It seems like the last few days have produced some pretty huge admissions of guilt from a couple of Guantanamo Bay "detainees." But with the overall sketchiness of Guantanamo, the terrible treatment the prisoners have received, the ignorance toward the Geneva Convention, the human rights atrocities, the lack of charges brought against most of the prisoners, and again..just the overall sketchiness of Guantanamo Bay----can we really be expected to believe admissions of guilt that come out of the semi-secret military tribunals taking place there??
Can you trust findings of Guantanamo military tribunals?
- Thread starter Utoo
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone that follows U2.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
Oh, but they are terrorists they have no rights. And according to some posters in here it's like summer camp for them.
So don't even worry about it.
So don't even worry about it.
AchtungBono
Refugee
Of course I believe it. They wouldn't be there if they weren't guilty. The government wouldn't condemm innocent men and women.
Until proven otherwise, I believe everything the U.S. government tells me because I know that George Bush wouldn't lie.
Until proven otherwise, I believe everything the U.S. government tells me because I know that George Bush wouldn't lie.
deep
Blue Crack Addict
No I don't trust or believe them very much.
I do believe that KSM was involved in the 911 attack.
the Perle family is skeptical of his confession.
These trials will do the U S no real good.
It seems all the Administration is concerned about is maintaining some credibility with it's gullible base.
If they lose any of more support they will not be able to go on.
I do believe that KSM was involved in the 911 attack.
the Perle family is skeptical of his confession.
These trials will do the U S no real good.
It seems all the Administration is concerned about is maintaining some credibility with it's gullible base.
If they lose any of more support they will not be able to go on.
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
AchtungBono said:
The more and more you post the more and more I think it's one big joke.
How can they be guilty if there's no true evidence or trial? Were they caught with their terrorist photo ID on them? They've already released innocents that were there years, why should you think there aren't more? Seriously that's just scary.
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
Well in context of her other posts, I doubt she's kidding. Unless everything she's posted is just one big joke.
deep
Blue Crack Addict
BonoVoxSupastar said:
The Administration and supporters point to the releases as proof that the process works.
If 30- 50 % are released,
then the remaining prisoners must have good evidence against them.
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
I believe every woman burned by the church was indeed a witch.
She wouldn't have been there if she wasn't guilty.
And why should the church have lied?
Of course I believe every single word a politician says. Why should e.g. Chavez lie, or Castro, or Bush, or Merkel, or Blair?
Politicians lying? Never.
People telling everything when after they have been brutally tortured for hours, and of course it's always the truth.
Why should a woman in the middle age should have said she was a witch when she wasn't?
Why should a man nowadays say he is a terrorist when he wasn't.
I'm sure part of what Sheich Muhammad was the truth, and his involvement in 9/11 probably was.
But that every single word was the truth? No.
AchtungBono, you said you are 48 years old, how can you still be so naive about politicians? Seriously.
Like a German satire magazine quoted:
"And Kennedy! I've strangled Kennedy, too! With the belt of his own bath robe!"
Sheich Muhammad.
She wouldn't have been there if she wasn't guilty.
And why should the church have lied?
Of course I believe every single word a politician says. Why should e.g. Chavez lie, or Castro, or Bush, or Merkel, or Blair?
Politicians lying? Never.
People telling everything when after they have been brutally tortured for hours, and of course it's always the truth.
Why should a woman in the middle age should have said she was a witch when she wasn't?
Why should a man nowadays say he is a terrorist when he wasn't.
I'm sure part of what Sheich Muhammad was the truth, and his involvement in 9/11 probably was.
But that every single word was the truth? No.
AchtungBono, you said you are 48 years old, how can you still be so naive about politicians? Seriously.
Like a German satire magazine quoted:
"And Kennedy! I've strangled Kennedy, too! With the belt of his own bath robe!"
Sheich Muhammad.
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
deep said:
The Administration and supporters point to the releases as proof that the process works.
If 30- 50 % are released,
then the remaining prisoners must have good evidence against them.
And yes that may be justifiable is some backasswards way, but how do they justify to the innocent man that they stole 2 years of his life for no reason?
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
Vincent Vega said:
Well to be fair, they did have those full proof tests. At least they were given a trial.
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Ah, yes, the trial without defense after the torture.
And the full proof tests were really great.
And the full proof tests were really great.
deep
Blue Crack Addict
BonoVoxSupastar said:
How bad is it really?
He got three hala (Muslim) meals a day?
He got a Koran and prayer rug with a directional arrow to Mecca for his five times a day praying.
He was detained for a good reason.
Why was he in a "Madrassa" in Pakistan?
We may never really know for sure.
But, now he is free again.
If he was detained by Muslims
most likely his head and body would be in different geografic locations.
Life is not perfect.
But, have you noticed we have not had another 911 attack?
So, I guess I will bitch a little less when I have to take my shoes off at the airport.
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Yes, and he received free water boarding every now and then.
And he could feel like a heretic, a Muslim Giordano Bruno so to speak.
And he could feel like a heretic, a Muslim Giordano Bruno so to speak.
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
Well I've heard the directional arrow was pointing in the opposite direction, so Mecca wasn't getting his messages. And that's the real reason we haven't had another 911 attack.
Brilliant move by our beloved administration.
Brilliant move by our beloved administration.
verte76
Blue Crack Addict
AchtungBono said:
Excuse me, George Bush lied about WMD to start the war.
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
Ah, he just interpreted the information he had a bit different. 
dazzlingamy
Refugee
I hope Actung Bono is just one big joke, because if they are a real living breathing human thinking like that - i'm scared!
Our most prolific person over there is David Hicks - this country doesn't seem to give a fuck, and think he deserves what he gets, but my thoughts are think
This dude fought and learnt with the taliban, but was not involved with the war back in 2001/2002 but rather was support. Why there is he charged with treason? Can a person born in one country not defect to another through his own rights? Why do we even care he is with the taliban? Sure they are bastards to women and shiut, but why should we tell him what he can? If he wanted to live in Afghanistan and be apart of them, who are we to stop him? I don't understand the charges against him? He didn't kill anyone. I also don't understand people's apathy when we all know he's been helf for 5 years without trial - been tortured and spent a YEAR in solitary confinment. I mean can you even imagine that?
I don't have much respect for the us administration, but i have absolutely none for the hypocritical ones.
Our most prolific person over there is David Hicks - this country doesn't seem to give a fuck, and think he deserves what he gets, but my thoughts are think
This dude fought and learnt with the taliban, but was not involved with the war back in 2001/2002 but rather was support. Why there is he charged with treason? Can a person born in one country not defect to another through his own rights? Why do we even care he is with the taliban? Sure they are bastards to women and shiut, but why should we tell him what he can? If he wanted to live in Afghanistan and be apart of them, who are we to stop him? I don't understand the charges against him? He didn't kill anyone. I also don't understand people's apathy when we all know he's been helf for 5 years without trial - been tortured and spent a YEAR in solitary confinment. I mean can you even imagine that?
I don't have much respect for the us administration, but i have absolutely none for the hypocritical ones.
A_Wanderer
ONE love, blood, life
Thats the exact same type of thinking that says that Saddam having WMD is a slam dunk, theres a reason why Al Gore, Joseph Wilson etc. opposed the war because they thought WMD would be used against coalition forces.verte76 said:
AchtungBono
Refugee
verte76 said:
He didn't lie about the WMD, the information he was given turned out to be faulty.
George W.Bush is a great leader, although I'm afraid that this will only become apparent many years from now when the war on terror is won.
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
AchtungBono said:
Will never happen with the current methods. You don't kill an idea by torturing and killing people.
MrsSpringsteen
Blue Crack Addict
The war on terror will never be won, terrorism will always exist.
AchtungBono
Refugee
BonoVoxSupastar said:
Hi BVS,
I assure you my posts about GWB are totally serious. I admire that man so much for what he's trying to do, I just wish more people would take off their blinders and see what I see - a man who almost single-handedly is fighting a near-impossible war against terrorists who don't give a damm about who they kill (as shown on 9/11). A man who finally has the guts to stand up to the criminals and make their lives a lot harder.
It's quite simple really - good Vs. Evil - what's so hard to understand? Why would anyone want the bad guys to win? (not that YOU or anyone else on this board want the bad guys to win......).
I've been living in Israel for nearly 40 years and the fight against terrorism is a way of life here - I totally understand what GWB is trying to do and I can only hope that he continues the fight.
Irvine511
Blue Crack Supplier
AchtungBono said:
while i agree that there is a threat of islamist terror, and the "bad guys" are every bit as bad as GWB thinks they are, i think it's also 100% reasonable to hold the position that nearly all of GWB's policies are making the threat from these monsters much, much worse. GWB and Co. have become the best recruiting tool the Islamist terrorists could have ever wished for. this isn't a case of my taking off the blinders; i see this threat, and i know what it can do because i know people who were killed and nearly killed on 9-11. i simply disagree that what GWB is doing is remotely effective in keeping me, and you, safe.
also, invading Iraq has nothing to do with fighting terrorism. we've had that made abundantly clear in FYM by the only man in America who thinks things are going smashingly well over there.
Vincent Vega
Rock n' Roll Doggie ALL ACCESS
AchtungBono said:
No, that's not right.
He knew that the information were wrong, or not safe, and despite this knowledge he sold this as facts.
As Irvine said, the Iraq war can't be equated to the war on terror, as the ties of Saddam to the terrorists are just made up
And tell me, where is the secret genius i fighting the hydra the way Bush is doing it.
You should know from the Hamas, or the Fatah, that such organisations really are a hydra. And Bush even started to try to fight several hydras simultaneously.
The only thing his actions have created is a rising support of extremists in the middle east.
And still I can't believe any person could ever believe that any politician never lies.
And I can even less understand how people can think that torture and kicking human rights, for which millions of people have died, is a good thing.
You can't claim moral superiority when you do the exact same thing as your enemy.
BoMac
Self-righteous bullshitter
AchtungBono said:
It's exactly this type of black and white thinking that has gotten us to the point where we are now and the reason why if current tactics don't change the "war on terror" will never be won.
In the terrorists eyes they are good and we are evil "The Great Satan", which is only natural from a human nature point of view. So we have to find a way to show them otherwise and invading a foreign country on false pretenses is not exactly the best way to do it.
Last edited:
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
AchtungBono said:
I feel for those that have to deal with this day in and day out, but the information you've been sold is just propaganda and BS. From what ever you've gathered on the O'Reiley factor and Fox News isn't the whole truth.
You've mentioned in almost every post 9/11 and Iraq. They have nothing to do with each other, and yet you never come back and dispute that whenever anyone points that out to you. You keep posting it as if it's fact. IT ISN'T FACT, NO WHERE NEAR!!!
verte76
Blue Crack Addict
AchtungBono said:
You've got to be joking. The guy's on the verge of being impeached. His attorney general is in big time trouble, and Congress is going to subpoena the President's top aides. Who knows what's going to happen to the President after this? He'll be the Lame Duck From Hell.
INDY500
Rock n' Roll Doggie Band-aid
AchtungBono said:
Well stated.
Post 9/11, many Americans reacted with hand wringing guilt and asked "Why do they hate us?" "Our unflinching and steadfast support of Israel" being one of their most common answers.
Maybe not realizing that more Jews live in America than in Israel.
But certainly, failing to recognize America's obligations to back Israel against the Fascist states and sadistic fanatics who wish to terrorize and ultimately destroy them.
Anyway, regardless of the current "confessions" of these detainees, can there be any doubt that they wanted to kill as many Americans as they could?
