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Old 07-06-2007, 01:00 PM   #346
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Quote:
Originally posted by Varitek
I know it's been asked upthread, but can we ignore comparisons of numbers of pardons given out by Clinton or whatever and look at this specific issue, in the context of this administration and its policies at home and abroad? Is that too much to ask, to have an on-topic, reasonable debate? You can still defend the decision, you just need to find ground to stand on within the parameters of what this debate actually is about.
But think about it, is there really any defense of the decision other than straying from the topic?
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Old 07-06-2007, 01:30 PM   #347
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^

No....that's kind of what I want them to realize by actually discussing the topic...
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Old 07-06-2007, 01:51 PM   #348
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I don't think anyone has posted that Bush did not have the Constitutional Right to bail out Libby.

The Mark Rich pardon by Clinton was widely condemned. There were not a lot on Democrats rising to defend it.


I do remember there was quite a bit of talk, especially by Republicans to try and change the "pardon" program. To prevent the "appearance' of pardons influence by politics.

The Bush/ Cheney Administration jumped all over the Republicans in congress to squash it.

For those who want to keep comparing with Clinton, please show me where Clinton commuted a sentence for someone associated him or with his Administration.
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Old 07-06-2007, 01:53 PM   #349
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As well as commuting before the sentence was served at all, which was described as "unprecedented."
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:14 PM   #350
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Originally posted by phillyfan26


But think about it, is there really any defense of the decision other than straying from the topic?
It's in the Constitution. Just like we have Freedom of Speech, the President has the right to do that. As we can protest, he can issue commutals. That's the way life goes. Sorry.
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:18 PM   #351
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How utterly regal.
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:20 PM   #352
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struckpx,

why do you think he ordered the commute?
why do you think libby lied?

p.s. responses which contain the words: democrat, friend, and clinton aren't allowed
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:20 PM   #353
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Quote:
Originally posted by Varitek
^

No....that's kind of what I want them to realize by actually discussing the topic...
Well, lock the thread. No point of discussing then.
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:20 PM   #354
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Originally posted by struckpx


It's in the Constitution.
How convenient that this President gets to treat the Constitution like his own personal toilet to shit all over when he wants, and invoke it when it suits him.
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:22 PM   #355
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Quote:
Originally posted by unico
struckpx,

why do you think he ordered the commute?
why do you think libby lied?

p.s. responses which contain the words: democrat, friend, and clinton aren't allowed
I direct you to my last one. And if we are unwilling to provide arguments and counterarguments, than might as well stop arguing. I know its hard to believe that Clinton was a terrible president and many of you are unwilling to face that, but don't make yourselves look foolish by not accepting the different facts provided. I am proving a point that you are unwilling to look into b/c of political views that are blurred.
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:23 PM   #356
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Originally posted by anitram


How convenient that this President gets to treat the Constitution like his own personal toilet to shit all over when he wants, and invoke it when it suits him.
Yes, that is exactly why he has it.
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:23 PM   #357
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Originally posted by struckpx

I know its hard to believe that Clinton was a terrible president and many of you are unwilling to face that, but don't make yourselves look foolish by not accepting the different facts provided.
I see you're from the diamond school of debate. Good to know!
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:24 PM   #358
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Quote:
Originally posted by struckpx


I direct you to my last one. And if we are unwilling to provide arguments and counterarguments, than might as well stop arguing. I know its hard to believe that Clinton was a terrible president and many of you are unwilling to face that, but don't make yourselves look foolish by not accepting the different facts provided. I am proving a point that you are unwilling to look into b/c of political views that are blurred.
quite the contrary. i'm asking you two simple questions that you refuse to answer. who is being unwilling?
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:25 PM   #359
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Originally posted by anitram


I see you're from the diamond school of debate. Good to know!
I am from the school of reality, the one where logic is applied with reality. The President must have some authority. W/out it, he would have no power and we would not need a president. The court system would become corrupt and could rule whatever it wanted.
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:25 PM   #360
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Originally posted by unico


quite the contrary. i'm asking you two simple questions that you refuse to answer. who is being unwilling?
Everyone. You are not willing to accept any of my arguments while they are very logical. Have you even read my thread? I think you stopped reading once you saw the name Clinton.
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