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Old 09-20-2006, 07:08 AM   #1
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Dinosaurs Never Existed!

Don't let my tongue-in-cheek thread title throw you off.

When I was younger, I wanted to be a paleontologist so I could study dinosaur bones.

The theological question asked frequently is about dinosaurs. Likemindeds who believe that Creation has its merits may search Genesis for answers, or for evidence, of dinosaurs.

I believe there is an indeniable proof that dinosaurs exist.

So where are they found in the Bible?

The answer is that you have to think outside of the box. My belief is that dinosaurs were created on the sixth day, and before the fall of man in the Garden of Eden, all of them ate plants. As a result of the fall of mankind, several animals had to devour other animals in order to survive.

Quote:
24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, [b] and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

27 So God created man in his own image,
in the image of God he created him;
male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

29 Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground—everything that has the breath of life in it—I give every green plant for food." And it was so.

31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning—the sixth day.
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Old 09-20-2006, 07:46 AM   #2
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You could think outside the box, or you could roll your own and see dinosaurs, sure.


I was obssessed with dinosaurs when I was a kid. I used to take plastic figurines to my ballet classes.
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Old 09-20-2006, 08:20 AM   #3
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the "Epic of Gilgamesh" will grant a new perspective on the book of Genesis...

Gilgamesh was written down on 3500 B.C.E. compared to Gensis' 1000 B.C.E. Look into it.

Dinosaurs are the shit.
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Old 09-20-2006, 08:35 AM   #4
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Im going to be going for a masters in Palaeontology in 2008, and then after that hopefully a PhD, dinosaurs are the shit.

As for reconciling creation with basic anatomy of Dinosars it cannot be done; Therapod dinosaurs were carnivorous - we have a lot of evidence including teeth, bite marks and coprolites (fossilised feces), these animals would not have survived on plants - even before "the fall".

To reconcile bibliotheism with reality the facts must go out the window.
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Old 09-20-2006, 08:57 AM   #5
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OK so who was the unknown WOMEN that Cain and Abel, the "first" sons of Adam and Eve- the ONLY people on earth, mated with to make the beginning of the world?

Answer that, will you?
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Old 09-20-2006, 09:12 AM   #6
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I saw a book for little kids at a Christian bookstore once. It had a lovely illustration of the cavemen fighting off a giant dino. It was serious.

Gotta love 'em.
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Old 09-20-2006, 09:15 AM   #7
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Re: Dinosaurs Never Existed!

Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
I believe there is an indeniable proof that dinosaurs exist.
They're called "fossils" and they're at least 65 million years old.

I'm not going to entertain the rest of this pseudoscience.

Melon
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Old 09-20-2006, 09:32 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by preciousstone
OK so who was the unknown WOMEN that Cain and Abel, the "first" sons of Adam and Eve- the ONLY people on earth, mated with to make the beginning of the world?

Answer that, will you?
Not an answer that fundamentalist Christians will want to hear, but I believe that Genesis was written with a henotheistic POV, as the Israelites were one Semitic tribe of many, and each Semitic tribe had their own god that they worshipped. The Genesis creation myths were written in this fashion, and I believe that that "Garden of Eden" was perhaps a metaphor for what we presently term as "heaven." Like "heaven," the Garden of Eden would not have been present on Earth, and once they were cast out of the garden, they were then put onto a preexisting Earth with all the other tribes, created by their own respective gods. As for who created "Earth," if each tribe had been created by different gods, it was not uncommon to worship a god different from the god who created you. And, indeed, in the Semitic pantheon, "Yahweh," the thunder god, was subordinate to El, the supreme Semitic god who unified all the Semitic tribes of the Levant.

As such, Cain married a woman from a foreign tribe who exists, because she was created by a different Semitic god, according to the mindset of the times.

After being released from exile by the Persian Empire, a new sect of Jews arose that adopted a wide set of views from the state religion, Zoroastrianism. And this sect became known as the Pharisees. The latter half of the Old Testament reflects their theology, and is fully monotheistic. However, Exodus merely states to have "no other gods before me," which is not the same as "there is no such thing as other gods but me." Exodus' main contribution to early Judaism was that it establishes Yahweh as the protector god of the Israelites, and, likewise, shows the suicidal consequences of worshipping other Semitic deities, as told in the story of the Golden Calf. This was quite a departure, as archaeological evidence shows that the Israelites' neighbors were known to worship other tribes' gods, in addition to their own.

Oh yeah, and Abel didn't mate with anyone. He was killed by Cain, which is why he was cast out and married a foreigner to begin with.

Melon
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Old 09-20-2006, 10:28 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by macfesto
the "Epic of Gilgamesh" will grant a new perspective on the book of Genesis...

Gilgamesh was written down on 3500 B.C.E. compared to Gensis' 1000 B.C.E. Look into it.

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Old 09-20-2006, 10:37 AM   #10
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dinosaurs never existed... just ask carl everett
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Old 09-20-2006, 10:41 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon


Not an answer that fundamentalist Christians will want to hear, but I believe that Genesis was written with a henotheistic POV, as the Israelites were one Semitic tribe of many, and each Semitic tribe had their own god that they worshipped. The Genesis creation myths were written in this fashion, and I believe that that "Garden of Eden" was perhaps a metaphor for what we presently term as "heaven." Like "heaven," the Garden of Eden would not have been present on Earth, and once they were cast out of the garden, they were then put onto a preexisting Earth with all the other tribes, created by their own respective gods. As for who created "Earth," if each tribe had been created by different gods, it was not uncommon to worship a god different from the god who created you. And, indeed, in the Semitic pantheon, "Yahweh," the thunder god, was subordinate to El, the supreme Semitic god who unified all the Semitic tribes of the Levant.

As such, Cain married a woman from a foreign tribe who exists, because she was created by a different Semitic god, according to the mindset of the times.

After being released from exile by the Persian Empire, a new sect of Jews arose that adopted a wide set of views from the state religion, Zoroastrianism. And this sect became known as the Pharisees. The latter half of the Old Testament reflects their theology, and is fully monotheistic. However, Exodus merely states to have "no other gods before me," which is not the same as "there is no such thing as other gods but me." Exodus' main contribution to early Judaism was that it establishes Yahweh as the protector god of the Israelites, and, likewise, shows the suicidal consequences of worshipping other Semitic deities, as told in the story of the Golden Calf. This was quite a departure, as archaeological evidence shows that the Israelites' neighbors were known to worship other tribes' gods, in addition to their own.

Oh yeah, and Abel didn't mate with anyone. He was killed by Cain, which is why he was cast out and married a foreigner to begin with.

Melon
This is a very fascinating post! I would like to look into it more.

I am probably what you would consider a "fundamentalist," but I think many Christians are way off base in the way they interpret Genesis. As Melon pointed out, there was a different mindset back then. Today, we tend to read everything as if it were a newspaper article.

To me, Genesis is important because of the themes it presents. 1) God is in charge; 2) Humans chose to live according to their own desires (instead of God's will); and 3) Righteousness comes through faith (see Abraham)
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Old 09-20-2006, 11:17 AM   #12
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Re: Re: Dinosaurs Never Existed!

Quote:
Originally posted by melon


They're called "fossils" and they're at least 65 million years old.

I'm not going to entertain the rest of this pseudoscience.

Melon
"Existed" was my intention, excuse the typo.
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Old 09-20-2006, 11:21 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon


Not an answer that fundamentalist Christians will want to hear, but I believe that Genesis was written with a henotheistic POV, as the Israelites were one Semitic tribe of many, and each Semitic tribe had their own god that they worshipped. The Genesis creation myths were written in this fashion, and I believe that that "Garden of Eden" was perhaps a metaphor for what we presently term as "heaven." Like "heaven," the Garden of Eden would not have been present on Earth, and once they were cast out of the garden, they were then put onto a preexisting Earth with all the other tribes, created by their own respective gods. As for who created "Earth," if each tribe had been created by different gods, it was not uncommon to worship a god different from the god who created you. And, indeed, in the Semitic pantheon, "Yahweh," the thunder god, was subordinate to El, the supreme Semitic god who unified all the Semitic tribes of the Levant.
Since I'm not a "fundamentalist", I found this to be an interesting metaphor. I think Genesis can be interpreted in every which direction. I can tell you've put in quite a bit of thought and foundation into your interpretation.

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Old 09-20-2006, 11:22 AM   #14
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dinosaurs never existed... just ask carl everett
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Old 09-20-2006, 11:30 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by A_Wanderer
Im going to be going for a masters in Palaeontology in 2008, and then after that hopefully a PhD, dinosaurs are the shit.

As for reconciling creation with basic anatomy of Dinosars it cannot be done; Therapod dinosaurs were carnivorous - we have a lot of evidence including teeth, bite marks and coprolites (fossilised feces), these animals would not have survived on plants - even before "the fall".

To reconcile bibliotheism with reality the facts must go out the window.
Awesome that you're pursuing palaeontology, and good luck.

But to contradict your argument, it seems that when you take the fall of mankind half-heartedly, it doesn't make sense. To put logic into perspective, The Garden of Eden had all kinds of trees that only began to wither away after mankind was cursed.

I'm not trying to thump anything. What I'm doing is giving you a perspective that makes more sense than "just believe this is true," which is what you've heard, I imagine, from someone who believes in the fall of mankind but doesn't know why they do.
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