Dobson and Alito sittin' in a tree ...

[Irvine511]

[q]Dear Dr. Dobson:
This is just a short note to express my heartfelt thanks to you and the entire staff of Focus on the Family for your help and support during the past few challenging months.

I would also greatly appreciate it if you would convey my appreciation to the good people from all parts of the country who wrote to tell me that they were praying for me and for my family during this period.

As I said when I spoke at my formal investiture at the White House last week, the prayers of so many people from around the country were a palpable and powerful force.

As long as I serve on the Supreme Court I will keep in mind the trust that has been placed in me.

I hope that we'll have the opportunity to meet personally at some point in the future.

In the meantime my entire family and I hope that you and the Focus on the Family staff know how we appreciate all that you have done.


Sincerely yours,

Samuel Alito



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/max-blumenthal/alito-sends-james-dobson-_b_16596.html

[/q]



do SCOTUS justices routinely send personal notes of thanks to special interest groups?

 

[nbcrusader]

I would think anyone who undergoes such stressful scrutiny would thank those who offered support.

But, given the nature of the political environment, even simple etiquette is questionable.

 

[Irvine511]

I would think anyone who undergoes such stressful scrutiny would thank those who offered support.

But, given the nature of the political environment, even simple etiquette is questionable.

what special interest groups did Bork thank, personally? RBG? Stephen Breyer? John Roberts?

and of all people ... why Dobson? is this ediquette or quid pro quo?

also, Alito passed through. how stressful could it have been?

 

[nbcrusader]

Quid pro quo? Was there a check with the note?


As for the stress - how could you question a multi-day public interview where your character is targeted as anything but stressful.

Besides, it was reported as such. If Alito's wife leaves in tears, it has got to affect the man himself.

 

[verte76]

Two peas in a pod....................

 

[Irvine511]

Quid pro quo? Was there a check with the note?


As for the stress - how could you question a multi-day public interview where your character is targeted as anything but stressful.

Besides, it was reported as such. If Alito's wife leaves in tears, it has got to affect the man himself.

my understanding was that she left in tears when they were saying nice things about Alito -- she was overcome with emotion because she was so proud of him.

of course it was stressful, but it was hardly a brawl like with Bork.

quid pro quo?

[q]I would also greatly appreciate it if you would convey my appreciation to the good people from all parts of the country who wrote to tell me that they were praying for me and for my family during this period. ... As long as I serve on the Supreme Court I will keep in mind the trust that has been placed in me.[/q]

this was read aloud on Dobson's radio show.

how many dots does one need to connect?

 

[nbcrusader]

If you already know the conclusion you want to draw, why use dots? I mean really, this is some scandelous act? If it was a two page letter, would we get a "Theocracy Watch"?

 

[Irvine511]

If you already know the conclusion you want to draw, why use dots? I mean really, this is some scandelous act? If it was a two page letter, would we get a "Theocracy Watch"?

wow, you're right; this is a perfect example of a THEOCRACY WATCH -- the corruption of various institutions of a secular democracy by deeply conservative religious pressure groups.

is this a scandalous act? no, the letter isn't, in and of itself, even though it is affectionately written to America's most powerful religious fundamentalist who exercises veto power over the administration's social policy initiatives.

the appointing of SCOTUS judges -- and the judge's acknowledgement of just how much help he has received from such groups -- in order to please a particularly powerful pressure group most assuredly is.

the reach and power of Christianism within the Republican party is terrifying.

 

[nbcrusader]

I know the game. As a Christian, I can't deny the terrifying "reach and power" of (whatever you are currently defining as "Christianism" - the word doesn't exist).

And Dobson now has "veto power". I don't remember the constitutional amendment that granted that one. But again, as a Christian, I can't deny it.

 

[Irvine511]

I know the game. As a Christian, I can't deny the terrifying "reach and power" of (whatever you are currently defining as "Christianism" - the word doesn't exist).

i don't know what being a Christian has to do with anything. some of the most ardent defenders of the separation of church and state are devout Christians -- they understand that it is precisely the maintenance of the separation of church and state that enables them to practice their religion as robustly as they see fit.

Christianism is a word that is used in the same way as Islamism is used -- likewise, Christianist and Islamist. essentially, Christianism views Christianity as not only a religion, but also a political system that should govern the legal, economic and social imperatives of the state.

And Dobson now has "veto power". I don't remember the constitutional amendment that granted that one. But again, as a Christian, I can't deny it.

oh come on, the Bushies have never let the Constitution get in their way!

think back to Harriet Miers ...

 

[Irvine511]

a blogger puts it well:

[q]First, Supreme Court Justices should be very careful associating with overtly political entities, and you don't get much more political than Dobson. Secondly, Dobson himself read it out loud on the air to brag of his influence on national affairs. Thirdly, there is more than just a hint of a constitutional quo for a political quid in the letter. That kind of horse-trading undermines the integrity of the court and the impartiality of the justices. Look: I endorsed Alito. But I hoped his jurisprudence would not amount to a carte blanche for whatever the Christianists demand. The letter suggests otherwise.

http://time.blogs.com/daily_dish/
[/q]

 

[nbcrusader]

But I hoped his jurisprudence would not amount to a carte blanche for whatever the Christianists demand. The letter suggests otherwise.

Simple hogwash.

For the sake of political argument, the author simply disregards the ability of a judge to be a neutral arbiter based on a thank you note.

 

[Irvine511]

For the sake of political argument, the author simply disregards the ability of a judge to be a neutral arbiter based on a thank you note.

why did Dobson read this aloud on the air?

 

[nbcrusader]

Would any radio host be happy to receive a note from a Supreme Court Justice?









I can't share the super secret right-wing Christian code words embedded in the letter.....

 

[Irvine511]

I can't share the super secret right-wing Christian code words embedded in the letter.....

why? what else do you know? is this just a decoy? what do they tell you at the meetings?

 

[nbcrusader]

Well, there's the handshake.....




Damn, I've said too much already

 

[Irvine511]

Would any radio host be happy to receive a note from a Supreme Court Justice?

but he uses it as evidence of his enormous weight and influence within the administration itself -- evidently, he's got the proof to back it up.

ask yourself this: would Alito have been the nominee had Bush not gotten the thumbs up from Dobson?

consider:

[q]Jim Dobson, the head of Focus on the Family, who held weekly telephone conversations with Karl Rove during the campaign, has put the President on notice. He told ABC's "This Week" that "this president has two years, or more broadly the Republican Party has two years, to implement these policies, or certainly four, or I believe they'll pay a price in the next election."

http://www.theocracywatch.org/chris_hedges_nov24_04.htm

[/q]

 

[nbcrusader]

There are plenty of people who "put the President on notice" regarding agenda items. Even so, the "notice" you quote refers to the 2008 election ("pay the price in the next election"), not a claim to policy decision making power.

I can't imagine the thank you note constitutes "enormous weight and influence withing the adminstration".

 

[martha]

This shit scares me even more after reading what joyfulgirl posted.

 

[nbcrusader]

Scary thank you notes.

 

[Irvine511]

I can't imagine the thank you note constitutes "enormous weight and influence withing the adminstration".

perhaps the weekly conference calls to Dobson?

perhaps Rove having to "reassure" Dobson over the Miers nomination?

perhaps all the influence that Dobson says he has?

 

[martha]

Yep.

 

[nbcrusader]

perhaps the weekly conference calls to Dobson?

perhaps Rove having to "reassure" Dobson over the Miers nomination?

perhaps all the influence that Dobson says he has?

Pleas to base supporters during an election?

Damage control after Miers nomination is announced?

Self-promoting claims?


Why don't we check Dobson's mail to see who else has been "compromised"???

 

[melon]

I find it disconcerting that a judge, who is supposed to be nonpartisan and non-ideological as designed by the Founding Fathers (since America loves historicist comments like that), is sending such notes to a clearly partisan and highly ideological person like Dobson.

It does beg the question as to whether Alito does intend to "return the favor" in ways that a judge should not. But, since his confirmation was always a formality anyway, I guess we have no choice but to sit back and find out for ourselves.

Melon

 

[verte76]

I find it disconcerting that a judge, who is supposed to be nonpartisan and non-ideological as designed by the Founding Fathers (since America loves historicist comments like that), is sending such notes to a clearly partisan and highly ideological person like Dobson.
Melon

So do I.

 

[nbcrusader]

I find it disconcerting that a judge, who is supposed to be nonpartisan and non-ideological as designed by the Founding Fathers (since America loves historicist comments like that), is sending such notes to a clearly partisan and highly ideological person like Dobson.

Perhaps thanking a partisan group is a reflection of the highly political nature of the confirmation hearings.

It does beg the question as to whether Alito does intend to "return the favor" in ways that a judge should not. But, since his confirmation was always a formality anyway, I guess we have no choice but to sit back and find out for ourselves.

Judicial impartiality is the core of a judge's integrity - something that any judge takes seriously.

I'd worry more about states that require elections for judges. Fundraising to secure a seat on the bench creates far more opportunity to "return the favor" than here in Alito's case.

 

[verte76]

Perhaps thanking a partisan group is a reflection of the highly political nature of the confirmation hearings.



Judicial impartiality is the core of a judge's integrity - something that any judge takes seriously.

I'd worry more about states that require elections for judges. Fundraising to secure a seat on the bench creates far more opportunity to "return the favor" than here in Alito's case.

This is how we ended up with Roy Moore as a judge in Alabama. He was elected in 2000, and he's laughing all the way to the political bank.

 

[Teta040]

Well, I suppose that, 2 yrs from now, when a 14 yr old girl is raped by her sicko father or stepfather and gotten pregnant, and can't get even a first trimester abortion OR has to carry the baby to term and keep it, BECAUSE under federal law any doctor in this land is branded a common criminal for performing ANY abortion and fined $10,000 and sent to prison for 5 yrs, (as is now law in South Dakota), we'll see if Dobson has had any power.

That note read: "You have 2 yrs to overturn Roe, and make the South Dakota law the law of the land, or you will pay the price." Some people, like myself, think the SD law is huge blessing in disguise for the pro-Roe squad, because it is SO draconian there is no realistic way even a moderate conservative on the Court would uphold it, even if he is pro-life, because public opinion is overwhlemingly shades of gray on this. If the SD law were less harsh, it would be a better tool to begin dismantling Roe bit by bit. But this is so harsh that when this case is voted on next yr, if the SD law is the one in question, it might make it easier to uphold Roe. If anyone BUT Alito and Roberts were on the Court, the "shades of gray" forces (the ones of prudence and common sense) might win.

But not with political nutjobs like Dobson behind the curtain. And if you think it;s only notes, you're nuts. How much money did FOTF contribute to the Alito effort?

If you think Bush ( or his appontees) ignores these people when big political questions come up, consider this: in 2003 Israel had captured a major Palestinian suspect (forgot who) and Sharon personally wanted to execute him but changed his mind after Bush informed him of concerns over a new Palestinian intifada. Sharon did an about face and announced the guy would get the harshest punishment without being executed. The Christian Right went ballistic, and bombarded the White House with 100,000 emails in the 24 hrs after this news hit the headlines. Dobson was right in the thick of the fray. At the end of those 24 hrs, Sharon apparently had second thoughts. He had the guy executed a couple weeks later. And the White House said absolutely nothing.

I found this out from Jimmy Carter's brand new book, "Our Endangered Values." Carter, a Democrat but the REAL Christian (not Bush.) Check it out everybody. You will read things that chill your blood. I thought I knew a lot about these people, but Carter of course has political access to people we don't. He can hear stories 2nd hand. Whatever he did during his Administration (and he made a LOT of frig-ups), it is settled historical fact by now of his genune human rights concerns, and how he became a greater man after he left office. Personally, I'd trust the Nobel Peace Prize winner, thank you.

After reading this, if any of you think that Alito and Roberts are just the latest in a long tradition of conservative appointees to SCOTUS who run into the same brick wall of Precident and decide to uphold Roe or civil rights laws becuase of the effect it would have on the country if precident of so long were overturned, (no matter how they personally feel ), think again. These guys really WILL be different. I can easily see in the month before the vote on this upcoming abortion case, a National Month of Prayer, a "get out the vote" campaign where 100,000 emails A DAY are sent to the White House for 30 days asking Bush to keep a close watch on the Court personally (hey, after 33 yrs of slavering to overturn Roe, and maybe affirmative action and a few other civil rights laws as well, being so close and having this unique chance, do you think they'll sit back and wait for the Court to vote? HELL NO!) Reading articles in Newsweek this week on this subject make me cringe, becuase they're still stuck on the different planet we used to be. They haven't gotten the Picture yet that things have changed.

Hey, I'm all for limiting some abortion but not for turning America back to the reproductive Stone Age, and thus begging Cina and India to take up our moral and technological lead where we dropped it in the fields of blind ideology. It would have huge health repercussions as well. We all know that for people like Dobson (and his hugely influencial circle of churches) for many it does not end with abortion. Many don't like any kind of birth control either, and are the ones behind the recent pharmancy crap.)

Bottom line: I can't recall the last time the leader of a powerful special interest group insisted on reading a letter personally written to him by a Supreme Court Justice on the air. Just that very act suggests a level of political good-ol-boyship that is better reserved for the military or the VP and his hunting buddies.

If you're friends from way back, fine. But if that "friendship" is for a political purpose....

 

[melon]

Perhaps thanking a partisan group is a reflection of the highly political nature of the confirmation hearings.

All Alito had to do was sit pretty and not (openly) declare a hatred for all minorities and non-Christians.

When you have 55 Republicans, you pretty much don't have to do anything to be confirmed.

Melon

 

[nbcrusader]

All Alito had to do was sit pretty and not (openly) declare a hatred for all minorities and non-Christians.

When you have 55 Republicans, you pretty much don't have to do anything to be confirmed.

Melon

Confirmation hearings are platforms for agenda groups to build support for their base. Alito's confirmation may not have been in question, but he was still forced to participate in a highly political process to get there.