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I was hoping that some of the Christians might apologise for the witch-burnings. Looks like someone on the moral high ground can't apologise for anything.

At least Jan Pavel II (RIP) apologised for some of the past misdeeds of the Catholic Church.
 
80sU2isBest said:
You are certainly entitled to your beliefs, but just know that if you're trying to lump Christianity in with other religions, it just won't work, simply by virtue of the fact that Christ himself made claims to being the only way to God.
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I'm loving the thread. The Christians and the Pagans get it together on a U2 site. How beautiful is that!!!
Well, as it stands, I'm not "lumping" anything with anything that wasn't already interconnected long before our feeble interpretations tried to make sense of the great mystery that is all things.
Your Jesus is in fact a revision of Dionysus and Osiris and other pagan gods, but that does not trouble me, because as long as we look at what your Jesus actually said and did, it leaves very little to debate and so much to do.
Why fetishize the exclusivity of Christ's divinity at the same time so many Christians ignore his message to do justice by feeding the poor and healing the sick?
Why get stuck in the semantics when it's possible to live outside the margins of human reilgion in boundless love and humility . . . .
love, Anu
 
financeguy said:
I was hoping that some of the Christians might apologise for the witch-burnings. Looks like someone on the moral high ground can't apologise for anything.

At least Jan Pavel II (RIP) apologised for some of the past misdeeds of the Catholic Church.
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Dude, I didn't burn any witches. I never have. I never will. Why should I apologize for the sins of people hundreds of years before me?

Maybe I should ask every witch in this thread to apoligize for what one witch did to a Christian friend of mine back in the late 80s.

Get the point?
 
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financeguy said:


Has a lot to do with it, in my view. In you proclaim a religion as fundamentally superior, what do you think that can lead to?
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The "witches" weren't burned because Christians believe that Christ is the only way to God. They were burned because some people thought they were practicing evil magic.

Besides, I didn't originally make the claim of exclusivity. Christ did. What kind of Christian would I be if I didn't even believe the claims of my own God?

financeguy said:
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
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It's called faith. Every religious belief and many scientific theories are built on faith. Not to say that there is no evidence at all, but if you're looking for 100% proof, you won't find it til you pass on.

financeguy said:
As no religion as provided such evidence, how can it be claimed that Christianity (or any other religion) holds the only path to God? In my view, such a claim is over the top.]
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I believe that Christ is the only way to God because Christ said so. Christ is the God of my faith, so of course, I believe what he said. Why is it hard for you to imagine that followers of a religious faith might actually believe the words of their religion's God?

financeguy said:
As regards your point about there being only one Christianity, why is it there are so many different churches with different ideas/dogmas within Christianity?
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A Christian is someone who is a born again believer in and follower of Christ. That is the basic foundation that makes Christianity one big family, "the church". Within Christianity, as in every family, there are differences of opinions on minor and sometimes not so minor issues, such as talking in tongues, healing, etc. But that's all icing on the cake. The real meat and potatos of Christianity is shared by all Christians; they are worshippers and followers of Jesus Christ.
 
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I'm slightly of a pagan bent (especially animism). Sort of an extension of U2Kitten's answer: are there any portrals of witches/pagans in popular culture that you find accurate?
 
80sU2isBest said:


The person who started the thread brought up Christianity first, saying

"I get along with beliefs and non-beliefs of all kinds, just as long as your not a bible thumper!!!"

So, the first "intolerant" statement came from the thread starter herself.
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I am truly sorry if by using the term "bible thumper" I offended anyone. I was trying to make light of the fact that I was open to discussing theology with anyone, regardless of their viewpoints, as long as it was done respectfully. I suppose I should have said that instead- but my intent was to lightly "head off at the pass" any attacking or name calling. That I did this by name calling-however lightly intended- was a poor choice and I am sorry for that. I truly was just wanting to find other U2 fans with similar beliefs and lifestyles, and introduce myself a little via this thread. And maybe make people think a little outside their comfort zone with regards to who constitutes a long time U2 listener....
 
coemgen said:


Is truth more of a fashion thing, or something solid for everyone to hold on to?
The concept of heaven and hell might not be your cup of tea, but what if it's not up to you to decide what happens after you die?

I'm just throwing this out for discussion. Thanks for your reply and, Anu, thanks for yours.
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Okay, deep breath here before I respond. I am not sure even where to begin... Actually I am not even going to begin. I think that if we want to talk about christian theology that we should do it on another thread. And I will be happy to give my opinion there should I feel like it. I know that you asked this question out of curiousity and with respect, coemgen, and I am not disregarding your question. I just feel, after reading several post after your question appeared, that it might derail the intent of this thread. I am a witch. I can answer questions about that. Heaven? Hell? the rapture? Not so much... I am sure someone could do better.

"Let the beauty we love be what we do
There are hundreds of ways to kneel
and kiss the ground." -Rumi (12th c. sufi mystic)
 
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verte76 said:
Have you ever read Carl Jung? He was into alot of pagan stuff.
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Love Jung! I am a therapist and artist, so alot of his work really speaks to my soul. Did you know it was one of his clients that founded AA? Good old Carl believed that addictions were caused by the clients lack of relationship with God, higher power, whatever. Through many years of anylasis with Jung, one of his clients came up with AA. I think that is cool.
I also love the story of how he "dreamed" his theory of the collective unconcious...really amazing. -Jennifer
 
meegannie said:
are there any portrals of witches/pagans in popular culture that you find accurate?
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Well, I just love Buffy the vampire slayer, and the character of Willow. But mostly that has to do with my comic book obsession! I really liked Willow on that show, esp. toward the end when she lost her lover and got too deep into dark magic and had to work her way back out of that. Yeah, it was sci-fi, but also felt really human to me.
Most popular culture is what sells. And that would be sensationalistic tales of magic and power. I don't think any witch I know would have a life that would make a long running t.v. show. Well, maybe one or two...but it would have to be on HBO! Magic is real, we all have it, and applied properly, IT WORKS. Magic is human will married to intention. Ahh, when you get those things aligned you can really cook. But it is not easy to find your true will and not easy to gain the kind of focus required. It takes practice and skill. That's why it's a craft.

-Blessings, Jennifer
 
starsgoblue said:



TinyBubbles, thanks for your reply. So spells (and forgive me if I sound ignorant or rude, cause I just truly don't know) aren't that stereotype of mixing potions and whatnot or is that only in certain circumstances? :huh:
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Some people would say yes. I like to give a wider view just because I am personally against those books that tell one to go out and by 80 different herbs and oils and chant certain words to get what you want. It's a little like telling a person who wants to learn to paint to go buy a paint-by-numbers kit and he will be just fine. Silly, right? And in magic, sometimes dangerous. If you begin by understanding the foundations of the craft, then you can begin to make your own spells and structure them accordingly. Or structure them whimsically, or whatever.
I will say that certain scents, oils, colors, symbols, etc. resonate with certain energies. So many times these things are employed in spells to awaken the playfull part of our spirit to the thing we are trying to achieve.
Example: I like to wash my bed sheets in a lavendar scent because it is relaxing and calming. I do not think I would want to wash them in hot pepper scent or shrimp flavor. I could take this information and expand on it perhaps using lavendar, candles, and calling on a calming Goddess to bring me peacefull dreams or a good night's rest.
Hope this helps! -Jennifer
 
Tinybubbles, are you familar with the Irish poet WB Yeats?

He had a long running interest in paganism and was involved in the 'theosophy' movement of the early twentieth century.
 
80sU2isBest said:


I believe that Christ is the only way to God because Christ said so. Christ is the God of my faith, so of course, I believe what he said. Why is it hard for you to imagine that followers of a religious faith might actually believe the words of their religion's God?

Click to expand...

That's fair enough. In fairness it was probably the bible-thumper thing that started the thread getting de-railed and as Tinybubbles admitted it was a poor choice of expression.

Peace
:up:
 
80sU2isBest said:


Maybe I should ask every witch in this thread to apoligize for what one witch did to a Christian friend of mine back in the late 80s.

Get the point?
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Yes.
 
What do you think of Marilyn Manson?

Manson.jpg


A pic for your pleasure...
 
Do you like Tori Amos or Meat Cake comics?

Can you describe one simple spell you've done that's worked?

And, on what occasions do you go sky-clad, if any...?


foray
 
Influences Occult and otherwise:

Most definitely yes to Tori Amos and Yeats! I became interested in Yeats through the ceremonial magic connection (Golden Dawn, O.T.O.) via Alister Crowley because we share the same birthdate...Manson? Well, the cartoon that was posted made me laugh. I don't really know much about him. Don't know Meat Cake either...should I? I really like Neil Gaiman, and lots of vertigo titles and x-men remains an old standby. Very nice since Jos Whedon took over the writing...
Sky-clad? I get cold very easily so not very much. But if it gets hot enough I suppose. I do not find that essential to my practice. There seems to be alot of emphasis on being naked during rites in traditions that are fertility based. My tradition is an ecstatic one. Although there are, of course, some rites you just can't do with clothes on!
 
foray said:


Can you describe one simple spell you've done that's worked?

foray
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Okay. I was looking for a new apartment in a really tight market. Instead of just taking whatever I could get I did a spell to get exactly what I wanted. I did a cleansing ritual and grounded my energy to make sure I would be clear about what I wanted (no outside influences) then asked the Gods that I have personal relationships with to be present to help me. I might have lit a candle to acknowledge their presence. I sat with paper and pastels and in a light trance drew the place I wanted to move to. I put the picture on my altar and named it.
What is interesting is that what came up was a single home detailed with a rose bush to the right, a front door with 3 pane window, and a well to the left. And I was looking for an apartment in a city. But it was what I wanted if I really thought about it. I hated living in little spaces. So it did not really make sense until I got a call 3 days later from a woman looking for a roomate. In the very house I drew. well, rosebush, everything.
 
beatlesboy said:
Are you a good witch or a bad witch?
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Depends on the day. Like most people:)
....So this thread has been fun. I think I like interference. I think I will stay around for a while. You all seem intellegent and funny at least!
However, I am getting a bit tired just talking about myself so unless there are any other emergency, have to have answered witch questions, I think I will take a break and see what else is going on around here. If anyone needs more witchy reading I suggest www.Witchvox.com for starters. They are a portal to all sorts of witchy things. Me? I just watched "U2 go home" last night with my good friend and 2 bottles of very good wine. I am much more in the mood to talk about my favourite band than witchcraft...Thanks again for the discussion, everyone. And apologies for my poor spelling. It's bad I know. Don't worry. You will get used to it....
-Jennifer
 
Tinybubbles said:
and Yeats! I became interested in Yeats through the ceremonial magic connection (Golden Dawn, O.T.O.) via Alister Crowley because we share the same birthdate
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Sure, that's why I asked about Yeats. I read about the Crowley connection before, seemingly they were both involved in the same group but had a falling out and Yeats forced Crowley out of it.

I asked some Irish pagans on a discussion forum once about Crowley, they weren't fans of his. He seems to have been a controversial character to say the least. Yeats on the other hand lived a largely blameless life as far as I am aware and was even made an Irish senator by the government. He never fell foul of the Catholic Church unlike many Irish writers of the period. He seemed to have the knack of getting on with people plus he was a great, great poet.

Anyway I look forward to more discussions about Yeats, Crowley, etc, I'm quite interested in both of them
 
financeguy said:


Anyway I look forward to more discussions about Yeats, Crowley, etc, I'm quite interested in both of them
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Me too. We should talk... Although a thread about Crowley might be a little much around here... innocent people might have their minds blown wide open!! I liked old Al, he was wierd, fallable and human, and occasionally brilliant. And his girlfriend never gets enough credit for being the one who actually channeled most of the Book of Law!

-Jennifer


"Yesterday's wierdness is tommorrow's reason why."-Hunter Thompson
 
Tinybubbles said:

Although a thread about Crowley might be a little much around here... innocent people might have their minds blown wide open!!
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True, true. Although my understanding is even a lot of pagans don't like the guy much. Interesting figure but he did a lot of very questionable things in his life, from what I've read, seems to have treated a lot of people badly. But certainly an interesting figure all the same.
 
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