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Old 12-13-2006, 06:38 PM   #16
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Life is too short to read books by people I think are full of shit.

I'm reading a book about the aurora borealis right now. Before that, the Kolb Brothers' book about their 1911 boat trip down the Colorado River.
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Old 12-13-2006, 06:42 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha
Life is too short to read books by people I think are full of shit.

I'm reading a book about the aurora borealis right now. Before that, the Kolb Brothers' book about their 1911 boat trip down the Colorado River.


but i bet those books don't make you feel ... OUTRAGE!!!
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Old 12-13-2006, 06:47 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511
O'Reilly positions himself as some sort of avenging angel of the working class, a dumbed-down moralizing version of Lou Dobbs -- where Lou worries about jobs, Bill is concerned with cowboys kissing in a tent.
I believe that O'Reilly is intrigued that movies such as "Brokeback Mountain" can become a media sensation, while some of his own bestselling books are not reviewed in the NYT.

And although according to your analysis, Bill may appear to be very troubled about "cowboys kissing in tent," his position regarding gay marriage and civil unions is very similar to Barack Obama's and Hillary Clinton's.
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Old 12-13-2006, 06:52 PM   #19
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Originally posted by Bluer White
I believe that O'Reilly is intrigued that movies such as "Brokeback Mountain" can become a media sensation, while some of his own bestselling books are not reviewed in the NYT.



are you really comparing an Oscar winning film that was widely regarded -- by everyone but the Academy, incidentally -- as the best movie of 2005, as well as a profound cultural moment, with a book by Bill O'Reilly? on what grounds do we evaluate O'Reilly's books? does Hannity get reviewed? Coulter? G. Gordon Liddy? Limbaugh? likewise, does Michael Moore get reviewed (books, not his movies)?

and think about how incredibly self-absorbed and self-serving that sentence is for O'Reilly.


Quote:
And although according to your analysis, Bill may appear to be very troubled about "cowboys kissing in tent," his position regarding gay marriage and civil unions is very similar to Barack Obama's and Hillary Clinton's.
while i agree that his position on gay marriage/unions is quite mainstream, his whole "eww, gross! i'm not gonna see THAT movie! makes me uncomfortable" was immature for even a high school locker room.

and this gets at the problem. it's O'Reilly's delivery that's become more important than his actual stance, and that's due to his own carefully constructed image.

i know he drips with heterosexuality and white male Americanness -- and, really, who does Bill speak for other than white straight christian male americans of moderate incomes? -- but i suppose he'd feel better cozying up to a loofah.
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Old 12-13-2006, 06:55 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511
but i bet those books don't make you feel ... OUTRAGE!!!


No.
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Old 12-13-2006, 07:13 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha
Life is too short to read books by people I think are full of shit.
I'm wondering what specific policies you disagree with O'Reilly on?

Or you do simply despise his public persona, the way he delivers his point of view, and his money-grubbing capitalistic tendencies? (which are all legitimate reasons to dislike him, by the way)
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Old 12-13-2006, 07:21 PM   #22
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Originally posted by boosterjuice


Why?
There have been threads upon threads that shine light on his hypocracy and all other bullshit, feel no need to elaborate.
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Old 12-13-2006, 07:29 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511



erm, not me -- we've discussed him before, and my objections to him are less his POVs but his excessive merchandising and self-promotion. that, and his show rests on easy, easy "outrage" on issues like (gasp!) pedophile priests or that some movies (gasp!) shouldn't be watched by children. i've put him above Coulter and Hannity, yet neither of them have been accused of sexual harassment and had to settle out of court ...

O'Reilly positions himself as some sort of avenging angel of the working class, a dumbed-down moralizing version of Lou Dobbs -- where Lou worries about jobs, Bill is concerned with cowboys kissing in a tent.
Come on Irvine, you're overstating things.

O'Rielly offers far more coverage than pedophiles and cowboys kissing. I wish more media personalities were as vocal and passionate as he is.
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Old 12-13-2006, 07:36 PM   #24
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Originally posted by Bluer White
Or you do simply despise his public persona, the way he delivers his point of view, and his money-grubbing capitalistic tendencies?
That would be it, yes.
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Old 12-13-2006, 07:47 PM   #25
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Re: Book Review: Bill O'Rielly's "Culture Warrior"

Quote:
Originally posted by boosterjuice


Bill O'Rielly has clearly outlined that America is in the midst of a culture war. On the one side, the "secular progressives" are attacking judeo-christian heritage while the "traditionalists" are standing on the sidelines and, in effect, letting their cherished values diminish. Bill calls on the traditional forces to mobilize and become traditional warriors in order to save the country.
This sounds so patently absurd that if it's a summary of the book's contents, I'd rather scrub my toilet than read it.

It's so ridiculous that I have to wonder if it's meant to be taken as a satire.
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Old 12-13-2006, 07:53 PM   #26
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Bill O'Reilly.... lol.
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Old 12-13-2006, 07:58 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by boosterjuice

I wish more media personalities were as vocal and passionate as he is.


i really disagree with you here.

i wish the news hadn't gotten so emotionalist and filled with "truthiness" -- is something true because i looked it up in a book, or because i feel it in my gut?

do you watch Stephen Colbert?

he's a send-up of O'Reilly, and a brilliant one at that.
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Old 12-13-2006, 11:18 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511
do you watch Stephen Colbert?

he's a send-up of O'Reilly, and a brilliant one at that.
And waaaaaay sexier.
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Old 12-14-2006, 02:44 AM   #29
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I like chatter in the background so I often have talk radio on at work and sometimes at home, and since talk radio means rightwing radio (My local station has a liberal morning program followed by 13 straight hours of rightwing --local, Rush, Hannity, O'Reilly, Savage and then 7 hours of supernatural/conspiracy theory/pseudoscience) I'm pretty well versed first hand.

O'Reilly was smart enough to not hang his hat on one political party so didn't have to do credibility straining cartwheels or make absolutely absurd statements which would lose your possibly rightleaning but not quite true believer audience. He was smart enough not to focus on the conservative vs. liberal philosophy. Instead he couched it in traditional vs. secular progressive, gut issues. (He's puts himself on the side of the traditionalists--no surprise there.) Rush and Hannity's fortunes lie with the Republicans' performance (or perceived performance) and their shows border on almost pure propaganda. O'Reilly has left himself escape hatches. If the Republicans up and start murdering children, Rush and Hannity will have to scramble to convince their audience that murdering children has some kind of moral superiority. O'Reilly's not in danger of that.

(I don't have access to much leftwing talk radio, but suspect if I did, I would feel much the same way about it that I do about
most rightwing radio--preaching to the choir, demonizing or ridiculing the opposition, part of some wise club that they flatter their audience as being part of.)

I find O'Reilly tolerable. He gives a fairly pragmatic image. He comes across as intelligent, moderate, hardnosed, less of a pure ideologue. He also comes across as condescending ("looking out for the folks") paranoid with a persecution complex--I can't tell you how many segments of his program he has dedicated to vilifying somebody who criticized him or didn't give him the proper deference he thought he was due. With a colossal ego and a stance that only he will tell you the whole truth. According to him, he wins every argument (And the occasional kneejerk, stupid idea of readying his audience to boycott Canada if he deems it necessary--he likes to ready his audience to do his bidding, lol)

I've read a couple of his books (not the fiction ones) and found them readable and lightweight. I didn't hear anything different from his radio program and would suspect that would be the case with "Culture Warrior". (My father has the book. I can't say I won't read it if I need a light read) On the surface, he makes an OK case. You can get warm and fuzzy and nostalgic and weepy about the traditional and can get outraged about judges who hand out light sentences to child molesters or fearful about some agenda he thinks the secular progressives are promoting. But he presents it as an either/or choice. Not being an either/or person, I'm not particularly swayed. Like anyone presenting a case, we're not getting the whole truth. Maybe it is the truth as he perceives it (or not). Whatever. It sells.

Maybe you can use it as a discussion point, but it's not the end of the discussion. I don't totally discount him, like I do Rush or Hannity, but I don't buy the whole package either.

Like Irvine pointed out, he's got a successful brand and everything is orchestrated to keep that brand successful. There is spin in that no spin zone. You'd be foolish to think there isn't.
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Old 12-14-2006, 06:36 AM   #30
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Re: Book Review: Bill O'Rielly's "Culture Warrior"

Quote:
Originally posted by boosterjuice


Bill calls on the traditional forces to mobilize and become traditional warriors in order to save the country.
This is so wrong, on so many levels.

Bill wants a real true civil war. He wants to see libruls dying in the streets from gunfire. In what way does he differ from the eliminationist fascism of Ann Coulter and all the rest who are busy feeding the fires of hate?

What do these people stand for, beyond white-hot rage and hatred toward, well I'm not sure toward what.... plenty of genuine old-time conservatives would have little in common with their raving rhetoric.

One day, if Bill and the rest of us are unlucky, his culture war might turn hot. What then? Do you want to be a 'traditional warrior', Boosterjuice? Can I have some of what you're drinking?

I take people like Bill O'Reilly very seriously indeed... and I am terrified. OF them.
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