At last! Kerry's plan for the war in Iraq! - U2 Feedback

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Old 08-02-2004, 09:00 AM   #1
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At last! Kerry's plan for the war in Iraq!

I have been searching for his stance or plans, and now I have them. A story today says he plans to REDUCE troops in Iraq- BY THE END OF HIS FIRST TERM! That's FOUR FUCKING YEARS, people! Bush could probably beat that! That means Kerry has every intention of continuing this war at least another four years! Bush has said he woud drastically reduce the forces by late next year! So all you dreamers that Kerry is going to stop this dirty war, wake up!

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...32898_2004aug1
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Old 08-02-2004, 09:17 AM   #2
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Once the US decided to invade Iraq there was no quick way out.
Most of the "anti-war crowd" agrees that pulling troops out to soon just makes it worse

After Bush opened Pandoras box his successor can't make that undone
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Old 08-02-2004, 09:25 AM   #3
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But FOUR YEARS??? WTF is this, Viet Nam?? The longer we stay, the more we will become intertwined in the business of running the country and will NEVER be able to escape. I think one more year is sufficient, then hand it over to the Iraqi people.

If you are looking at a long term war, you are also looking at the draft. Don't be fooled. As people get killed and get out now, the reinlistments are going to go down. Then they'll have to recall up others, but that will run out soon. The young men I know who would have joined the military to see the world and get college money are now avoiding it like the plague and will not join in fear of being killed in Iraq. So if the voluntary forces dwindle down, there will be a draft. I think Kerry is much more likely that Bush to start one up because he will brag on his (limited) service. If you are looking at that long term of a war, the troops can only be replentished by a draft. There's no other way.

But the main point I was making was, all those people who said they were voting for Kerry to "stop this war" are fooled if they think he will.

But perhaps the most sickening thing is the 'pandora's box' statement. So what you're saying is, no matter how long Kerry stays, no matter how many people are killed, you will always blame Bush? That's pathetic. If Kerry is president, he will have every chance to change things. If he doesn't, don't blame Bush. Nobody blamed Johnson when Nixon continued Viet Nam, did they? They blamed Johnson but they also hated Nixon for it.
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Old 08-02-2004, 09:27 AM   #4
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Take a look for how many years palestine is f**ed up. Take a look at Afghanistan and the situation and timetable there.
Welcome to Nation Building

Yes, Kerry won't stop this war, hopefully Kerry won't start another war!
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Old 08-02-2004, 10:00 AM   #5
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So, if he's not going to stop it, why are people voting for him based on that? I don't see that as different from Bush either. Bush also isn't going to start another war. He can't afford it. I still see this as a negative, disappointing statement by Kerry.
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Old 08-02-2004, 10:12 AM   #6
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The administration allready started to talk like that. And I'm sure if Bush gets elected for another 4 years there will be at least one new war.
Why do you think that there was a decision to harbour anti-iran teorrists? I think he can't afford it. He allready has a lack of credibility and this could give him the rest. But still he does. Why? These Terrorists destabilize Iran, one of the next possible targets.
Remember that axis of evil thing?

The words of Mr. Kerry about the 4 years help me to trust this guy.
He's not painting a future based on his view though hope and dreams. He's realistic and because of that he's not a warmonger like some of the neocons in the current adminstration.
It was not the idea Mr. Kerry to attack Iraq without a exit strategy. He can only try to keep the damage which has bin done as small as possible.
Let's face it, 4 years are realistic, the only way to get out earlier is if you get huge international support.
And it's def. easier for someone who isn't connected to the administration who renamed Frenchfries to Freedomfries or started that "either you with us or against us" mentality.
Kerry is the diplomat who might be able to do that, Bush is the Cowboy for the next war.

Dissapointing? Yes
Realistic? Yes
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:37 AM   #7
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But still, you are taking up for a man who has pledged to continue the war. That makes him no better than Bush. So stop defending him. If he's such a 'great diplomat' he'd get us out of trouble in less than 4 years.
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Old 08-02-2004, 11:52 AM   #8
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In the days when the first people cried "pull out the troops" i was against it.
I was against this war because i think it's a war for profit (what would be with haliburton without iraq?)
You think it's about counter-terroism? than tell me why the US harbours terrorists

Quote:
We will make no distinction between the terrorists who committed these acts and those who harbour them.
George W. Bush
So if the government of iran would do what Mr. Bush told us they would attack the US!

You think it was about Humanitarian issues? Well that's naive If the US wanted to do something about the humanitarian side in iraq i'm sure they wouldn't have used WMDs against Iraq, i'm sure they would have protected Hospitals instead of the Oil ministerium, and i'm sure they would have sent enough troops to secure this country.

But once they were in i agreed with some of the pro war fraction that it's now too late to pull ot the troops.
And it's naive to think Iraq will be done in a few years.
What makes Kerry better than bush is - as mentioned above:
"He won't start some other wars in the name of Good vs. Evil, Us vs. Them"

From my point of view Mr. Bush just makes it worse the next years - Mr Kerry has the chance to clean up SOME mess the current administration did internationally.

Quote:
This crusade, this war on terrorism is going to take a while.
George W. Bush
Maybe the Republicans should drop GWB and ask Ron Reagan if he wants to be the next candidate - a man i'd prefer over Kerry
http://www.informationclearinghouse....rticle6577.htm

To sum it up:
Now there is no way to stop this war in Iraq in the near future.
After Mr. Bush was elected there was no way to stop America in its war against Mr. Hussein

In the next election in the US you can only choose if you want to continue that course (a man who thinks that god made him president to start wars with people who think different) or if you want a moderate, a smarter president.
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Old 08-02-2004, 12:58 PM   #9
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Anybody OTHER than Klaus have an opinion on this?
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Old 08-02-2004, 01:17 PM   #10
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no!
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Old 08-02-2004, 02:07 PM   #11
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Yes, but it's fun watching you two go around.

I don't check this forum as often as I should.

Klaus. I have nothing to add.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:36 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by BluberryPoptart
Anybody OTHER than Klaus have an opinion on this?
Yes but I have no clue where you are coming from. Nothing you say makes sence. You keep bringing up the fact that people in here are saying they are voting for Kerry because he's going to end the war, I don't think I've seen anyone claim this. You can't grasp the concept that we're in a war that Bush got us in and there's no easy way out, pulling out too soon can just make things worse. Kerry is being realistic. If he comes into office he's being handed a horrible situation to deal with. I'm not sure what you're obsession with him not ending the war is? No matter who comes in as president Kerry, George Washington, Pee Wee Herman, or Santa Claus they really don't have a choice whether to continue the war or not. This is why so many disapproved of how Bush handled this situation.
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Old 08-02-2004, 05:58 PM   #13
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I'm not surprised by Kerry's statement one bit. The worst thing the US could do
is to pull out all the troops.
It's going to take a long time to clean
up the mess Bush's war has caused.
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Old 08-02-2004, 06:44 PM   #14
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Same opinion different thread.

Klaus
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Old 08-02-2004, 06:59 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by BluberryPoptart
But FOUR YEARS??? WTF is this, Viet Nam?? The longer we stay, the more we will become intertwined in the business of running the country and will NEVER be able to escape. I think one more year is sufficient, then hand it over to the Iraqi people.

If you are looking at a long term war, you are also looking at the draft. Don't be fooled. As people get killed and get out now, the reinlistments are going to go down. Then they'll have to recall up others, but that will run out soon. The young men I know who would have joined the military to see the world and get college money are now avoiding it like the plague and will not join in fear of being killed in Iraq. So if the voluntary forces dwindle down, there will be a draft. I think Kerry is much more likely that Bush to start one up because he will brag on his (limited) service. If you are looking at that long term of a war, the troops can only be replentished by a draft. There's no other way.

But the main point I was making was, all those people who said they were voting for Kerry to "stop this war" are fooled if they think he will.

But perhaps the most sickening thing is the 'pandora's box' statement. So what you're saying is, no matter how long Kerry stays, no matter how many people are killed, you will always blame Bush? That's pathetic. If Kerry is president, he will have every chance to change things. If he doesn't, don't blame Bush. Nobody blamed Johnson when Nixon continued Viet Nam, did they? They blamed Johnson but they also hated Nixon for it.
Kerry he says he has a plan, but I don't think he does. Bush does have a plan and it is the only plan that is going to work in Iraq longterm.

But in this post, I just wanted to say that the US military does not need a draft. All recruiting centers for the active duty military are hitting their recruiting goals easily. There is more demand to serve in the military right now than than there was 5 years ago when the military services were each missing their recruiting goals by several by over 10,000 each.

The recruiting situation is the best it has been for the military in 10 years. In addition the current military which is all volunteer, is HALF the size it was 15 years ago.

There are currently a total of 87 Active and Reserve, Army and Marine Brigades. There were nearly twice that many 15 years ago. Of the military's total strength of 87 ground combat brigades, 18 Brigades are currently in Iraq.

The Military currently has no plans to expand the force at this time. If it needed to, remember that the all volunteer military was twice the size it was today 15 years ago, so the capability is there to expand the all volunteer military to double its size, which would be far more than enough to handle any contingency needed.

The point here is that there is no need for a draft at all. The War in Iraq is not Vietnam. Combat losses are currently a tiny fraction of the Vietnam War. After 1 and a half years in Iraq, we have lost the equalivant of two weeks of losses in Vietnam, on average. In addition, even the Vietnam War could have potentially been fought without a draft if the Reserves had been fully called up, and the United States did not need to station half a million troops in Western Europe to Guard against a Soviet invasion.

With recruiting the strongest its been in years, a total of 87 combat active and reserve brigades, and with 18 of those brigades in Iraq at any one time, there is absolutely no need at all for a draft. With the numbers the military has, it can continue the war indefinitely if NEED be.
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