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Old 11-08-2007, 05:04 AM   #46
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Originally posted by maycocksean

Does a woman have a choice as to whether she can become a parent, but a man has no choice (other than to use protection and hope it works) about it?

I thought about my own question a bit more this afternoon and finally came up with an answer. . .and it was basically what Yolland said.

In the same way a man can't demand that a woman go along with his desire to have a child, he can't demand that he be absolved of the responsiblities that come when a child he helped create comes into the world.

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Old 11-08-2007, 07:39 AM   #47
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I completely agree that if this woman lied it is totally unfair to the guy and is absolutely morally wrong. But the bottom line is that you can't take the failings of either one of them/both of them out on an innocent child. That child needs to be provided for once he/she is here (regardless of the circumstances of conception). I Googled a bit for some more info about this case (I remember it, it did receive considerable media attention), it is available. I believe one article stated that he asked her to consider putting the child up for adoption and she eventually wouldn't do that for some reason.

I think the comment about using birth control/abstaining applies to both genders-both should know that abstinence is the only absolute prevention. In many cases there can be a certain level of denial involved, and well that denial can eventually involve a third life.

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Old 11-08-2007, 07:44 AM   #48
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I hope that one day people will realize that law is not the vehicle to bring about social change and justice in every instance. It is especially true in cases of family law, where it has arguably done more bad than good. Arguably, of course.

It is true that the courts can and do mandate counselling. Most family divorce law legislation does mandate at least the suggestion of counselling, except in clearly inappropriate cases (like domestic violence, for example). The thinking is that a stable marriage is better for society; the cynic will tell you it's better for the economy. In either case, it's absolutely true that the courts get involved.

The guy really had no case, but beyond that, our courts are not sympathetic in the slightest to men who try to shirk their parental responsibilities. Those times are largely past, which is a good thing. What is the alternative for this child? Probably to receive state funds, which is patently unfair to taxpayers. It's not an ideal situation for this guy, and yes, he may have been duped, but that doesn't matter in my eyes. If you have sex with someone and they tell you they are clean, will you forego the condom because you trust them....even though you barely know them? I surely wouldn't, so it isn't as if he had no choice in the matter.
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Old 11-08-2007, 08:16 AM   #49
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Originally posted by anitram
If you have sex with someone and they tell you they are clean, will you forego the condom because you trust them....even though you barely know them? I surely wouldn't, so it isn't as if he had no choice in the matter.
He did have a choice-and he also chose to trust her too. Does that absolve her if she lied? No, absolutely not. But making that choice for the sake of sexual pleasure, well ultimately it requires personal responsibility on both sides and no law or court or number of lawsuits is going to change that or undo that or the consequences. Whether she lied or not he chose to believe for whatever reason, I assume for sexual pleasure reasons. I'm not defending her actions if they were deceptive, not at all. But her actions don't absolve him of his choices and reactions. It takes two and all that...

It's one thing to choose to trust someone if the possible consequences are only bad for you personally. The key here like I said is that another life can be created.
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Old 11-08-2007, 11:18 AM   #50
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The problem is, this is always going to be one of those unfair issues, since men cannot carry children and women can. The man will always bear the short end of the stick on this one, so their best bet is to always, always use their brain and not their..ahem..other parts when deciding whom to have sex with.

Perhaps we all ought be more careful about the whole sex thing.

We live in a society so hyped up about immediate gratification that we often fail to see the long term consequences of our immediate gratification.

Less sex won't kill you, men. You could be paying for the next 18 years for that two minute quickie.

ETA: And yes, that means I'm saying put it back in your pants. You won't die if you don't have sex. Really. Frikkin get over it, already. I mean, seriously, you can't /not/ have sex why? You don't have many choices, here, gents, so keep it in your pants longer.
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Old 11-08-2007, 05:59 PM   #51
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Originally posted by corianderstem

Maybe she was lying about being infertile, but you know what? Maybe doctors told her she would never have kids ... and then hey, guess what! You're pregnant! It's not unheard of.

So mother was told she couldn't have children after 10 years of trying.

Clearly they were wrong 4 times.

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