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Old 05-06-2003, 11:01 PM   #16
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On behalf of the government of my country, I would like to apologize to anyone here from the countries Bush is snubbing. Your countries don't deserve to be treated that way.

What an immature little man. .

Bush, wake up and get some sense into your head.

And I hate his "if you're not with us, you're against us" mentality. God, it pisses me off. .

Angela
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Old 05-06-2003, 11:26 PM   #17
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Mrs. Edge,

The article does not prove that the reason Bush has postponed his trip to Canada is because of Canada's position on the war.

Scarletwine,

"One could say the same for those elusive WMD's and Iraq-Bin Laden."

"I don't think Dubyah listens to Powell at all. Otherwise the State Dept. would be running the post war Iraq. If you think the NeoCons aren't controlling the admin., your in need of an awakening."

Let me quote Colin Powell for you: "It is not incumbent upon the United States to prove that Iraq has Weapons of Mass Destruction, it is incumbent upon Iraq to prove that it does not have weapons of mass destruction"

Before Powells speach to the UN in February, a reporter asked, "What do you have to say about Iraq's assertion that it does not have WMD?" Powell simply said "PROVE IT".

The 1991 Gulf War Ceace Fire Agreement requires Iraq to prove that it no longer has weapons of mass destruction. Iraq failed to satisfy this term of the Ceace Fire which made the use of military force this past March/April necessary.

Colin Powell is Bush's most trusted advisor. Cheney would come next. Cheney wanted to go into Iraq without even consulting the United Nations. He certainly had the legal pretext to do so as written in UN Security Council Resolution 678 which authorized the use of all means necessary to bring Iraq into compliance with all subsequent resolutions.

Despite this, Powell felt getting as much political support around the world for such an operation, despite already have the legal authorization to move, would be most beneficial to the US.

Bush agreed, and instead of invading Iraq as early as the fall 2002, Powell went though the UN, got another resolution that gave Iraq a last chance that if failed, and would reaffirm 678 and the authorization to use all means necessary to bring about compliance by Iraq.

It is Powell, rather than Cheney and Rumsfeld, that Bush has listened to the most on the issue of Iraq and Foreign Policy. Powell spent over 30 years on active duty in the US military achieve the rank of 4 star general. He is not someone that gets pushed around. If anything, the opposite is true.

So please, awaken to these facts.
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Old 05-07-2003, 01:10 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
Mrs. Edge,

The article does not prove that the reason Bush has postponed his trip to Canada is because of Canada's position on the war.
Why are you so insistant on that? Why is it so hard for you to believe that he would do this? Actions speak louder than words. What other conclusions could we possibly draw, if they aren't denying it?

You'd think he'd at least have PRETENDED to be doing something important and war related rather than so blatantly filling in empty time.


I think it is incumbent on GW to prove that he is not coming to Canada because he has more important things to do, it is not incumbent on Canada to prove that he is snubbing us.
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Old 05-07-2003, 01:15 PM   #19
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Mrs. Edge,

Touché!

C ya!

Marty

P.S. Is it allowed to use that word (Touché)? It is French after all.
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Old 05-07-2003, 01:56 PM   #20
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Oh Mylanta, I knew the resolutions would make their way into this thread.
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Old 05-07-2003, 02:34 PM   #21
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Originally posted by anitram
Oh Mylanta, I knew the resolutions would make their way into this thread.

Don't you mean every thread? LOL
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Old 05-07-2003, 02:45 PM   #22
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no piling on

please
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Old 05-07-2003, 06:05 PM   #23
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OK Sting you just arent getting it.

Take a step back and put yourself into a Canadians shoes.

For years and years the President made his first trip after getting into office to Canada. We are our biggest trading partners we have the biggest free border and we are allies. When Bush came into power he didnt come to Canada he went to Mexico. That pissed some people off. Whatever we can handle that. But when you have been in office for what 2 and a half years or so and havent visited your biggest best neighbour, thats inexcusable. Especially when you have a trip planned and cancel it and go to a lunch with some bussinessmen.

I agree with Bush, Canada should have stood behind him but for a country that has given its troops to the war on terror and has seen no recongnition its digusting.
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Old 05-07-2003, 06:15 PM   #24
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I would expect little else from Mr. Bush. Diplomacy is not a word in his vocabulary.
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Old 05-07-2003, 06:19 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by bonoman
I agree with Bush, Canada should have stood behind him but for a country that has given its troops to the war on terror and has seen no recongnition its digusting.
Exactly. No matter what your viewpoint vis a vis Canada's role in the war, either way this is apallingly bad form.

Also, something else bonoman didn't mention about recognition...a lot of Canadians are still upset that he mentioned almost every country in the world except Canada during his post 9-11 speech despite the ENORMOUS outpouring of affection, assistance, money and support Canada demonstrated. We felt completely invisible. His advisors/speech writers should have known better.

Also, there is a huge faction of Canadians that are like Bonoman and wanted to send troops to Iraq, with large demonstrations of support of the US in general, yet he doesn't seem to acknowledge that either. We can't win!!!

BTW, thank you to everyone who has written supportive things in this thread...it is much appreciated.
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Old 05-07-2003, 07:15 PM   #26
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this is an article from the Orange County Register

my conservative Republican friends consider it a good newspaper
Quote:
Wednesday, May 7, 2003

Bush rewarding supporters of the war against Iraq
Several of the conflict's allies get the president's attention, while critics do not.
By RON HUTCHESON
Knight Ridder Newspapers

WASHINGTON – It's payback time at the White House, and countries around the world are reaping the benefits or paying the price for their stand on the war with Iraq.

The door to the Oval Office is wide open for foreign leaders who backed the war effort led by President George W. Bush, but critics would be lucky to find a spot with Barney, the presidential dog.

The pattern fits Bush's longstanding system of rewarding friends and punishing enemies, but critics say it is only adding to anti-American sentiment abroad, which is already substantial.

"It's petty, and it puts personal animus ahead of the national interest. You lose the high ground when you make it personal," said Lee Feinstein, a State Department official under President Clinton who is now at the Council on Foreign Relations.

In the latest example, Bush signed a free-trade deal with war ally Singapore on Tuesday, while a similar agreement with opponent Chile is stalled.

Today, Bush was to welcome Spanish Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar. On Thursday, he meets with the foreign ministers of Bulgaria, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania, Slovakia and Slovenia - all allies. He also will make time for Sheik Hamad bin Khalifa al-Thani of Qatar, which hosted the U.S. military command during the war, and Danish Prime Minister Anders Fogh Rasmussen, who also endorsed the war.

Opponents shouldn't expect invitations anytime soon.

Bush halted a planned state visit with Canadian Prime Minister Jean Chretien on Monday, citing a busy schedule; Chretien opposed the war. Instead, Bush spent the weekend at his Texas ranch with Australian Prime Minister John Howard, a war backer, and devoted Monday to touting tax cuts in Arkansas.

Mexican President Vicente Fox is also on the outs. Bush's annual Cinco de Mayo message on Monday - the holiday celebrates a Mexican victory over French invaders in 1862 - failed to mention U.S. ties to Mexico, but praised "the many Mexican-Americans serving in our Armed Forces who are working to bring freedom and justice to oppressed people."

In contrast, last year's statement hailed the "strong, vibrant relationship" between the countries. Two years ago, Bush marked the holiday by praising Fox as "a fine man, a man of powerful ideas and a great vision for his country."

The strained ties have derailed plans to liberalize U.S. immigration laws, a Fox priority that was already in doubt because of security concerns raised by the Sept. 11 attacks.

No one ranks lower on the list than President Jacques Chirac of France, which led war opponents at the United Nations and NATO.

Still, there are signs that the freeze will not last forever. Bush says he will attend next month's G-8 summit in France.
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Old 05-07-2003, 07:16 PM   #27
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Mrs. Edge,

If you and the Canadian people are that desperate to have Bush in your country, then I agree he should get his ass up there. But Canada's level of support for US policy around the world has not been to the level of some other countries. I just find it funny that Canada is so pissed off that, a man that most of them write off as an immuture idiot, has not come to their country yet. The depression and anxiety must be overwhelming regardless of the tradition of state visits in the past.
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Old 05-07-2003, 08:22 PM   #28
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Sting, I'm having a hard time trying to decide whether you are being serious or not, and therefore whether I should be provoked by this comment or not. But I will give you the benefit of the doubt.

There is a HUGE difference between being DESPERATE to have him here and wanting to be treated with BASIC RESPECT!!! This is just UNPROFESSIONAL for want of a better word. You would think now more than ever that the US would want Canada on their team, and to start building a more positive image around the world....but this administration doesn't care because they don't have to care. If they don't like something they make your life miserable. Why is this so puzzling to understand? You know, I bet even if we did send troops to Iraq we STILL wouldn't get any credit.

Well, I for one agree with you on one thing (and I do not by any means speak for all Canadians), I think Bush is an arrogant wanker, that is utterly unsuitable to run as important and wonderful a country as the USA. The only good thing he has done that I agree with is the AIDS funding, but even that is full of strings attached. I think the US deserves so much better.

I have no idea therefore why it annoys me so much that he's not coming here, I guess I just worry about the relations between our countries. Things could be so much better, but over this ridiculous petty nonsense, they are going right down hill and I think that's a huge waste.
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Old 05-07-2003, 09:32 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
Mrs. Edge,

If you and the Canadian people are that desperate to have Bush in your country, then I agree he should get his ass up there. But Canada's level of support for US policy around the world has not been to the level of some other countries. I just find it funny that Canada is so pissed off that, a man that most of them write off as an immuture idiot, has not come to their country yet. The depression and anxiety must be overwhelming regardless of the tradition of state visits in the past.
I cant believe I wrote this huge intelligent post and went to post and I lost the entire thing.....anyway...the gist of my comment is that I found your comment to imply that Cdns are snivelling, insignificant little flick..ack..makes me angry...

comments like that insight hatred and riots...comments we dont need...

why cant countries/people just accept support of any kind...why does it need to be measured..why cant it just be accepted...

I wrote alot more.....but it has escaped me at the moment...but what doesnt escape me is the fact that it irked me...and I found it most condescending....

..I know juvenile..but oh well...
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Old 05-07-2003, 09:53 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mrs. Edge
BTW, thank you to everyone who has written supportive things in this thread...it is much appreciated.
I'm always glad to help my Canadian friends.
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