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Old 05-02-2003, 09:47 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader
Dyke's comments sound a tad self-righteous to me.

No one news source has cornered the market on reporting all facts in an objective manner. Even Fox, as vile as some may view this network, provides facts not found elsewhere. It is all a matter of which facts you want to hear.
you are correct. but fox news panders to 'which facts you want to hear' to a far greater extent than other popular broadcasters. they have cast cnn back into the middle of the spectrum. and you know what...good for them. it is a business. and they are doing well for themselves.

journalism, sadly, doesn't matter.
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Old 05-02-2003, 11:22 AM   #17
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Originally posted by sulawesigirl4
I have been flipping through the channels for the last two mornings since I got back from Europe a few days ago. I have to say, I am about ready to book my flight back out of the country. The complete and utter lack of any credible news journalism on ANY of the major US stations is absolutely appalling to me. I cannot believe my eyes as to what is being said and more importantly what is NOT being said. I knew it was going to be hard to stomach the propaganda being passed off as "news" in this country, but I didn't expect it to be this bad. It is no wonder, with such a shoddy and unthinking media, that the US public is misinformed about the state of the outside world. Thank goodness for the internet, where one can at least attempt to get multiple viewpoints and actually read facts.
Having been out of the country for a while, you are in a unique position to be free of influence from the US media. I'd be interested to see some examples of non-credible news journalism (other than Fox - too easy of a target). Thanks!
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Old 05-03-2003, 10:08 AM   #18
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I think BBC has better coverage of world events...but I don't find it much more objective than CNN or MSNBC.


BBC has better scope in it's news...but to say it's free of bias is a bit of a joke. But I do agree they do show what needs to be shown more than the US networks.
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Old 05-03-2003, 11:06 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by kobayashi


you are correct. but fox news panders to 'which facts you want to hear' to a far greater extent than other popular broadcasters. they have cast cnn back into the middle of the spectrum. and you know what...good for them. it is a business. and they are doing well for themselves.

journalism, sadly, doesn't matter.
beautifully put

I do wish we could still chat sometime Dave!

I don't think its ever really about patriotism or objectivity. Its about ratings, market share...the bottom line.
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Old 05-04-2003, 05:37 AM   #20
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Sulawesigirl4,

"I have been flipping through the channels for the last two mornings since I got back from Europe a few days ago. I have to say, I am about ready to book my flight back out of the country. The complete and utter lack of any credible news journalism on ANY of the major US stations is absolutely appalling to me. I cannot believe my eyes as to what is being said and more importantly what is NOT being said. I knew it was going to be hard to stomach the propaganda being passed off as "news" in this country, but I didn't expect it to be this bad. It is no wonder, with such a shoddy and unthinking media, that the US public is misinformed about the state of the outside world. Thank goodness for the internet, where one can at least attempt to get multiple viewpoints and actually read facts."

Or perhaps it could be that in general much media in Europe is done in a way that is more appealing to your political view point.

Facts? I wonder how many European media outlets covered US soldiers saving the lives of Iraqi soldiers just recently wounded in battle? That wouldn't be appealing to the "Evil Empire" view some Europeans have of the USA.
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Old 05-04-2003, 02:06 PM   #21
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Sting, just because Sula was recently in Europe doesn't mean that she agrees with everything Europeans would say, either. Please give Sula the chance to express her specific views on this subject before you make assumptions.
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Old 05-04-2003, 03:08 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by STING2
Facts? I wonder how many European media outlets covered US soldiers saving the lives of Iraqi soldiers just recently wounded in battle? That wouldn't be appealing to the "Evil Empire" view some Europeans have of the USA.
I can't say anything about other countries, but here in the Netherlands they did report that, yes. I have a feeling they've also reported in other European countries. The media outlets here report what is happening, the good and the bad. You then have to decide what your opinion is about these subjects.
Before the war the media here reported about the horrible things Saddam has done in Iraq, but also about the diplomatic situation not favouring a war.

BTW, how many media outlets in the USA reported about the shootings in Falluja? That wouldn't be appealing to the "Great Saviour" view many US citizens have of their country...

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Old 05-04-2003, 03:26 PM   #23
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I've been reading BBC news at a site maintained by anti-Saddam Iraqis. While they do not like Saddam that's just about the only thing they agree on. The BBC's coverage is pretty graphic and reports on both good and bad stuff. The site's news coverage contains plenty of stuff about Saddam's atrocities. It also contains stuff that's critical of the Bush administration. I don't think it's an either-or situation. Criticizing the Bush administration doesn't translate into being pro-Saddam or whatever. You can be pleased that Saddam is gone and disagree with Act X of the Bush Administration.
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Old 05-04-2003, 03:40 PM   #24
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Originally posted by verte76
I don't think it's an either-or situation. Criticizing the Bush administration doesn't translate into being pro-Saddam or whatever. You can be pleased that Saddam is gone and disagree with Act X of the Bush Administration.
The problem is, however, that there has been a lot of rhetoric lately that does paint everything in black and white. I'm now referring to the 'You are either with us or against us (or with the terrorists)' rhetoric. Usually it is stated when somebody who is 'with' you is making some criticism, making it like that person is suddenly 'against' you, thereby supressing any (valid) criticism.

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Old 05-04-2003, 05:29 PM   #25
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Popmartijn,


"I can't say anything about other countries, but here in the Netherlands they did report that, yes."


Thats great Dutch media is doing this. The Marines would give them a big hoooo....ahhhhhh.

"BTW, how many media outlets in the USA reported about the shootings in Falluja? That wouldn't be appealing to the "Great Saviour" view many US citizens have of their country..."

All of them! Even that channel of "Satanic Propaganda" called FOX NEWS.
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Old 05-05-2003, 11:14 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by brettig
I do wish we could still chat sometime Dave!
im still on there. i think if you search on my email, davemay@rogers.com youll see me. i rarely use it but ill probably turned on more during summer nights
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Old 05-05-2003, 05:36 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by sulawesigirl4
I have been flipping through the channels for the last two mornings since I got back from Europe a few days ago. I have to say, I am about ready to book my flight back out of the country. The complete and utter lack of any credible news journalism on ANY of the major US stations is absolutely appalling to me. I cannot believe my eyes as to what is being said and more importantly what is NOT being said. I knew it was going to be hard to stomach the propaganda being passed off as "news" in this country, but I didn't expect it to be this bad. It is no wonder, with such a shoddy and unthinking media, that the US public is misinformed about the state of the outside world. Thank goodness for the internet, where one can at least attempt to get multiple viewpoints and actually read facts.
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Old 05-08-2003, 11:36 AM   #28
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wow, go offline for a few days and look at what gets tossed around about ya. lol.

Sting, just for your information just because I was living in Europe doesn't mean that I was even able to follow the war solely through European media. While I speak conversational French, I certainly don't know it well enough to get much out of a nuanced news report and I know no German, which pretty much covers whatever television media there might have been available in Switzerland. Indeed at the community I was living in, we didn't have a television available. Instead, I kept up reading (brace yourself) a newspaper for international expatriates that is culled from American sources called the "International Herald Tribune". I also read British sources online such as the BBC, the Guardian and the Independent. Perhaps the largest difference was the company I kept. We would sit down and discuss in detail the pros and cons of what was happening without resorting to political rhetoric. And I was lucky enough to live near to people who worked in Geneva at the Red Cross and know much more about the inner workings of what has happened in terms of human rights violations on both sides. So add that to being involved in many conversations with average Europeans who have no problem with Americans but are well-informed about what is going on and know that this so-called necessary war was hardly that, and yes I might have a different point of view than yourself. The lack of journalism in the US is hardly a secret and was something I used to discuss with friends who had been abroad way before this war ever started. It has a lot to do with an emphasis on soft news, human interest pieces and a lack of unbiased fact reporting or asking questions about what is not being said.

And zoomerang, i love you too.

p.s. nbcrusader, if you'd like I can try to sit down with a pad of paper tonite and watch the news to get specific examples for you.
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Old 05-08-2003, 01:32 PM   #29
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I work for an organization that, among other things, brings well-known writers from all over the world to give readings here. Every writer from outside the US that I have spoken to (even before the war) has said exactly the same thing that sula says...that they are shocked by what is presented as news here in the US on TV.
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Old 05-08-2003, 02:16 PM   #30
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I definitely agree with the peopple who have written about the difference between US media and European media. Having lived in the UK all my life and then spent a year as an exchange student in America, I was suprised at how great the difference between the news media is.

The most obvious difference I noticed was that while news programmes in Britain do cover British news in some detail, they also give reports from countries all across the world and tend to pay a fair amount of attention to these. In the US the media tended to be much more focused on American news, with very few stories from other countries. Of course this is probably different today because of what's happened in Iraq and what Bush is threatening with regard to Syria, but it was very noticeable at the time.

Also, US news does tend to focus more on soft news like entertainment and sports, as well as on so-called "human interest" stories than UK media. Often UK news shows will have as their final item one of those "human interest" stories, but it tends to take up only a minute or two of a thirty-minute programme, in contrast to the US media where such stories seemed to be given more prominance.

Of course in addition to those differences, there's a big difference in the sort of political analysis found in US programmes compared to that of European programmes, but that's a discussion for another post, lol.

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