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Old 04-01-2004, 04:32 PM   #16
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And people are free to leave the Catholic Church and join another denomination.
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Old 04-01-2004, 04:33 PM   #17
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true nuff, too.

The Lutheran and Episcopalian liturgies are almost indistinguishable from Roman Catholic ones.
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Old 04-01-2004, 04:39 PM   #18
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Kerry should be happy. The Catholic Church is evil.
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Old 04-01-2004, 05:21 PM   #19
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The Catholic Church should be bankrupted. All of its pedophilic priests should be arrested and imprisoned. All of the bishops et al. that hid the truth should be arrested and imprisoned too, and, guess what, folks? It's common knowledge that the entire church knew about it: bishops, cardinals, and, yes, the Pope. And if you think the pedophiles existed only in the U.S., you're mistaken. So where is the church coming clean on the rest of them? They're not; they're as stubborn and obstructing of justice as all can be, and then they blame *YOU* when the police come knocking on the door for their crimes. Typical Catholic guilt...

The entire Vatican City should be seized as criminal evidence. Catholics deserve better than the Roman Catholic Church. They should leave it.

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Old 04-01-2004, 05:24 PM   #20
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(And, yes, I am a bitter Catholic.)

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Old 04-01-2004, 06:32 PM   #21
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I believe Kerry's first marriage was annulled. Don't quote me on that, however, I'm not sure. I think they should let him take the Eucharist if that's true. As the Good Book says, let him who is without sin cast the first stone. I have a former Catholic friend who converted to Eastern Orthodoxy because of issues with the Vatican. Many Catholics join similar churches because of issues with the Vatican. It makes sense to me if that's what they want to do.
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Old 04-01-2004, 07:38 PM   #22
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This whole annullment thing is bullshit anyway. The way it's used in the Catholic Church is just a euphemism for divorce. You can be married and have a bunch of kids and still get an annullment.
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Old 04-01-2004, 07:51 PM   #23
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This whole annullment thing is bullshit anyway. The way it's used in the Catholic Church is just a euphemism for divorce. You can be married and have a bunch of kids and still get an annullment.
Yes. Got money annulment is possible. That was one of the big controversys surrounding Joe Kennedy. He was going to run for Gov. but wanted an annulment after being married for a considerable amount of time and children were involved.
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Old 04-01-2004, 10:49 PM   #24
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Richard Riordan, the former mayor of LA, had his first marriage annulled after 23 years and five children. He's since been divorced twice. He's not allowed to take Communion either, but he's still tight with Cardinal Mahoney. See, he's loaded and gives the Church expensive presents.
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Old 04-01-2004, 10:51 PM   #25
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Which, when you think about it, makes the Catholic Church's insanely baroque stance against gay marriage even more ridiculous.
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Old 04-02-2004, 03:28 AM   #26
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Originally posted by paxetaurora
Priests don't make the rules about what's sinful and what isn't; God knows what's in your heart.

For me, it's time that Catholics shed the old Catholic guilt and realize that end of the day, priests are still people--just as vulnerable, fallible, and sinful as the members of their flocks. This is not to defame priests; I've been fortunate to know a number of very good priests, priests who would never dream of denying anyone Communion. But they are not perfect. They are not more moral or more holy than you or I.
couldn't agree more
it's every catholics right to question the rules set upon us by people who in the end differ nothing from any of us


personaly I have a hard believing that banning someone from communion will help anyone or could be deemed following up on god's will

on the other hand when the rule exists and the church believe it's a just one then they should follow up on it
but not just when it's someone who gets his head on the tellie every day
at least then I could sort of understand an action like this one
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Old 04-02-2004, 10:44 AM   #27
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Originally posted by Dreadsox


Yes. Got money annulment is possible. That was one of the big controversys surrounding Joe Kennedy. He was going to run for Gov. but wanted an annulment after being married for a considerable amount of time and children were involved.
Not that I want to change the subject but what are grounds for anullment and what's the real difference?
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Old 04-02-2004, 04:02 PM   #28
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There are a variety of grounds for annulment, but basically, to qualify for an annulment, one or both parties must be able to demonstrate that one or both parties was/were unfit for marriage in such a way that a "true" marriage never actually got off the ground. Maybe a better way of saying it is that the marriage was not and/or could not have been successful.

This can be based on consent issues (e.g. the marriage was coerced, one party was too young or was mentally incapacitated such that he or she could not consent); mental/emotional issues (e.g. one or both parties was/were significantly mentally ill or had an addiction, and thus could not input into a marriage as two healthy persons can); maturity issues (e.g. one or both parties were not emotionally or sexually mature enough to be married); abuse issues (e.g. one or both parties were emotionally, verbally, physically, or sexually abusive); and probably a few more that I'm leaving out. Incidentally, for what it's worth, children from a marriage that has been annulled are still considered "legitimate."

The difference between divorce and annulment, very simply, is that for Catholics, divorce is strictly a civil dissolution of marriage while annulment is religious dissolution. I believe (although I could be wrong) that most mainline Protestant denominations (your Lutherans, Episcopalians, Presbyterians, Methodists, etc.) do not require annulment and accept civil divorce as equivalent to a religious dissolution of the marriage as well. In fact (again, if I am not mistaken), some of these denominations have strictly optional rites of divorce in which formerly married persons can ask forgiveness of each other and wish each other well following divorce. But I'm pretty sure, like I said, that they're optional.
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Old 04-02-2004, 05:19 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by martha
Which, when you think about it, makes the Catholic Church...even more ridiculous.
I couldn't agree more.

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Old 04-02-2004, 08:48 PM   #30
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You edited me, but I still agree.
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