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Old 07-04-2002, 09:18 PM   #16
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It's similarly unlikely that the U.S. would elect a ...Greek...
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Old 07-04-2002, 10:40 PM   #17
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Part of me wishes to remind the forum that I mentioned "Greek Orthodox" (a denomination very similar to Roman Catholicism), not Greeks as an ethinic group.

The other part of me wants to hold up Michael Dukakis as a shining example of exactly what I was talking about.

To quote NROnline:

...Dukakis, translated from the Greek, means "worst conceivable candidate not found with a live boy or a dead girl in his hotel room." (Yes, it is amazing how the Greeks can say so much in so few words.) Bush’s opponent was terrible in so many ways that — after twelve years — the Library of Congress has only managed to catalogue "Dukakis Presidential Campaign Foul-ups, A thru L." Dukakis was a left-wing ideologue from Boston who smugly boasted of his Carteresque "competence" without displaying a fraction of Carter’s charm. Governor Dukakis tried to opt Massachusetts out of the national-security infrastructure — something Harvard-bred, liberal, Northeastern ethnics should probably avoid if they want to win in the South. He let Bush seize the mantles of environmentalism, responsibility, patriotism, economic optimism, and all around good guy. This left Dukakis with the arrogant-professor-who-gave-you-an-undeserved-C-minus-in-college mantle, along with the Greek vote.

Naturally, I'm joking, so please, no flak from the Dukakis fans.

Either of ya.
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Old 07-04-2002, 11:55 PM   #18
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I think it is a high probability that we've already had a President(s) who were atheistic; obviously none of them went on record as such, because it would be political suicide. So yes, I do think we will have atheist Presidents, if we haven't had them already, but only on the stipulation that they don't disclose this to anyone.
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Old 07-06-2002, 02:04 PM   #19
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Is the State and religion is separated in your country ?

A sermon to God is obsolete anyways, I'd rather make a sermon to citizenship.

Atheist president or not, if he/she don't do the job, get out, if she/he isn't responsible in a national and international view, what's the point of being atheist or not.

Is religion important in your country ?
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Old 07-06-2002, 03:46 PM   #20
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I think that is wishful thinking on your part wanderer.
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Old 07-06-2002, 03:51 PM   #21
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I think it is a high probability that we've already had a President(s) who were atheistic; obviously none of them went on record as such, because it would be political suicide. So yes, I do think we will have atheist Presidents, if we haven't had them already, but only on the stipulation that they don't disclose this to anyone.
That kinda ties in to my original post, an acknowledged atheist wouldn't be elected. I agree with you Wanderer, I do believe we have had atheistic Presidents before, they just didn't publicize it.
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Old 07-07-2002, 01:53 AM   #22
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how is it "wishful thinking" on my part, sting2?

I think people are fooling themselves if they believe that all these politicians who claim to be spiritual and/or "good, devout christians" are being completely honest

I'm not saying that all politicians who lie, blur or stretch the truth about their religious convictions are neceassarily atheists, but I think many are laying down some serious *b.s.* when they suddenly start making their religious beliefs a campaign issue because they've checked the polls or found a perceived weakness in their oppenents character
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Old 07-07-2002, 02:26 PM   #23
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The fact is that 95% of people in the USA believe in God. Politicians are not aliens, they come from the population. Just look at the voting on the whole "Under God" issue. It is very reasonable that a person who believes in God would vote with the 9th circuit, but I highly doubt someone who did not believe would vote against it, even if he was as you say living a lie. Of course what you say is not impossible, but there is nothing to indicate that it is so or might be true in any particular instance. If you think otherwise, name the president.
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Old 07-07-2002, 04:20 PM   #24
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where did you get your 95% statistic, out of curiosity

you're probably right about there being no atheist presidents, though I am sure more than one where perhaps, skeptics, but I'll concede here and say you're probably right about presidents, but I think there have probably been too numerous cases to count in regards to Congress and the Senate -- I'm sure there are probably members in there right now who keep up the facade of having religion/faith because they know they can't be elected otherwise
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Old 07-07-2002, 06:34 PM   #25
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Do some politicians say they believe in God and don't really mean it? Sure. Does that include American Presidents? Probably. Does that mean they're atheists? No, I don't think so.

There are many people who go to church and who (theoretically) believe in God but don't believe the fact in their hearts: when it comes down to brass tacks, their behavior doesn't coincide with the behavior of a God-fearing individual.

What I'm saying is that there are those whose belief in God is sincere - that they're not closet atheists - but that the sincere belief is shallow.

The really interesting thing is that everyone else - the conscious atheist who claims to believe in God and the deeply religious - probably feel similar pangs of guilt when they say they believe in God: the atheist knows he's lying, and the believer recalls those times he hasn't acted like a believer.
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Old 07-08-2002, 01:24 AM   #26
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I have seen the 95% statistic published numerous times from publications like, Time, Newsweek, US News and World Report, Economist and other magazines and news papers in addition to CNN and other TV. Sorry I'm not siting a specific source on the web. Personally though from my experience, I have found it to be more like 99.99%+. Of course here at interference, the number of people that have participated in the poll has produced a result of around 85%. The mere fact that any politician would have to keep up a facade clearly shows that the percentage number is extremely high. The "Pledge" vote in the senate was 99 to 0, would have been 100 to 0 if Jesse had been there to vote. In the House the vote on the "Pledge" was 432 to 3. The 3 who voted differently noted they believed in God.
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Old 07-08-2002, 10:48 PM   #27
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the vote on the "Pledge" means nothing, no politician in their right mind would do something that made them an outcast, the reason I asked your sources is beccause I thought I remeber seeing the number in the mid-80 percentile range, but I might be wrong, I'm sure there are a number of different polls floating around out there, all seem to be in the 85 - 95% range
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