thing to say let's love everybody because we're all human. that's kind of the hippie-dippy thing to say, "smile on your brother/ everybody get together/ try to love one another," but that glosses over real, legitimate differences between races, genders, nations, religions, etc.

it's far more difficult, but ultimately more rewarding, to love people not because of what you have in common but also because of what makes you different.

so, yeah, i agree with you.

 

[blueyedpoet]

it's far more difficult, but ultimately more rewarding, to love people not because of what you have in common but also because of what makes you different.

This has to be one of the best comments made here in FYM. That is so, so true.
If we work at it, the differences can actually serve as a stronger glue connecting us.

 

[Zoomerang96]

Should we tolerate the KKK?
Should we bother to "carry" them?
I'm not sure I know the answers.

noam chomsky would do anything in his power to allow neo-nazi's to demonstrate their belief that the hollocaust never happened.

obviously, as a 7ew, he feels quite differently than they do.

to limit freedom of speach is to not believe in it at all. we 7ust have to hope people respect the responsibility that entails, and that it's not abused solely for the purpose of "excercising their right" to free speech.

i'm not sure i agree with any of you on anything. everyone's different from the next person... but obviously it's to varying degrees. at what degree does someone become "too different" to accept?

it's all about respect. while i'm all for freedom of speech, i believe the line needs to be drawn where imminent and immediate violence is either being provoked, or promoted.

that's almost an ironic statement. maybe i should delete that.

maybe i shouldn't.

i won't.

it's too late. if only people knew what i was trying to say...

 

[blueyedpoet]

yeah, essentially i believe that the only thing a person can't be allowed to say is "fire!" in a crowded theatre (without there being an actual fire).

 

[Se7en]

we're one, and ultimately we are all the same.

 

[blueyedpoet]

^Okay, from the standpoint that are DNA is practically the same, we're one. However, unless we appreciate the differences, ultimately we will not come together as a cohesive group.
Progress isn't looking past the differences, it's celebrating the differences.

 

[Se7en]

why should i have to celebrate that he's black, i'm chinese, and you're latino? why should i have to celebrate that i'm bi, she's gay, and you're straight? these "differences" are exactly what's being used to divide us. we should look past them and realize we are all the same. race, sexuality, etc. should not be a factor in how we relate to each other. obviously we are all different in our own ways...personalities, interests, aptitudes, etc...which is great, no one wants a world of clones. but the more we are able to act as one cohesive group the better off we'll be.

 

[Halifax]

Demonstrating love does not always mean showing approval.

And besides, if we don't let neo-nazi's or the KKK speak, how can we know how rediculous their arguments are?

 

[blueyedpoet]

why should i have to celebrate that he's black, i'm chinese, and you're latino? why should i have to celebrate that i'm bi, she's gay, and you're straight? these "differences" are exactly what's being used to divide us. we should look past them and realize we are all the same. race, sexuality, etc. should not be a factor in how we relate to each other. obviously we are all different in our own ways...personalities, interests, aptitudes, etc...which is great, no one wants a world of clones. but the more we are able to act as one cohesive group the better off we'll be. [/QUOTE

I remember in high school being forced to attend lame cultural awareness assemblies. They were corny and boring. Celebrating diversity, for me, doesn't mean organizing some lame cultural assembly.
What's the point in claiming we are all the same? Are we really? How is my daily life at all similar to a child from northern Uganda who nightly tries to escape being kidnapped by the LRA? How is my relationship the same as a relationship a lesbian might have? She has to face many other obstacles that I can't even fathom. Ignoring the differences will not get us anywhere. It's too hippie. Horrah, horray. Real love is about accepting that there are differences and appreciating the differences. We may not even like some of the differences initially; nevertheless, we still have to carry each other.
What's more amazing and powerful, a group of Christians coming together to fight poverty, or a group of Christians, Hollywood elites, Muslims, Buddhists, Jews etc. coming together to fight poverty?