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Old 07-01-2004, 05:29 PM   #46
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It isn't space that's the problem. It's bandwidth that's the limiting factor in these large sites. Most of the old threads are rarely viewed, and, as such, take up little bandwidth. PMs, on the other hand, were likely used my many forum members and the bandwidth started to add up. In terms of images, emoticons don't take up much drive space, but if hundreds of people have to download them, then it takes up bandwidth.

In other words, dumping the old threads won't solve the problem.

Melon
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:00 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally posted by FizzingWhizzbees
I don't really have a lot to say on this subject, other than to say that I absolutely agree with melon's comments. I do find it frustrating that while threads which are overtly racist or anti-semitic will usually be locked, it seems that blatantly homophobic comments are allowed to remain. I don't buy the idea that someone should be allowed to make homophobic comments as long as they do so politely, it's the equivalent of saying it's acceptable to claim black people are inferior to white people just as long as you're polite about it.

I agree with Melon's commments too.
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:14 PM   #48
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at least a healthy part of the mod team also agrees with melon's comments

but what does that mean though?
that threads about homosexuality should be forbidden?
that we delete every post that appears to have homophobic content?

we have pretty much looked at this from every angle
and - like pointed out already - it always comes back to having to make a decision between "freedom of speech" and preventing prejudiced hatred

I think the mods are able to deal with both having an open forum and with stepping in to prevent things to get hostile
I guess this thread serves to establish some kind of concensus on what to do not only within the mod team but also within FYM

at some point choices will have to be made
and both members and mods will make these choices together
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:16 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally posted by Popmartijn


Agreed (and don't forget graphical sigs). However, (derailing this thread even more to the Premium discussion of 18 months back) apart from cutting away these graphics for non-premium members, I'm still of the opinion that forums like FYM (and also Lemonade Stand) can be premium-only.
This is a U2 site/forum. As such, I think that all content directly related to U2 should be freely accessible for everyone (EYKIW, Musical Journey, PLEBA (even though that one is probably also heavy on bandwith due to the many pictures) EBTTRT, etc.). But Interference is also a community for some. What's wrong then with making the community-part largely premium? If U2 fans come here and like it here, they can become premium and have even more of the Interference community.
Of course, it'll mean some will go away, unfortunately. But those who will want to be part of the community, will become premium. And with a premium-only FYM, everyone will have the ability to send and receive PM's. Other suggestions will never work, because it's so easy to not use them without repercussions. Everyone can register and come in FYM without showing an email address, MSN name or whatever and they can post whatever they want.

Oh, and $10 still shouldn't be too much. It's one trip less to the cinema. Not going out to a bar will probably save you enough for a few years! And that DVD of Gigli, leave it behind in the store, use the $10 for Interference and don't even download it.

Bottom line, if you want to make sure that you can contact somebody outside the thread, then the forum will become premium-only.

C ya!

Marty
I have to say I disagree with the premium only status ( & I never disagree with Marty). But I think sometimes FYM get overly stagnant by the same posters, same ideology, same opinions. I'm not excluding myself in any way either. Fresh blood so to speak helps to invigorate discussion.

As to Kitty's claim that discussion never changes minds, I have to disagree. Many discussions we've had here in FYM have at least altered my perception of things or at least educated me on many issues.

edited to add
i think the mods so a super job in this forum.
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:18 PM   #50
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I'm with Melon.
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:29 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally posted by AcrobatMan
I would like this forum to be completely unmoderated unless extreme conditions.

Thread shouldnt be closed unless there is a consensus among atleast 3-4 moderators - However the right to ask for the closure of thread should be there.

And one should be free to raise eyebrows as well !!!
Ditto this post. I personally haven't really had any complaints with the mods and stuff, but yeah, I'm with AcrobatMan. Everybody should be free to say whatever is on their mind, and be prepared to deal with whatever comments may come their way as a result of what they've said. We all have to deal with that in the real world, where there aren't mods around to stop us, so I would think we should be able to deal with it online.

Also, in regards to the things melon is saying...yeah, if somebody makes a homophobic remark and melon responds rather harshly, well, that's to be expected. I know I'd certainly respond in a similar fashion if somebody made a negative comment about me.

Angela
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:52 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon
It isn't space that's the problem. It's bandwidth that's the limiting factor in these large sites. Most of the old threads are rarely viewed, and, as such, take up little bandwidth. PMs, on the other hand, were likely used my many forum members and the bandwidth started to add up. In terms of images, emoticons don't take up much drive space, but if hundreds of people have to download them, then it takes up bandwidth.

In other words, dumping the old threads won't solve the problem.

Melon
Okay, thanks for the info.

So that means that no bandwidth from the originating site is being used by all our hot pics on PLEBA if no one is currently viewing the thread?
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:55 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine



As to Kitty's claim that discussion never changes minds, I have to disagree. Many discussions we've had here in FYM have at least altered my perception of things or at least educated me on many issues.
Okay, I didn't know some people felt that way. It's just been my experience from other places on all different topics, even music, that it usually ends up hitting a brick wall of fights. I've never seen anyone, on any topic, ever say "okay so and so you are right, you have changed my mind." But I guess it could happen.

Quote:
edited to add
i think the mods so a super job in this forum.
I think they do everything they can under sometimes difficult circumstances.
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Old 07-01-2004, 06:55 PM   #54
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melon:
I'm sorry that i simply don't understand some points - well i discussed evolution with a Biology-student tonight which was verry interesting.
I agree with you, it's not good to be offensive to anyone,women, men, people of different races and cultures, various religions incl. Jews. Muslims and of course also christians, homosexuals, heterosexuals, bisexuals, transsexuals, democrats or republicans. After all they are just humans and we should treat them like with respect also i know that all of them sometimes behave in a manner which upsets some people.

Well i'm glad that we can all discuss in a civilized style in this thread

Klaus

---- edited to delete uneccessary parts ----
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Old 07-01-2004, 07:01 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally posted by U2Kitten


Okay, thanks for the info.

So that means that no bandwidth from the originating site is being used by all our hot pics on PLEBA if no one is currently viewing the thread?
The pics are hosted on a site unassociated with Interference's servers. Thus, they do not affect Interference's bandwidth issues. So post all the images from other sites you want--except, of course, it will affect the other sites' bandwidth limits!

Melon
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Old 07-01-2004, 07:06 PM   #56
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I would also not want to give out any e-mail to access this forum, so I'd just like to say that, if it becomes premium only or e-mail required, it was nice chatting w/ everyone here.

Of course I don't think anyone should be allowed to make homophobic comments as long as they do so "politely". I feel very badly for the hurt that those comments might cause anyone here. I think that perhaps some people exercise far less self restraint and self censorship than others do, and maybe that's at the root of many of the problems.

I just don't see the point in having to continue to "bicker" back and forth in PMs or e-mails, and I see the potential for that being abused-for someone sending unwanted e-mails to someone else. That's the main reason I wouldn't want to have an e-mail address. I think problem posts and posters could just be handled privately by the moderators.
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Old 07-01-2004, 07:07 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally posted by melon


The pics are hosted on a site unassociated with Interference's servers. Thus, they do not affect Interference's bandwidth issues. So post all the images from other sites you want--except, of course, it will affect the other sites' bandwidth limits!

Melon
Are they using up bandwidth from Olive's site and my webpage, and all the other originating sites, even when they are in storage not being viewed, or only when somebody clicks on them? The reason I want to know is because so many people have been shut down temporarily for going over their bandwidth
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Old 07-01-2004, 07:08 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally posted by Scarletwine


I have to say I disagree with the premium only status ( & I never disagree with Marty). But I think sometimes FYM get overly stagnant by the same posters, same ideology, same opinions. I'm not excluding myself in any way either. Fresh blood so to speak helps to invigorate discussion.

As to Kitty's claim that discussion never changes minds, I have to disagree. Many discussions we've had here in FYM have at least altered my perception of things or at least educated me on many issues.

edited to add
i think the mods so a super job in this forum.
Agree 100%
Quote:
but what does that mean though?
that threads about homosexuality should be forbidden?
that we delete every post that appears to have homophobic content? [/B]
I don't think threads of this nature should be forbidden. I think with the recent debates of gay marriage that these discussions can be helpful, I know it can be like banging your head against the wall with some, but I would hate to ban all discussion on this. Then what would be next? Melon this is by no means me trying to ignore your feelings, I just think that if it may help one person to understand it may be worth while. I think one of the biggest problems this forum has and I'm not sure how you would correct this, but when on the topic of something like homosexuality we often get responses like "well I just think it's discusting". I've brought this up before and I was told it doesn't matter because I'm entitled to my opinion. Well yes everyone is entitled to their opinion, but you bring nothing to the discussion when you can't bring any reasoning, evidence, or logic to the debate. This is what irks me the most in this forum is when individuals pipe in on a debate and state nothing but their opinion. I know many of the discussion in this board are based on emotion, but you can't just come out and say "Well I just hate Bush thats why", tell me why you hate Bush. I don't know, does that make sense, is that asking too much?
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Old 07-01-2004, 07:15 PM   #59
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MrsSpringsteen:
It would be helpful when i find out that my comment or question is offending someone i could pm another person who agrees that this was offending but still is less emotional about the subject -> i could understand it without offending the 1st person even more.
Or simply to say "i'm sorry" without f*cking up the whole thread

U2Kitten:
exactly, the bandwith is charged from the server were the pictures are.
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Old 07-01-2004, 08:17 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally posted by Salome
that we delete every post that appears to have homophobic content?
Maybe my view is arbitrary on the subject, but I think it would be common sense to not address such personal qualities as special cases. A post may have all the good intent in the world, with respect to word choice and delivery... but in that action one can turn a discussion into a relevance-diluted afterschool special. The simple act of making accommodations implies difference, which may in turn be interpreted as offensive. Personally I do not know how to have a respectful conversation regarding sexuality, without making conscious adjustments (I concede my linguistic ineptitude). Is this because I have some hostile intrinsic homophobism, or a heterocentric vantage (WASA view if you will) of the world? No, quite the contrary actually. Words like tolerance and acceptance only persist division, so unless members of this forum begin to respect eachother as humans (with subtle, yet wonderful idiosyncracies) there should be more moderating regulation. Once a precedent has been set (collectively, as Salome suggested) for behaviour and understanding... then maybe we, as mature members, can talk with an awareness of our own context, as well that of our peers.

Quote:
Originally posted by Salome
at some point choices will have to be made
and both members and mods will make these choices together
Sounds like a plan. Is it just me, or have we been agreeing to an uncomfortable extent as of late?

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