Bra Check

[doctorwho]

I think you're missing the point which is why a check in the first place. If you tell everyone to wear a bra, fine. If someone walks in and it's obvious someone's not, then make a complaint. Innocent until proven guilty. But you don't have to pat everyone down everyday and lift their shirt if you can't find a clasp. It's like those parents who ask their child if they made poopy in their pants and when the parent doesn't believe them they check for themselves in front of their playmates. These people are adults and need to be treated as such, not babies with diapers.

Now is it worth 9 mil, probably not, but that's mostly the lawyers fault.

O.K., last post in this thread.

I comprehend your point - and I agree that this bra-checking policy seems asinine. Nonetheless, it exists. Unfortunately, we don't know all the facts. But maybe there's a darn good reason for the policy and the daily check.

However, your point about "adults not being children" is not only irrelevant but incorrect. In fact, adults need to be checked far more often than children! Adults know that certain jobs require safety gear and special clothes and protection, yet often they don't wear it - usually for reasons of inconvenience. Yet, a safety officer or supervisor will (or should) enforce the policies. Same is true here. For example, perhaps the women at this employer need bras for a safety reasons, but a few women might have disregarded this policy. They were injured. So now the management was forced to institute this bra-checking policy, rather than trust their "adult" employees. It may be humiliating, but far better than getting hurt and losing $$ or more.

But as I wrote, we don't know both sides of this story.

 

[Liesje]

I really don't know how I feel about this. I think if my boss ever told me he needed to verify I was wearing a bra, I'd laugh so hard I'd piss my pants! Also, I don't know why any woman would not wear a bra to work in the first place.

 

[Dreadsox]

I think if my boss ever told me he needed to verify I was wearing a bra, I'd laugh so hard I'd piss my pants!

Time for a depends check!

 

[U2democrat]

What do men over 50 wear? Boxers? Briefs? Depends...

 

[LJT]

What do men over 50 wear? Boxers? Briefs? Depends...

A monkey helper

Multi purpose and they clean up all the oopsies

 

[beegee]

while i think the idea of these women being asked to prove that they were wearing bras was wrong, i'm wondering why on earth a woman would feel the need to lift up her entire shirt to do so.

a woman can very easily prove that they are wearing a bra by simply pulling aside the collar of her sweater or blouse and exposing a single strap.

lifting up the entire shirt is not only extreme, but completely unnecessary.

 

[WildHoneyAlways]

I comprehend your point - and I agree that this bra-checking policy seems asinine. Nonetheless, it exists. Unfortunately, we don't know all the facts. But maybe there's a darn good reason for the policy and the daily check.

I don't see a reason why a supervisor should ever touch a female employee to check if she is wearing a bra.

What a bizarre policy.

 

[Angela Harlem]

while i think the idea of these women being asked to prove that they were wearing bras was wrong, i'm wondering why on earth a woman would feel the need to lift up her entire shirt to do so.

a woman can very easily prove that they are wearing a bra by simply pulling aside the collar of her sweater or blouse and exposing a single strap.

lifting up the entire shirt is not only extreme, but completely unnecessary.

yep. two wrongs by the sounds of it. 3 wrongs actually, if you include the excessive suit which followed. none cancel out another. they're wrong independantly.

 

[cell]

why would any woman show up to work not wearing a bra in the first place? i dont understand that concept. but im not against it either. i just think its wierd.

 

[joyfulgirl]

Some women don't need them. One of my friends has never even owned one in her whole life and she has a pretty big corporate job.

 

[joyfulgirl]

lifting up the entire shirt is not only extreme, but completely unnecessary.

I'd have just looked my boss in the eye and said "I'm wearing a bra and you'll just have to take my word for it."

It's possible I might also have just said, "Fuck you" if I were financially able to lose the job.

 

[Angela Harlem]

ooh, that's true. I hadn't thought of that, as mine I rent out to farmers in peak season to use as wind socks.



But seriously, some women are more petite than shetland pony sized me and can luckily get away with it.


Still...kick in the nuts for anyone who decides they have a business in enquiring about my boosie holders!

 

[lmjhitman]

oh man, i WISH i could get someone to check if i was wearing a bra.

and if he looked like orlando bloom, that would be ok too.

 

[LJT]

I can just imagine Todd from Scrubs reading this conversation

 

[Carmelu2fan]

This is insane. What does wearing a bra have to do with job performance? Nothing, if you ask me.

Amen...if you look and notice a gal has no bra on ...by all means overt your eyes...go on with you work and your life!

 

[nbcrusader]

Amen...if you look and notice a gal has no bra on ...by all means overt your eyes...go on with you work and your life!

Dress codes are not driven by job performance. There are other factors considered. Otherwise, many of us could show up to work in robes and fuzzy slippers.

 

[Lila64]

If the bra issue was policy of the nursing home and they were questioning whether or not she was wearing one, she should have been called aside or into a supervisors office where a same-sex higher-up could have seen if the woman in question was compliant. This lawsuit sounds ridiculous...

 

[Carmelu2fan]

oh man, i WISH i could get someone to check if i was wearing a bra.

and if he looked like orlando bloom, that would be ok too.

 

[Angela Harlem]

Dress codes are not driven by job performance. There are other factors considered. Otherwise, many of us could show up to work in robes and fuzzy slippers.

Dress codes are for appearance or safety. Neither is affected by wearing a bra. There is NO justification for checking someone's underwear. You'd be spitting chips if it were your wife.

 

[doctorwho]

I disagree Angela Harlem - to an extent.

There can be a safety reason for a bra code. I'm not sure what it is, but there could be one. From the sound of the article, it did appear it was a female supervisor doing the checking, not a perverted male figurehead. And if this dress code rule was there for a while, it's not like the woman suddenly didn't know.

However, there are a lot of things we don't know. Is this a safety reason or a professional one? If the latter, at what point can one dictate what an employee wears? Was it indeed a female supervisor? If not, that alone is a problem. How long was this policy in place and why is it there? If it's something brand new that exists because *one* patient complained about a bra-less woman, then that's going overboard and is ridiculous. And how is this bra-check done? Is it as "professional" a touch as it could be? How often are women asked to raise their shirts?

I'm not a fan of the bra-check at all, but as there may be reasons for it and as the policy may have been in place for a LONG time, I need more facts.

Still $9M is ridiculous.

 

[Angela Harlem]

She is a nurse doctorwho. What on earth can you disagree with. How is it ever possibly justified to be wanting to know the details of someone's underwear? Go and think of a good reason why anyone has the right to check someone's bra, and you can have a reason for disagreeing.

And I do agree the 9 million is ridiculous. Everything about this is ridiculous.

 

[doctorwho]

I said I disagree in that *IF* this "bra-check" policy was in place BEFORE the woman started, then she has no right to suddenly complain. It's kind of like taking a job and suddenly complaining that you have to wear certain shoes or no shorts or protective gear - and that you will be reprimanded for it if you fail to follow the policy.

Now, I'm not saying this is a good policy. My guess is that at one point there was a nurse who didn't wear a bra and patients complained. It could have been some over-sensitive prude who felt it was "just wrong". Or there could have been a safety issue involved. I don't know! And neither do you. Therefore, until ALL the facts are know, I can't fully agree with you. Yes, the policy sounds absurd. But there may be reasons and the policy may have existed for a while.

I just know that if I worked at a place that had some undergarment checking policy, I know I'd be upset. If I wasn't informed of this policy prior to my hiring and if I left another position because of it, I would sue as well. Maybe not for $9M though... I'd go for $20M.

 

[For Honor]

while i think the idea of these women being asked to prove that they were wearing bras was wrong, i'm wondering why on earth a woman would feel the need to lift up her entire shirt to do so.

a woman can very easily prove that they are wearing a bra by simply pulling aside the collar of her sweater or blouse and exposing a single strap.

lifting up the entire shirt is not only extreme, but completely unnecessary.

 

[Angela Harlem]

The only safety/health issue with bras I can think of is long term tissue damage when they're not worn when they should be. But that is not the place of the employer to make bones about.

All I know and ca say for certain, is any bra checking policy IS absurd, and this woman is equally as absurd as she clearly had no qualms in lifting her shirt to show her bra (which takes a great deal of alcohol for me to do likewise). I cant help but wonder just how traumatised she actually was. If it was 9 million worth, then I'd think the odds are you are not in the frame of mind to be so brazen upon the request with the 'showing'.

 

[For Honor]

I'm sure if a guy wanted to see some funbags, he could have easily paid <$100 at his local strip joint for some fun.

Not that I really know anything about that, in all reality.

But I figure I'd get out my "Male Chauvenist Comment Of The Day". It's been a while since I had one of those.

$9 mill?
I sympathize with her - med bills are a lot these days

But she wasn't exactly forced into Playboy, neither, so I think that's a rather large payday. But of course we're beating dead horses here, aren't we.


I wonder, really, if this lady had anything worth looking at



*bracingmyselfforsomeonetogetoffended*

 

[Sherry Darling]

I said I disagree in that *IF* this "bra-check" policy was in place BEFORE the woman started, then she has no right to suddenly complain. It's kind of like taking a job and suddenly complaining that you have to wear certain shoes or no shorts or protective gear - and that you will be reprimanded for it if you fail to follow the policy.

Now, I'm not saying this is a good policy. My guess is that at one point there was a nurse who didn't wear a bra and patients complained. It could have been some over-sensitive prude who felt it was "just wrong". Or there could have been a safety issue involved. I don't know! And neither do you. Therefore, until ALL the facts are know, I can't fully agree with you. Yes, the policy sounds absurd. But there may be reasons and the policy may have existed for a while.

I just know that if I worked at a place that had some undergarment checking policy, I know I'd be upset. If I wasn't informed of this policy prior to my hiring and if I left another position because of it, I would sue as well. Maybe not for $9M though... I'd go for $20M.

You're arguement is pretty vague and weak, to be frank, Dr. We can only judge by the facts we have (if someone has another article on this, by all means, post away!). You admit your self you can't imagine a safety reason for a bra-code. And by the logic of your 1st paragraph applied consistently, no one would be able to advocate for better labor standards.

Those who are (ok, sorta half-heartedly ) defending this policy need to deal with its gender-specific nature, as well.

Lifting the shirts entirely does make sense if you view it as a form of protest. Not saying that I would, mind you

 

[Liesje]

The only reason I can think of to require someone in her position to wear a bra is b/c she probably has to lean over people a lot when she's helping them, or maybe they're uncomfortable being held against her.....but neither of those have anything to do with safety...and really even if you lean over someone with a bra on, you can still see a lot...

 

[dandy]

I'm sure if a guy wanted to see some funbags, he could have easily paid <$100 at his local strip joint for some fun.

Not that I really know anything about that, in all reality.

But I figure I'd get out my "Male Chauvenist Comment Of The Day". It's been a while since I had one of those.

$9 mill?
I sympathize with her - med bills are a lot these days

But she wasn't exactly forced into Playboy, neither, so I think that's a rather large payday. But of course we're beating dead horses here, aren't we.


I wonder, really, if this lady had anything worth looking at



*bracingmyselfforsomeonetogetoffended*

"funbags"?

strip clubs?

Playboy?

"worth looking at"?

your immature ramblings about breasts have no relevance and no place in this thread.

 

[For Honor]

Very good - that was the theme of the post.

I suppose it would be more mature of me to take "serious" a stance about making an issue about something no one here knows about. But I decided not to.

I still think some people *want* to get offended about things. Why not submit an easy target once in a while?


===


Just so everyone still remembers the rather small article:

Bra Check Spurs Nursing Home Worker to Sue


ELIZABETHTOWN, N.Y.

A former nursing home worker has filed a $9 million federal lawsuit against an upstate county, claiming she's suffered mental anguish and needs anti-anxiety medication after being forced to prove she was wearing a bra at work.

Karen Tenney claims in the lawsuit against Essex County that a supervisor at the Horace Nye Nursing Home where she worked placed her hand on the back of Tenney's sweater to feel for a bra clasp.

When a clasp wasn't found, Tenney, a dietary aide, pulled up her sweater to show she was wearing a black sports bra. The move triggered other workers inside the dietary unit to show off the bras they were wearing.

"I feel that the actions of those involved constitute sexual harassment under federal and state law," Tenney said in court papers. "I have been constructively terminated by the actions of ... my employer and (the) failure to stop this harassment."

The undergarment check happened in April after nursing home officials received a complaint that Tenney was not wearing a bra as required by county policy.

Besides Essex County, which is in the Adirondacks, Tenney also names in her lawsuit the nursing home, county Attorney Richard Meyer and the state Civil Service Employees Union.

"We contend the suit is without merit," Meyer said.

==

Karen Tenney claims in the lawsuit against Essex County that a supervisor at the Horace Nye Nursing Home where she worked placed her hand on the back of Tenney's sweater to feel for a bra clasp.

When a clasp wasn't found, Tenney, a dietary aide, pulled up her sweater to show she was wearing a black sports bra. The move triggered other workers inside the dietary unit to show off the bras they were wearing.

"I feel that the actions of those involved constitute sexual harassment under federal and state law," Tenney said

So...... she is upset that someone placed a hand on the back of her sweater??

Now, let's speculate about something.... I would bet that it was a woman who issued the complaint about there not being bras. It could have been a guy, but let's be sterotypical for a moment, and say it was a woman, offended about another woman not wearing a bra. And then, because of this offensive lack of bras, a bra check is conducted. Which, I would assume, is what was wanted, a feasible way to go about making sure people wear bras. Now, because something fishy happens on a bra check, lo and behold someone else is offended, and in protest, actually reveals her bra?? And then sues someone for making her reveal her bra? or.... or something? We don't even know what she is sueing for?

Does anyone know what she is sueing for?
specifically??


Really......
I don't see how you can take this seriously.
I guess I have nothing more to say in this thread. I'm kind of impressed that it's gone to 6 pages...

 

[dandy]

I still think some people *want* to get offended about things.

and i think some people actively try to offend, say by referring to breasts as "funbags."

trolling isn't looked upon favourably around here.