Am I the only one who can't stand hardcore feminists?

[shart1780]

Wow this thread is still going.

Most of you missed my point completely so I won't argue with you anymore.

I'm just saying I believe in completely equal opportunity, but I believe women and men have genereally have a few different strengths and weaknesses (we know this). And I hate hardcore feminists who misinterpret courtesy for disrespect.

Oh and I'm a guy. I don't know why my profile says I'm a girl heh heh.

 

[U2Kitten]

1. I totally agree that most hardcore feminists are bitches and I cannot stand them, and I hate NOW.

2. Please, don't insult or blame all women for this. As they say on FYM ' but they're not all like that.' I'm not!

The reason I hate them so much is that, as AH mentioned, they think they know what all women want and should do and they do not speak for all of us! Where is a woman's place? Where SHE wants to be! She shouldn't be looked down on for wanting a career, or for deciding not to work and stay home with the kids. I hate pushy feminists like Hillary Clinton who act like a woman who doesn't have a career is a failure and stupid and wrong. She can kiss my ass!

 

[martha]

Where is a woman's place? Where SHE wants to be! She shouldn't be looked down on for wanting a career, or for deciding not to work and stay home with the kids. I hate pushy feminists like Hillary Clinton who act like a woman who doesn't have a career is a failure and stupid and wrong. She can kiss my ass!

Um. It's because of "pushy" "bitches" that you do have a choice, have a vote, have almost equal pay, have a right to say something about sexual harassment, have a right to see your rapist prosecuted, have a right to property, have a right to your own income, have a right to pretty much do whatever the fuck you want without having to ask a man.


It's time for some of you to do a little reading.


You don't have to like Hillary, but with women like her and her predecessors, you'd be fucked. Literally and figuratively.


Remember Bono's famous lyric? The one about women, bicycles and fishes? A hardcore feminist wrote it. Gloria Steinem. It used to be on the masthead of Ms. magazine. May still be.

I guess our Bono may be a hardcore feminist.

 

[joyfulgirl]

right on, martha

 

[anitram]

You don't have to like Hillary, but with women like her and her predecessors, you'd be fucked. Literally and figuratively.

Exactly and that is why today's feminism must be looked at in the historical context in which it arose.

 

[Bono's shades]

Martha, you rock!

 

[pax]

 

[U2Kitten]

"Do a little reading" do you think I'm ignorant? I know about Susan B. Anthony, Alice Paul, the suffragets, all that, but I don't consider them the same as hardcore feminists today. In the past, yes, there was a reason for women to fight- they couldn't vote, own property, or as you say do most anything without asking a man. Gains were made and I appreciate them. However, the ones of today are different, they seem to be man haters, housewife haters, pushy, obnoxious bitches I really can't stand at all. They are more fanatical than helpful. It's the same with civil rights people, in the past there was a need for them, but now that most blacks, like most women,aren't feeling opressed anymore they have nothing to do but make fools of themselves. So I equate the radical feminists of today with Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton. Don't bash me for this either, I personally know a kindly elderly black minister who told me exactly what I put about the civil rights people, I never even thought of it before then. He said they wanted to make people feel inferior and downtrodden, because if not, they would be out of a job!

And I do feel that the radical feminists of today who hold such hatred for stay at home cookie baking moms are bitches.

Gotta go, my kids are whining and my cookies are burning!

 

[Golightly Grrl]

Martha, you are a goddess. Thanks for such an awesome post. However, though the fish/bicycle remark is often attributed to Gloria Steinem, I believe it was actually said by someone else. Not sure.

Am I a feminist? Better believe I am. In fact, I wrote a piece on the need for feminism is one of my college's publications and got a great response, especially from older women who can remember a time when they could not get a loan, house or checking account in their own names, were expected to go to college to find a husband, not an education, and just had to cope with it if their husbands beat the crap out of them.

I am so grateful for feminists who laid down their lives so I could vote, get an education, make and keep my own money, live on my own, and reach goals unheard of in my grandmother's day. My own grandmother never even went to high school and now she had two college educated granddaughters, one (my sister) who has put her therapist career aside to raise her baby son and another (me) who has chosen not to have children and is developing a writing career and launching a new local magazine. To me and a ot of feminists, feminism is about choice and opportunities.

Are there some feminists who bash more traditional women. Yes and that sucks. But there are plenty of anti-feminist types who bash women like me. I've been called selfish, hedonistic, and un-womanly because I've chosen not to have children. I've been called a ball busting hag because I want to be appreciated and recognized for my accomplishments.

Sometimes I think women can't win, no matter what they do.

 

[dandy]

It's the same with civil rights people, in the past there was a need for them, but now that most blacks, like most women,aren't feeling opressed anymore they have nothing to do but make fools of themselves.

i'm sorry, i just can't agree with this statement. women and 'non-whites' are still suffering from marginalization and oppression, both locally and (especially) globally. we've happily made some massive steps forward here in north america, but there's still lots of ground to be covered. women and 'non-whites' are consistently the poorest people in the country and the world.

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

Excellent post Golightly Grrl, I agree w/ what you said

I hate stereotypes

 

[U2_Muse]

However, though the fish/bicycle remark is often attributed to Gloria Steinem, I believe it was actually said by someone else. Not sure.

Irina Dunn.

To me and a ot of feminists, feminism is about choice and opportunities.

 

[joyfulgirl]

However, the ones of today are different, they seem to be man haters, housewife haters, pushy, obnoxious bitches I really can't stand at all.

Where are all these horrible-sounding women? Are you saying this is an ongoing experience you have with this type of person? Because it sounds like you are describing a very small minority of feminist women and I can't imagine encountering such a type in such large numbers with such frequency that you would have developed this kind of hostility towards them. I worked in the corporate world in NYC for 15 years and encountered many strong feminist women but only maybe 3 or 4 of the kind you describe, or at least if there were other experiences they weren't memorable. How exactly is all this hatred towards cookie-baking moms expressed in your world?

 

[martha]

Irina Dunn.

Was she a ball-busting hag, too?

 

[sharky]

Martha, great post but I have to agree a bit with Kitten. They had a recent story on 60 Minutes about these "remarkable" women who were lawyers, bankers and advertising execs who *gasp* gave their jobs up to raise their kids. Why would successful educated women do that, they asked. You are right, Martha, it's because of the pushy bitches that we have the choices we have today but why is it that a women who chooses to stay at home with her kids is looked down at by some people as not being feminist? I think the fact that these women are staying home is a good sign. In the '80s, we had to fight to stay in good paying jobs. Now, we can have the choice to be at home. I think its because there has been a change in the women's movement. Society says women in jobs are feminists and women raising kids at home are setting us back. Its not true. We have choices now to stay at home if WE want to. I think that is as much as a step forward as Ms. magazine in the '70s.

Gloria Steinem once said she would never get married. A few years ago, she got married. I think part of that is because as she kept fighting she opened up ore choices for women. You can be a feminist even if you aren't single and working a 9-to-5 job. We still are not where we should be, but we're getting closer.

 

[martha]

I don't consider them the same as hardcore feminists today. In the past, yes, there was a reason for women to fight- they couldn't vote, own property, or as you say do most anything without asking a man. Gains were made and I appreciate them.

Those ladies you mention were the hardcore feminist ball-busters of their time.

but now that most blacks, like most women,aren't feeling opressed anymore they have nothing to do but make fools of themselves.

You still have some reading to do if you believe this.

 

[martha]

it's because of the pushy bitches that we have the choices we have today

As long as you keep this in mind.

Sure, some people are pushy bitches. But to label all feminists as such is a serious misunderstanding of what feminism is. Just as to criticise the choices some women make is.

 

[U2Kitten]

First, I am not stereotyping anyone, Mrs. Springsteen. I am a woman, and I got that minority comment from a black minister. I'm talking PERSONAL experiences here. I hate how easily people love to brush stuff off as you are stereotyping, etc. You have no idea what I'm like as a person or what I think and feel or what I've experienced and I am quite sick and tired of being judged by you!(this going back several years to your previous SN)

Martha, times are different, situations are different. What those ladies did in those days was not the same as the way others behave today. And reading? Well, we all tend to read what we want to read, I'd post you a dozen links you'd call 'stupid' and you could post me a dozen I'd call biased. We are all the product of our own experiences and situations and lives.

 

[U2Kitten]

Where are all these horrible-sounding women? Are you saying this is an ongoing experience you have with this type of person? Because it sounds like you are describing a very small minority of feminist women and I can't imagine encountering such a type in such large numbers with such frequency that you would have developed this kind of hostility towards them. I worked in the corporate world in NYC for 15 years and encountered many strong feminist women but only maybe 3 or 4 of the kind you describe, or at least if there were other experiences they weren't memorable. How exactly is all this hatred towards cookie-baking moms expressed in your world?

HILLARY CLINTON

 

[MrsSpringsteen]

I knew I shouldn't have posted in this thread. My stereotype comment had to do w/ what you said about "feminst bitches" et al, nothing to do w/ the comments about African Americans. You don't want people to judge you, yet you seem to be doing the same thing to "feminists". and anyone else who disagrees w/ you. Your opinion is based upon your life experiences, and that's fine, but that doesn't make your opinion the one and only valid one-same goes for anyone.

I don't judge you, but I do have opinions on what you post. There really was no need for you to go off on me like you just did, and regarding your comments about my previous SN, one reason I changed it was to avoid interaction w/ you..and a few other people here who gave me problems. I wasn't posting under an alter for certain purposes -who would do that, right?

So honestly I am "quite sick and tired" of putting up w/ crap like this, so pls just leave me alone.

 

[U2democrat]

i knew there was a reason why i was avoiding reading this thread. ouch.

 

[joyfulgirl]

HILLARY CLINTON

So, Hillary said 12 years (?) ago that she could have either stayed home and baked cookies or pursued a career, and she has been demonized ever since as a bitch who hates housewives? Or am I missing something? Does she constantly rag on housewives or something?

 

[verte76]

I don't like stereotypes either. My own mother is a life-long "stay at home" mom. She did work while we were in college for $$ reasons, but that's it. She's also got a mind of her own. No one tells her what to think. I don't fit into any nice little idealogical box either.

 

[anitram]

Mad love for Hillary. I'd love to see her become president someday just to see if it really is possible for humans to spontaneously combust.

 

[nbcrusader]

Hopefully she will run for office in Canada so you can vote for her

 

[anitram]

If only!

 

[martha]

Hopefully she will run for office in Canada so you can vote for her

This made me giggle.