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Old 01-21-2006, 12:19 PM   #196
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Originally posted by ladywithspinninghead
Although like most of the Canadian population I lean to the left, I can't say that I'm completely adverse to the prospect of a Conservative minority government anymore (minority, not majority!).

I think it would accomplish a few things, in a nutshell:
- Conservatives would reveal their true colours but hopefully their time in power will be short enough that the damage is "undoable"
- would remind the Canadian population that we are not a right-wing country
- I think it would do quite a bit for the federal cause in Quebec
- once the Tories have revealed their true intent, it would probably make way for a Liberal majority gov't in the following election (I personally like this idea although not all of you would I'm sure)
- will give the Liberals enough time to regroup, breathe, and lay out a new vision for the country. This time-out will hopefully be sufficient for Canadians' anger towards them to subside and for everyone to just move on.

Maybe I'm just pulling at straws but I'm trying to find the silver lining in all of this!
Great points!
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Old 01-21-2006, 01:13 PM   #197
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yeah, the only problem i have with that lwtsh, is that paul martin won't be around to lead that push. no question, i think he's the best man to lead the party and indeed our country.
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Old 01-21-2006, 01:21 PM   #198
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although one thing that's pissed me off about the liberals this campaign is how they're painting themselves as the only progressive choice out there. they've alienated a lot of people with their remarks and apparently have painted themselves in a corner.

i mean, the ndp appear more centre than the liberals do at this point. they've done nothing to offend any group, have they?
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Old 01-21-2006, 02:01 PM   #199
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Originally posted by Zoomerang96
yeah, the only problem i have with that lwtsh, is that paul martin won't be around to lead that push. no question, i think he's the best man to lead the party and indeed our country.
Do you think he’s lived up to his billing? I think there are two camps: those who view Martin as a disappointment, and those who see him as a victim of Chrétien’s lingering shadow.
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Old 01-21-2006, 02:01 PM   #200
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Originally posted by Zoomerang96
yeah, the only problem i have with that lwtsh, is that paul martin won't be around to lead that push. no question, i think he's the best man to lead the party and indeed our country.
I know and I try not to let my personal feelings get involved, but I feel pretty sorry for the guy. It was his lifelong dream to become Prime Minister and he will have only enjoyed 2 short years because he ended up being the fall guy for the sponsorship scandal.

His flip-flopping on issues would get on my nerves but then again he was in a tight bind with a minority government.
Say what you will about Chretien (and personally I really like the guy ), but he stuck to his guns no matter what (some call that arrogance but I don't, I see it as a man being led by conviction and his beliefs rather than being dictated to by popular opinion)
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Old 01-21-2006, 02:05 PM   #201
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As I wrote in another thread, it would be interesting to see who everyone thinks could be a viable contender for leader of the Liberal party.

Frank McKenna? John Manley?

Justin Trudeau?
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Old 01-21-2006, 02:26 PM   #202
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I was thinking the same thing ladywithspinninghead. Recent history shows, mostly Liberal governments with little Conservative blips followed by the Liberals again. It seems that we let the Conservatives have a shot, then say get the hell out of there, and put the Liberals back in for a long stretch.
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Old 01-21-2006, 09:07 PM   #203
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Did anyone catch Air Farce last night, where they had Gilles Duceppe win the election. Pretty funny.

Well, I'm hoping the Liberals pull through this. Harper really creeps me out. We shall see what happens I guess.
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Old 01-21-2006, 09:19 PM   #204
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Originally posted by trevster2k
I was thinking the same thing ladywithspinninghead. Recent history shows, mostly Liberal governments with little Conservative blips followed by the Liberals again. It seems that we let the Conservatives have a shot, then say get the hell out of there, and put the Liberals back in for a long stretch.
That sounds good only if we actually manage to boot Harper relatively soon. Look at how Mike Harris decimated Ontario - it'll take us another decade to undo the damage he did.

The Conservatives in power isn't the end of the world. But if they stay there long enough for their policies to start taking effect, we're screwed.
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Old 01-21-2006, 09:57 PM   #205
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It seems that we let the Conservatives have a shot, then say get the hell out of there, and put the Liberals back in for a long stretch.
Let's hope so.

If Harper gets a minority and keeps his social agenda on the back burner for 18 months, there's a strong chance people won't be ready for the Liberals again just yet unless Martin is still at the helm...even then, you just never know.

There's a real possibility they could win a majority next time around.
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Old 01-21-2006, 10:44 PM   #206
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Let's hope so.

If Harper gets a minority and keeps his social agenda on the back burner for 18 months, there's a strong chance people won't be ready for the Liberals again just yet unless Martin is still at the helm...even then, you just never know.

There's a real possibility they could win a majority next time around.
The ironic thing here is that many Liberals are actually hoping to lose the election on Monday. These are the people who believe the party has lost its way, and say that it’s time to redefine their brand. It’s much harder to do this while you’re still in power.

For people cringing at a potential Conservative victory, the upside, if you’re coming from a left-wing perspective, is that the current mush of similarity at the centre should polarize and each party’s mandate should become much clearer.
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Old 01-21-2006, 11:30 PM   #207
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The ironic thing here is that many Liberals are actually hoping to lose the election on Monday.
Then I hope they get an earful of "be careful what you wish for".

When I said they could win a majority next time, I meant the Conservatives.
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Old 01-21-2006, 11:41 PM   #208
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Then I hope they get an earful of "be careful what you wish for".

When I said they could win a majority next time, I meant the Conservatives.
Yes, that's why I said there are actually Liberals who want to lose Monday, in order to get stronger in the long-term.

Right now, I think the appropriate question is: what is a Liberal? It's not as simple to answer as some say it should be.
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Old 01-22-2006, 01:55 AM   #209
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There is the possibility the Conservatives could win a majority the next time around but we have to bear in mind the Liberals are the "natural governing party of Canada".

History has shown that the Tories usually win because Canadians want to punish the Liberals for some wrongdoing or because the Liberals were in power for too so the desire for change is very strong (The Libs were once in power for 22 consecutive years!). (Then there was Mulroney's re-election of a majority but that was because the election centered largely around one issue, that of the Free Trade Agreement). What I'm trying to say is the the Tories rarely win because Canadians naturally gravitate towards them or because their "values" resonate more with the Canadian population.


I do believe Canadians will have forgiven the Liberals by the time the next election rolls around - in fact, if you look at the polls pre-Xmas the Liberals were actually leading from the start of the election until the rcmp investigation became headline news. Obviously Canadians were already starting to forgive (or forget?)the Liberals for the Sponsorship scandal.

Also - Harper might be able to hold off with his social-conservative agenda for the next 18 months but I don't think he'll be able to continue muzzling his candidates.
The Liberals are on to something in this regard - just today Harper announced all media conferences, interviews with candidates, etc are now forbidden until after the election. It really does make one wonder...

It sure would be nice if 1979 repeated itself - Canadians woke up to discover they had elected a Conservative minority government. It didn't take long for Joe Clark and Co. to misconstrue that as meaning something more than Canadians just punishing Pierre Trudeau. 6 months later his government fell and the Liberals were elected to a majority government.
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Old 01-22-2006, 01:59 AM   #210
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that's really frightening isn't it.

what's he so scared of...they're HIS OWN PEOPLE, aren't they?

hmmm...
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