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Old 04-27-2005, 12:07 PM   #181
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Old 04-27-2005, 12:11 PM   #182
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511

to be fair, i think 80s did say that he didn't think it was a literal choice but something more complex.
Thanks.
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Old 04-27-2005, 12:12 PM   #183
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Originally posted by Snuffleupagus
80'sU2, I'd just like to say that I appreciate your posts. As a person sharing the same views, I've enjoyed being able to see someone else discuss them intelligently and in a christ-centered way. Thanks
Thanks a lot, Snuf!
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Old 04-27-2005, 12:17 PM   #184
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Originally posted by Irvine511


1. ugh. good gosh, of course i don't think ALL christians are Jerry Fallwell and have said this repeatedly. in fact, you'll see just how complex and diverse i understand the christian community to be if you read about how i've written that FYM has changed my perceptions. i've always been speaking about political christianity, at least how it is practiced by evangelical protestants in this country, and i'm not skirting the issue -- i'm explaining my position.
I understand now. That's a big difference then, and is at the root of the misunderstanding. When I think of the term "Christian", I don't think of it in political terms at all; I always think of it in theological terms.

Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511

3. you're more than free to share your views, and i'd be interested to hear them. if you'd like, i won't even respond. but i would also add that no one in medicine, psychology or social science would agree with you.
No one? Not one? You don't think there's even one psychologist, doctor or scientist that thinks homosexuality isn't "hard-wired"?
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Old 04-27-2005, 12:37 PM   #185
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jamila
Wasn't this thread about Bono's view point about fundamentalists?
It was, but of course the number one rule in FYM is that every thread must turn into a discussion about homosexuality.
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Old 04-27-2005, 12:40 PM   #186
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Quote:
Originally posted by 80sU2isBest


I understand now. That's a big difference then, and is at the root of the misunderstanding. When I think of the term "Christian", I don't think of it in political terms at all; I always think of it in theological terms.



No one? Not one? You don't think there's even one psychologist, doctor or scientist that thinks homosexuality isn't "hard-wired"?


1. glad that's cleared up, and i apologize if i didn't make that more clear

2. no, not really. i'm sure you could find an individual, or you could find someone who might be termed a "christian psychologist," but no accredited group within the medical community would agree with you.

to say "hardwired," however, is not to say that there's a specific gay gene -- that probably doesn't exist. but it is to say that there is a very strong genetic component to homosexuality.
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Old 04-27-2005, 12:42 PM   #187
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Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
It was, but of course the number one rule in FYM is that every thread must turn into a discussion about homosexuality.

That explains why my large post on the last page didn't even make a dent.....

(throws hands up)
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Old 04-27-2005, 02:51 PM   #188
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
It was, but of course the number one rule in FYM is that every thread must turn into a discussion about homosexuality.
sorry, I just have to throw my two cents in and agree

number two rule - all Christians feel, think, and act in a certain way- most likely a negative way

Or maybe more accurately, I'm not sure all Catholics
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Old 04-27-2005, 03:04 PM   #189
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jamila
Wasn't this thread about Bono's view point about fundamentalists?

I just got this book the other day and am SO GRATEFUL that Bono has finally put IN HIS OWN WORDS his feelings about many things, especially about his take on Christianity and the responsibilities of Christians to do good to others (especially the poor) and not to judge others.

I think his words will not make many fundamentalists who wanted to brand Bono as one of their own very happy.

I agree with Bono.
Are we ignoring the positive things Bono had to say about fundamentalist Christians
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Old 04-27-2005, 03:06 PM   #190
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Originally posted by U2democrat
several churches of my denomination are in ohio (i think) so if you see any "christian church disciples of christ" you should definitely check it out. we're good liberals
Also check out Churches that belong to the United Church of Christ.

UCC.org

I think U2dem pointed out that they are related somehow too.
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Old 04-27-2005, 03:26 PM   #191
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dreadsox
Are we ignoring the positive things Bono had to say about fundamentalist Christians
I can't recall the last time he said anything positive about them.

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Old 04-27-2005, 03:37 PM   #192
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
It was, but of course the number one rule in FYM is that every thread must turn into a discussion about homosexuality.
No, that is rule #2.

Rule #1 is that every thread must turn into a theological and political debate about Christianity.
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Old 04-27-2005, 05:46 PM   #193
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Originally posted by anitram


No, that is rule #2.

Rule #1 is that every thread must turn into a theological and political debate about Christianity.
Wasn't this thread about theological views to begin with?
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Old 04-27-2005, 05:49 PM   #194
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dp
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Old 04-27-2005, 05:51 PM   #195
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It was about a question of equality that Bono brought up in his quotes. Yes there is a religious base to it. But I think this thread has gotten far off track. I responded directly to Bono's quote in the last page or so....Nobody has responded to that post yet either.



Quote:
Originally posted by starsgoblue
But to kind of refer specifically to the original post, I've been thinking alot about the concept of "equality". Because I think in reference to the original quote there is a large sense of inequality in how we as Westerners think of people in Third World countries. True, some people may be charitable towards them. Sending aid and things like that. But even therein lies a flaw in that. The belief in being charitable lends itself to the idea that we are coming from a position of strength to bestow aid to someone less fortunate. There is a balancing act involved in that.

I know the idea of equality is just that. An idea. But it's definable. Aristotle once said that 'equality consists in the same treatment of similar persons'. Well of course you'd logically ask then, What is similar? Each individual is unique and yet can still be lumped into groups or categories: Woman, Rich, Homosexual.... We can see in just the history of the US how the definition of equality has changed under its Constitiutuion. So given the disparties among people, a belief in equality requires an act. An act of choice.

I choose to believe that people in Third World countries are our equals. They are our equals because they are human beings, just like us. But I don't feel like I'm in the majority (and when I say that I'm not refereing to anyone here). But it is true, if we accepted these people as our equals we wouldn't let 6500 people die a day for want of things you and I take for granted, things like clean water, an immunization, and food/shelter. It isn't about charity. It's about choosing to believe that to do otherwise would indeed debase and literally write off a beautiful and dignified culture that is being held down by an unlevel playing field.
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