Dinosaurs Never Existed! - Page 2 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 09-20-2006, 11:59 AM   #16
Blue Crack Addict
 
Liesje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: In the dog house
Posts: 19,557
Local Time: 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe


But to contradict your argument, it seems that when you take the fall of mankind half-heartedly, it doesn't make sense.
When you take it literally, it doesn't make sense.
__________________

__________________
Liesje is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:03 PM   #17
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Macfistowannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,129
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by LivLuvAndBootlegMusic


When you take it literally, it doesn't make sense.
Sure it does. I don't think that the Bible is supposed to be a full-blown mind game.

But Melon is right as far as the fact that there are parables found all over the place, and that many of them require a lot of searching to find out what the message is telling you.
__________________

__________________
Macfistowannabe is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:08 PM   #18
Blue Crack Addict
 
Liesje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: In the dog house
Posts: 19,557
Local Time: 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
there are parables found all over the place, and that many of them require a lot of searching to find out what the message is telling you.
Sometimes a lot LESS searching and a lot MORE open-mindedness and letting go of bias.
__________________
Liesje is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:15 PM   #19
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Macfistowannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,129
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by LivLuvAndBootlegMusic


Sometimes a lot LESS searching and a lot MORE open-mindedness and letting go of bias.
I could use some specific examples here in order to understand your argument.
__________________
Macfistowannabe is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:29 PM   #20
Blue Crack Addict
 
Liesje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: In the dog house
Posts: 19,557
Local Time: 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
I could use some specific examples here in order to understand your argument.
Well, I don't want to derail this thread about dinosaurs. Just look back in any thread regarding evolution v. ID and you'll find plenty of examples. People see what they want to see, or what they were taught to see. Sometimes all we need to do is step out of our own very limited box of what we previously understood and what we were socialized to understand and things can make a lot more sense. A basic example is that gazillions of Christians fail to realize that the Genesis creation story is a narrative. They close their eyes to this obvious truth, and thus fail to understand the implications this has on theology and a Christian view of science.
__________________
Liesje is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:33 PM   #21
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Macfistowannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,129
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by LivLuvAndBootlegMusic


Well, I don't want to derail this thread about dinosaurs. Just look back in any thread regarding evolution v. ID and you'll find plenty of examples. People see what they want to see, or what they were taught to see. Sometimes all we need to do is step out of our own very limited box of what we previously understood and what we were socialized to understand and things can make a lot more sense.
How do you know that people who don't think it makes sense aren't stuck in their own very limited box?

Quote:
Originally posted by LivLuvAndBootlegMusic
A basic example is that gazillions of Christians fail to realize that the Genesis creation story is a narrative. They close their eyes to this obvious truth, and thus fail to understand the implications this has on theology and a Christian view of science.
What is the obvious truth?

It seems like the obvious truth to a lot of people is reinvented and reinvented and reinvented.
__________________
Macfistowannabe is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:42 PM   #22
Blue Crack Addict
 
Liesje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: In the dog house
Posts: 19,557
Local Time: 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
How do you know that people who don't think it makes sense aren't stuck in their own very limited box?

What is the obvious truth?

It seems like the obvious truth to a lot of people is reinvented and reinvented and reinvented.
What doesn't make sense?

Genesis is a Hebrew narrative, their creation story. The only truths it attempts to illustrate are that there is a God and He is responsible for and has authority over all of creation. These truths are played out in a series of relationships - God's relationship with humankind, humankind's relationship with each other, and humankind's relationship with God's creation.

It does not attempt to support or refute the existance of dinosaurs, evolution, how many days it took the Earth to form.....the creation narrative occurs outside of our concept of time and space.
__________________
Liesje is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:56 PM   #23
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Macfistowannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,129
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by LivLuvAndBootlegMusic


What doesn't make sense?

Genesis is a Hebrew narrative, their creation story. The only truths it attempts to illustrate are that there is a God and He is responsible for and has authority over all of creation. These truths are played out in a series of relationships - God's relationship with humankind, humankind's relationship with each other, and humankind's relationship with God's creation.

It does not attempt to support or refute the existance of dinosaurs, evolution, how many days it took the Earth to form.....the creation narrative occurs outside of our concept of time and space.
It seems that we don't agree on creationism itself, and that while you believe in intelligent design, you also believe in evolution.

Am I wrong?

I don't think Creation in Genesis is something that God is incapable of doing, nor do I believe that we have proven that it is a narrarative.

In case you haven't noticed, I respect the evolution by intelligent design argument, it's just that I don't agree with it.
__________________
Macfistowannabe is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 12:58 PM   #24
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Macfistowannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,129
Local Time: 07:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by LivLuvAndBootlegMusic


What doesn't make sense? .
People who don't take Creationism literally don't seem to believe that it could make sense. So they take it narraratively.

I hope that clears it up.
__________________
Macfistowannabe is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 01:15 PM   #25
Blue Crack Addict
 
Liesje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: In the dog house
Posts: 19,557
Local Time: 06:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
People who don't take Creationism literally don't seem to believe that it could make sense. So they take it narraratively.
I don't really care how people take it, it's their faith so it's not really any of my business. However, there's a difference between "taking" something narratively and saying that to make it sound like something that is a narrative might not be a narrative. I don't care what you interpret from the narrative and where that leads as far as creationism/evolution/ID, but a narrative is a narrative. Trying to argue that Genesis is anything but severely discredits any arguement you make based on that conclusion, in my opinion. I think it's pretty rediculous you're arguing that people "believe" Genesis is a narrative because they are unable to interpret it literally.
__________________
Liesje is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 01:24 PM   #26
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 09:55 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
Awesome that you're pursuing palaeontology, and good luck.

But to contradict your argument, it seems that when you take the fall of mankind half-heartedly, it doesn't make sense. To put logic into perspective, The Garden of Eden had all kinds of trees that only began to wither away after mankind was cursed.

I'm not trying to thump anything. What I'm doing is giving you a perspective that makes more sense than "just believe this is true," which is what you've heard, I imagine, from someone who believes in the fall of mankind but doesn't know why they do.
I don't take it half-heartedly, I don't accept it at all.

And if one doesn't accept that tale then the concept of original sin goes out the window and the rest of the theology unwinds - who needs a saviour when they don't need to be saved?

I have read a good deal of evidence on the subject, I have had the opportunity to get hands on with the evidence -the objectivity of science means we must try and disregard assumptions; Dinosaur fossils make perfect sense in the context of vertebrate evolution over the last 250 million years - the finds coming out of China of feathered therapods and transitional forms are the evidence of dinosaurs evolving into birds that has been expected for some time now.
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 01:27 PM   #27
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 09:55 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
It seems like the obvious truth to a lot of people is reinvented and reinvented and reinvented.
And again I reiterate that the shifts in scientific knowledge are a strenght and not a weakness - it represents the best understanding of what we know and is always open to new and contradictory discoveries; this dynamic system of knowedge is a powerful tool of investigation and it is bordering on criminal that so many young minds are cut off from it on the basis of percieved culture war and religious identity.
__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 01:31 PM   #28
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,664
Local Time: 05:55 PM
END PSEUDOSCIENCE
__________________
BVS is online now  
Old 09-20-2006, 01:36 PM   #29
Rock n' Roll Doggie
Band-aid
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: The American Resistance
Posts: 4,754
Local Time: 05:55 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
END PSEUDOSCIENCE
Can I quote you on the next "global warming" thread?
__________________
INDY500 is offline  
Old 09-20-2006, 01:37 PM   #30
ONE
love, blood, life
 
A_Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Wild West
Posts: 12,518
Local Time: 09:55 AM
Pseudoscience pretends to be science, special creation doesn't even reach that bar.
__________________

__________________
A_Wanderer is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:55 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com