Am I the only one who can't stand hardcore feminists? - Page 3 - U2 Feedback

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Old 10-17-2004, 03:07 PM   #31
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My fiance'e is a feminist.
Not hardcore but a feminist.

Strong minded, bright and elegant.

The way our Creator wanted all ladies to be I believe.

She folds my socks quite well also

diamond
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Old 10-17-2004, 03:39 PM   #32
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Old 10-17-2004, 03:56 PM   #33
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Old 10-17-2004, 04:44 PM   #34
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My aunt is a vice president at a top 20 company in the U.S. My uncle stays at home, raises the kids and has a part-time job as a substitute teacher. My fiance and I spent last Wednesday night folding laundry. He also does the dishes in our house except when he cooks. I do them those days. and he can sure as hell tell you that I don't make cakes very well.

Why is feminism a bad word? I'm proud to say I'm a feminist. It makes me sick that half the people in my office are women yet only one of the top ten editing positions is held by a woman. It makes me mad to know that if I wasn't in a union, I would not be making as much money as my male counterparts.

At home, I hang the pictures, I rebuilt the futon when we moved, I grabbed as many boxes as my fiance when we had to take them up flights of stairs. I do the errands while the fiance is at work. And I am grateful when he heads to the grocery store while I'm working.

There is nothing wrong with me working. There is nothing wrong with me staying at home to raise my future kids if I ever want to. There is nothing wrong with me believing my opinion matters. And while I may get high strung under pressure, that's my personality and not because I'm a woman. There are plenty of men who have punched holes in walls or yelled under pressure but no one ever calls them "emotional".

Yes, I do like having an occasional door opened for me. Yes, I do occasionally try my hand at making dessert. But that's my decision and not because society has told me to do that. Feminism is not only believing that women are equal to men. It's believing that women have the choice to NOT do these things if they choose to.

And yes, I know men and women are physically different. There are definite physical hinderences women face. But in 100 years, women are expected to run faster than men because their physical development at this point is at a higher percentage than men. Besides, how many men do know that have survived passing a watermelon through their rectum? A woman's tolerance for pain is much higher than men or your mother would have never given birth to you.

And you know who taught me all this? My mother AND my father.

end of the rant of someone who believes there is nothing hardcore about being a feminist.
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Old 10-17-2004, 06:46 PM   #35
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whenhiphopdrovethebigcars, my respect for you went up eleven notches with that comment.

Like capitalism, the playing field for the genders isn't level. It seems fair go, but it's not. Women can get the job that they love, they can fight for equal pay and respect, etc, but they have to struggle ten times as hard as their male counterparts. A woman has to be outstanding in her job as, say, manager whereas a mediocre male would obtain her job easier. Anyone read New Scientist lately? where there was a groundbreaking study illustrating this very point that women in the field of science aren't being promoted as much as the men - this is ironic considering that the number of females are increasing in this field. This is just one example that you can extrapolate to other industries.

That said, I think the ones who give women grief are often women themselves and not the men. Women beat each other down, they can be nastier than men, they pressure fellow females into conforming to their roles in society/family/work, women pressure other women into finding a financially secure husband, girls who want to be rockstars are encouraged to learn how to cook instead, women frown upon other women who don't feel like crossing their legs when they sit, women expect other women to be "lady-like", bla bla bla. hiphop is right, women are still operating in a man's world, according to the men's rules.

To the person who started this thread (I forget your name): I used to be a female who hated hardcore feminists, too, but after informing myself and being educated by some reasonable women who proclaimed themselves feminists (to other people, they'd be labelled "hardcore feminists"), I completely changed my view.

Feminists who think that insulting all men is ok, and who assume all men are machoists trying to prove themselves, are wrong. The main thing you have to keep in mind is that the playing field isn't fair to begin with.

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Old 10-17-2004, 07:36 PM   #36
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great posts, sharky and foray. i couldn't agree more.
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Old 10-17-2004, 11:58 PM   #37
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It's also important to remember that society likes to focus on the more radical aspects of any social movement, in order to disguise the reality of the struggle.

So what feminists do you hear about? The ones who felt the ride "Pirates of the Caribbean" was sexist and needed to be changed.

You hear about the woman who believes the requirements for a male-dominated field should be altered so she can take part.

You DON'T hear about your average, every day woman who simply believes she should be able to work, be paid and promoted as she deserves, play the sport she wants to play, wear the clothes she wants to wear, etc.
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Old 10-18-2004, 02:52 AM   #38
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Thanks iacrobat, SD and foray.

iacrobat, I never heard of Wendell Berry. But maybe I´ll read some.

foray, eleven notches? hehe .) Excellent post.
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Old 10-18-2004, 03:46 PM   #39
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I never said I don't like feminists. I said more than once that I believe in totally equal opportunity. I just hate the ones who act like battleaxes when you try to treat em well. That's what I meant by hardcore.
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Old 10-18-2004, 04:05 PM   #40
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Re: Am I the only one who can't stand hardcore feminists?

Quote:
Originally posted by shart1780
And another idiotic thing feminists think: They think they're equal to men in every way. Again, BS. Men and women have different qualities physically and mentally. It's just how we were created. Men are physically stronger and they always will be. Yeah of course there's some exceptions, but very rarely. Also, most men are more level headed than women. This is true.

Is this a bad thing? No. Women are better at ALOT of things. Important things. My dad could never have raised my brother and I like my mom has. He's better at what he does, she's better at what she does. Different is good. Not everyone is the same. Just because women aren't big and powerful doesn't mean they're unimportant or insignificant. I'm tired of this mentality that you have to be an overbearing leader to be important. It's simply not true. Heck, in the Bible it says the greatest among us are the servants. Not saying woman should be servants of course. Just making a point.

My girlfriend appreciates my courtesy very much, as do most non-crapheaded... I mean feminist females. She'll do girly things for me that I appreciate very much. You know, baking me cookies, making sandwiches for us etc etc.. A feminist friend of hers is constantly getting on her back telling her that that's what stupid, old-fashioned ditzy girls do. No... that's completely stupid. Girls are good at this stuff, and guys like me absolutely love it. I love it when she makes me cookies. It's more than just cookies to me, it's extremely considerate of her. It's not wrong for girls to cook or try to please their boyfriends, you stupid feminists.
Shart -- read what I have bolded from your first post. Men are level-headed? Then why did a Yankees pitcher put himself on teh disabled list by punching a hole in the clubhouse wall? Your father couldn't have raised you the way your mother did? Last time I checked, both of my parents raised me. The Bible says the greatest among us are the servants? If you're not saying women are servants, what are you saying by quoting that passage? Girls are good at baking cookies and making sandwiches? Not all the girls I know -- hell, I tossed a cake in the trash two weeks ago when it came out like crap. Oh, but since I'm the girl, I baked the cake.

This is why I have a problem with your post. You say you only hate the hardcore feminists, but your posts is full of stereotypes. Your mom raised you better than your dad, girls are good at cooking. Don't you see that that's offensive? I may be able to make cupcakes, but it's not because I'm woman -- it's because I read the directions on the box. You too can make cupcakes by reading the box. Oh wait, men don't read directions. Well then, nevermind.

I understand you're trying to say that if a woman WANTS to bake cookies, no one should tell her its too girly. But dude, you really need to reexamine the words you use to support your argument and stop falling into the stereotype syndrome. Would you like it if I said your opinions were typical of men who are threatened by women in this world? Probably not, so don't go making stereotypes about my cooking and child rearing skills. I have a bachelor's degree and master's degree and work for one of the best news organizations in this country at the age of 27 and I didn't get here because I made cookies for the office. And I didn't have a emotional hissy fit when I passed over for a job because I'm a woman -- I had a hissy fit because I was better qualified then the people who kissed the men's asses in my office to get ahead of me.
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Old 10-18-2004, 04:17 PM   #41
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you complain about disrespect, yet you're being so... disrespectful. respect is a two-way street, my friend.

to sharky's last post.
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Old 10-18-2004, 07:35 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally posted by dandy
you complain about disrespect, yet you're being so... disrespectful. respect is a two-way street, my friend.

to sharky's last post.
Two way street it is, and I'm a feminist. Cheers
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Old 10-18-2004, 07:40 PM   #43
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I guess, after looking over this thread, shart, the short answer to your question is

yes, you are the only one

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Old 10-18-2004, 08:31 PM   #44
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One of my male co-workers at the place I used to work broke a phone when he slammed the receiver against the wall during one of his temper tantrums. I've never seen one of my female co-workers behave that way, despite the stress many of them are under.

As for women who get mad if you hold a door open for them - I've never met a woman who didn't like that. I know I like it - I don't care if a guy does it for me or another woman - it's just a general act of courtesy. And if I happen to get to the door first, I always hold it open for whoever is behind me.

(Edited to add I consider myself a feminist and am proud of it!)
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Old 10-19-2004, 09:09 PM   #45
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Re: courtesy/ chivalry

shart17etc, I see what you mean about women who seem ungrateful when you are chivalrous toward them. Most women I know like it. Some see it as unnecessary.

For me, if it's about courtesy, I'm ok. Like if the person is holding the door for me or carries my luggage. That's something I would do for my girl friends as well, to make them feel welcome. If it's about chivalry i.e. something the man would do for me but not to his fellow males, then I think it's unnecessary and couldn't care less, because to me it shows that he's more interested in drawing chicks to him. My ex, for instance, recently picked up all these chivalrous moves so he could impress the ladies. Me, I prefer more realness and sincerity, and I've always been this way even before I realized I was a feminist.

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