Do you think Drinking during Pregnancy should be considered Child Abuse? - Page 2 - U2 Feedback

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Old 07-17-2004, 05:46 AM   #16
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Originally posted by Bono's American Wife
I think its irresponsible but not criminal.
I agree

I guess in some cases it could be considered criminal
but practically speaking I think it makes more sense to treat this as irresponsible and try to get convictions in extreme cases
otherwise you get people having to defend themselves while - when smoking/drinking happes in strict moderation - there's no proof that it will hurt the baby in any way
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Old 07-17-2004, 12:02 PM   #17
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A pregnant woman who is smoking is a terrible image for me.
I can't imagine that in 2004 people are not aware of those risks !
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Old 07-17-2004, 07:45 PM   #18
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I think that pretty much everyone is aware of the risks but some people have a hard time quitting. I don't think enacting that kind of a law would reduce the number of infants with related problems by much. What would probably happen is that some of the women who are already irresponsible enough to drink while pregnant will not go to the hospital and abandon their baby somewhere to avoid prosecution.
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Old 07-18-2004, 02:33 AM   #19
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I agree, ILLM. This really just comes back to the kind of woman who is uneducated and irresponsible about children, period.

I have friends, co-workers, whatever who have had drinks--even gotten drunk before they knew they were pregnant. That's different.

But I've also seen my neighbor (who is mentally ill) drinking while obviously pregnant. She knew she was pregnant. She was bragging to anyone who could listen. But there she is chugging a Jack Daniels. The baby was nearly a year old before we saw it sitting up and moving around. For a year, it just laid there and never made a sound, a stark contrast to the healthy baby next door who was the same age. Her other daughter is obviously hearing impaired and mentally behind.

Now THAT is child abuse. That, coupled with the general way she cares for them, should be enough to take her children away. She should not be allowed to have more.

But while our system believes that children are always better off with "their parents." Since these children are not beaten, they're fed and clothed, they won't take them away. And even if they did, the foster system is a joke. Why bother enacting more laws? Who's going to enforce it? Who's going to provide a better life for these children...?
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Old 07-18-2004, 02:43 AM   #20
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And even if they did, the foster system is a joke.
Hey now, I'm a product of the foster system. I'd like to think I turned out fine. My foster parents were amazing. Anyone who can take on infants like that and love them and care for them and then give them up, it's hard. I know people who are foster parents and it's not easy. Yes there are some who are complete assholes, but the system does work, it just needs to be monitored just a little more.
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Old 07-18-2004, 08:16 AM   #21
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Why is there more and more ritalin being dispensed? Why are our children being drugged more and more? Why do we look to a pill to cure them? Why oh why? I have my theories.

#1 From the time a woman is notified by her Doctor that she is pregnant it should be against the law to have alcohol or smoke.

#2 Society winds up putting more and more money into the care and education of these children (as it should) however, I am not sure if this is because of drinking during pregnancy, or because the child is born into a house where the parent is already so selfish that they put their own needs before the childs....
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Old 07-18-2004, 09:23 AM   #22
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My sister in law smoked like an old time factory and had 4 healthy nine pounders
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Old 07-18-2004, 10:48 PM   #23
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar


Hey now, I'm a product of the foster system. I'd like to think I turned out fine. My foster parents were amazing. Anyone who can take on infants like that and love them and care for them and then give them up, it's hard. I know people who are foster parents and it's not easy. Yes there are some who are complete assholes, but the system does work, it just needs to be monitored just a little more.
That's great. I too admire anyone who can take on that role.

I just know the horror stories I've heard over and over again. I know bad news and scandal is more likely to be reported than the good, but from what I understand, the system needs more than "a little" monitoring. There needs to be some serious housecleaning and overhaul.

My intent wasn't to insult anyone in the system, by any means.
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Old 07-18-2004, 11:21 PM   #24
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Originally posted by Dreadsox


#1 From the time a woman is notified by her Doctor that she is pregnant it should be against the law to have alcohol or smoke.

But a fair number of women never seek prenatal care. The first time they see a doctor during their pregnancy is when they're in labor.
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Old 07-19-2004, 07:04 AM   #25
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What is the number? .. I am curious.
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Old 07-19-2004, 07:47 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
Why is there more and more ritalin being dispensed? Why are our children being drugged more and more? Why do we look to a pill to cure them? Why oh why? I have my theories.

#1 From the time a woman is notified by her Doctor that she is pregnant it should be against the law to have alcohol or smoke.

#2 Society winds up putting more and more money into the care and education of these children (as it should) however, I am not sure if this is because of drinking during pregnancy, or because the child is born into a house where the parent is already so selfish that they put their own needs before the childs....
What does ritalin have to do with this thread? Are you suggesting that parents who dispense ritalin drink and smoke and are too selfish to find other methods to deal with ADD?
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Old 07-19-2004, 10:05 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
What is the number? .. I am curious.

This is something I researched in college a while back, but I surfed around the net this morning looking for some statistics for you. One government report has the percentage of women who receive delayed (after the first trimester) or no prenatal care up around 20-25%. For women receiving NO prenatal care, the percentages vary widely according to race, anywhere from 2% to 9%. There are also statistics concerning the adequacy of prenatal care for women in various states. Apparently, the goal of the government was to have 90% of women receiving early prenatal care by 2000, and that goal was not met. Even if it had been, that still leaves 10 out of every 100 women not getting early prenatal care. If you want to know more, this information is easy to find on the net and elsewhere.
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Old 07-19-2004, 10:08 AM   #28
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Originally posted by HeartlandGirl


But a fair number of women never seek prenatal care. The first time they see a doctor during their pregnancy is when they're in labor.


i can see how this is true, but this just really makes me angry that there always has to be some kind of excuse to not make drinking and smoking during pregnancy against the law.

all in the name of protecting the mother and her freakin rights. nevermind the unborn.
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Old 07-19-2004, 10:11 AM   #29
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I hope you don't think I was making excuses. I was pointing out that it would be difficult to enforce a law where the ban on smoking and drinking begins with a doctor-confirmed pregnancy, seeing as how some women see their doctors after the first trimester or not at all.
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Old 07-19-2004, 12:57 PM   #30
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I would say YES, it is abusive. It infringes on the rights of the unborn child. FAS is absolutely terrible! After seeing kids with FAS, it's reason alone to abstain from drinking. It's such a tragic syndrome and you never really know what you're going to get. I have a friend who's mom smoked, drank heavily, did drugs, the works while she was pregnant (she was basically in denial of her pregnancy) but my friend turned out just fine and it inspired her mother to really turn her life around. But on the other hand, my mom has worked with numberous crack babies and FAS cases (my mom worked at an adoption agency and now an inner city daycare) and their mothers couldn't care less, obviously since they didn't even have enough sense to properly care for themselves.

There was actually a Law and Order episode on this very topic. The question raised was a good one: if it IS considered abusive, what do you do with the pregnant mother? Do you jail a pregnant woman? How can you possibly keep her from drinking/smoking? I'm not saying these difficulties mean that it shouldn't be law, but it does make it harder to address.

As for the argument that it's hard to know that you're pregnant right away, I say sorry, no excuse there. If you're responsible enough to have sex without sufficient protection, then you're responsible enough NOT to smoke or drink AT ALL b/c yes you might be pregnant.
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