Adam, The Dinousaurs. The Creation..How do you BELIEVERS reconcile the EvolutionFolk? - Page 3 - U2 Feedback

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Old 07-09-2002, 04:52 PM   #31
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Does it really matter how the earth came into existance?
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Old 07-09-2002, 04:54 PM   #32
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I've got your answer: The bible is basically bull shit. There you go.

If you're someone that can put unquestionable faith in a religion that claims that the bible is literally from the mouth of God, (despite the fact that it was several "men" who wrote it through their 'personal' 'contact' with this 'god'), go ahead and believe that.

How can the believers of this text rationalize the dates and the timelines? THEY CAN'T. God is all knowing and if he wrote the book (as many people claim he did), he would not make the mistake of saying 4,000 years ago, when he meant 40,000,000 years ago. We're not talking about some jerk who works at the neighborhood Wal-mart, we're talking about G-diggity, the big "G"....we're talking about GOD, people!!!!!!!!!! It's because of these inconsistecies (spelling) in the book that I don't trust ANY OF IT. And since so many religions have their own specialized, customized interpreations of this "story book" I don't bother trying to figure out which faith is more important.
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Old 07-09-2002, 04:59 PM   #33
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There has been whole thread dedicated to the validity of the bible...I'm too lazt to go and find it though, I even started it!!

I BY NO MEANS think the bible is bullshit...thats offensive! but I also don't think one can place 100% of their faith upon it. There as been too much subjection to biases and errors in translation/transcription for my comfort.

But again...IT'S NOT BULLSHIT!!

My history proffessor was athiest and he uses the bible as a text book for ancient history.
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Old 07-09-2002, 05:02 PM   #34
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give this a read...



Bible thread
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Old 07-09-2002, 05:10 PM   #35
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True, the Bible has a lot of valuble lessons. "The Golden Rule", etc etc.

True, maybe a big chunk of it isn't "bullshit". I'll agree with you that it provides an entertaining description of life during the the years spanning 1,000 AD to whenever it trails off with the Apocalypse.

The reason I said it was Bullshit, is due to my disbelief in the number of people who take it at face value. I honestly don't see how anyone could believe that a book would or could ever be written personally by God (as scribed by the men). I find it to be amazingly absurd that we as a society are willing to disregard major fallacies in the hopes that our FAITH won't be exposed as the lie it most certainly appears to be.
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Old 07-09-2002, 05:50 PM   #36
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The Bible is right. Science is right.

Creation is right. PARTS of evolution are right.

The six days of creation in the Bible take place in the 16 billion years from Big Bang to now. When the big bang happened, all the matter in the universe was contained in a miniscule point. the density, gravity, and speed things moved was intense, with time moving at a ridiculous pace. The matter expanded, and time slowed down. Eventually we are at the size we are now and time is pretty much constant for this universe.

The theory of relativity shows that time is relative. Factors like speed, gravity, and mass affect how time is perceived and experienced. To make a long story short, someone looking in can experience 6 days while someone inside can experience 16 billion years. The first day spanned around 8 billion years (16b ago), the second spanned 4 (8b ago), the third 2 (4b ago), the fourth 800 million (2b ago), etc. etc. Eventually it all adds up. The really interesting thing, is that the day the Bible records plants appearing, lines up with the number of years ago that scientists say plant life appeard in the water.

This is a really bastardized version of the explanation. To get the real deal, read The Science of God by Gerald Schroeder. He presents the case from neither an atheistic or christian point of view. Using math, physics, the torah, and the kabbalah, he shows how they all work together. Check it out.

God and science work together to help us interpret the universe. If you abandon either of those two, you'll go off track.
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Old 07-09-2002, 06:03 PM   #37
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Dano,

If God DOES exist, what's so incredible that He would influence and inspire men to write about Him?

In my opinion, there's NOTHING incredible about the idea.

Certainly, there may be mistranslations, etc., but what that illustrates is this: once God inspired the books to be written (if that did in fact occur), the books were still subject to the same "natural" forces that cause them to become blurred over time.

What - specifically - do you object to? The fact that, taken literally, Genesis gives the age of the universe to be MUCH smaller than what we believe to be the case?

Why is it necessary that Genesis be taken literally? After all, it's certainly not an eye-witness account; we believe that God told Moses what to write.

If Christ spoke to his disciples in metaphor and parables, why couldn't God do the same to Moses?

(And I submit the following: if scientific evidence ABSOLUTELY aligned with Genesis, we would conclude that Genesis was tampered with to match the evidence. Or if the evidence was overwhelming, free will begins to slip away.)


Beyond all this, most research into the historical figure of Jesus (the central figure of the Bible) actually points to the fact that He DID exist, He WAS crucified, that His grave WAS empty, and that His followers from the very beginning asserted that He rose from the grave - and asserted it with such confidence that they were willing to DIE for that belief.

But our faith appears to be based on a lie, huh?

I demand details.
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Old 07-09-2002, 06:22 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by Danospano
I've got your answer: The bible is basically bull shit. There you go.
Well I'm not going to argue with your offensive choice of terms since I believe 90% of the articles you post in FYM here on wackos are complete bull shit

But I do wonder what you think of some of the biblical prophecies that have come true.

Quote:
If you're someone that can put unquestionable faith in a religion that claims that the bible is literally from the mouth of God, (despite the fact that it was several "men" who wrote it through their 'personal' 'contact' with this 'god'), go ahead and believe that.
You have obviously not had the voice in your heart yet, or you chose to ignore it because maybe you weren't ready.

For this i do not fault you personally, but i do offer you the idea that not every person of devout religious faith is represented by our very own fine examples of corruption (Oral Roberts) in Oklahoma, and the somewhat nearsighted following he has.


Quote:
How can the believers of this text rationalize the dates and the timelines? THEY CAN'T. God is all knowing and if he wrote the book (as many people claim he did), he would not make the mistake of saying 4,000 years ago, when he meant 40,000,000 years ago.
GOd wrote the book through men, humans who are not perfect as he is. GOD allows to do as we wish and gives us the choice to make mistakes in every aspect of our lives or trust him. This is applicable in every instance, to even the peple who translated it down through the generations into what we know of it now.

WHo is to say that 800 years then is just 80 years now? A generation, depending on what i just said could be 10-20 years, no? But what if they really lived 800 years, then a generation would be what???

SO the translation of days and years cannot really be the same as we know it now.

Quote:
We're not talking about some jerk who works at the neighborhood Wal-mart, we're talking about G-diggity, the big "G"....we're talking about GOD, people!!!!!!!!!!
oh please

Quote:
It's because of these inconsistecies (spelling) in the book that I don't trust ANY OF IT.
Well blame the publisher then!
But what say you, to the idea that we have the correct spelling to every word. And they (the authors of the bible), who came before us way before us did not??

That would be almost arrogant, no?

Quote:
And since so many religions have their own specialized, customized interpreations of this "story book" I don't bother trying to figure out which faith is more important.
SO you give up on religion(s) then???

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Old 07-09-2002, 06:41 PM   #39
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Bubba:
I think we agree on the fact that the Bible is full of metaphors. (That's good!). The original question I believe had something to do with how we rationalize the difference between what evolution/science tells us and what the Bible tells us. As a Christian, a person is professing a belief in the Bible. That it is God's word, right? My objection to the entire debate over time and the origin of our species lies in the fact that nobody with any sense should trust the authors of the Bible. Those men were human, just as you and I....even just like some unsavory characters like Osama Bin Laden, George W. Bush, Orpah, you name it (LOL)....Okay let's not get off the point. What I dislike about the bible or the Koran or any piece of faith-based literature is that it was written by a species that will alter history, distort reality, and flat out lie in order to exert power and influence over other people.

I don't know the truth. But I have learned the nature of human beings and I'm not going to have blind faith in a book that was written by "men" over 2000 years ago. It may contain facts, but I'm in no place to begin choosing what's real and what's made up.

That's my objection.

I'd also like to add that I don't question the power of God to have an impact or influence on humans. I believe that honest, charitable people can speak to God. I really do. I don't, however, intend to do whatever they tell me just because they "spoke to God the other night".

Here's a question from Bubba and everyone else: If someone came before you tomorrow and said they spoke to God the other night and were told to kill 15 dogs, 17 cats, and all the birds in the neighborhood, would you laugh at him, call the police, or help him with his "assignment"?
You know where I'm going, so I won't explain the point of the question. Humans wrote the bible. That's a fact. The Catholic Church as well as other houses of worship have altered and censored portions of the original scripture because it didn't fit in with their agenda. That's a fact. With this fact in particular, I find it hard to believe in it's entirity. Believing in a God, sure, but the Bible is another question.
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Old 07-09-2002, 06:43 PM   #40
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Iam going to take a nap.
I will be posting my theory based on many different religions..in a short while..

DB9
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Old 07-09-2002, 07:47 PM   #41
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now as I recall...god said let there be light on the third day



now if you dont' have light..you dont' have night and day

if you dont' have night and day..you can't have days in our sense as we believe it.


a day is only 24 hours on earth...and is based on the earths rotation...now a being independant of the earth would most certainly have a different perception of time.


Also we tend to think of time/space in terms of classical and not relatavistic mechanics.... when the big bang occured...classical mechanics does not apply

Bottom line...if you think that the 6 days in the bible means 144 hours. or that some fool in scottsdale is somehow going to figure it all out.....you prolly ate paint chips as a child
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Old 07-09-2002, 08:00 PM   #42
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I believe in the "RNA World" theory, and in evolution.

I think God's responsible for all of it - I just disagree that he did it in the way the Bible professes.
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Old 07-09-2002, 09:20 PM   #43
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I ve studied the major religions of the world.
I ve read countless religous books. I have a library full of books:idea:
I ve read The KJV of the Bile twice cover to cover..


Here's my belief based on what I read/studied-

We are created in the literal/express image of God.:idea:
We are his children and he loves us. We are on this earth to learn and develop faith out of God's presense..like a child is sent off to school:idea:
He sent his Son down to cover the rent..ie give us (Grace).. pay the rent ( when we mess up or needed help). God knew we couldnt do it alone.
We are to follow his own Son's example..for our short comings-when needed..and if we would follow his Son's example we could live w him again someday.:idea: The Golden Rule..Commandments ect. were his Son's example.

As far as the gender of God -not important in this discussion.

When God created Earth..he didnt do it in 6 short days and kicked backed on the 7th. It took thousands of years and it was a process...
Some of the bible is to be taken literally ..some not.
You cannot take the Book of Isaiah literally, for example- heavens no.

During the Creation process..I believe God took chunks of other planets/matter..that already existed ..and clumbed them together..
These planets had longed served their purpose..and had the dinosaur bones and cave man bones were ALREADY there , in these chunks, even before Adam arrived.:idea:


Envision a child w/alot of different flavors of Playdoh Get the idea? In those pieces of Playdoh are pieces of broken toys ie -bones ..fossils.. Hes clumbping them together in his own little universe. This is what God did during the Creation

Who says God doesnt have a sense of humor? He wanted to test our faithfulness. Charles Darwin eat your heart out.

He had prophets sent down from time to time to warn his children..us thru the ages.
He even sent a Prophetess now and again..Hope this makes sense.


At a future date..I suspect a lot of you will say.."Man that DB9 was right about the Creation"..
Peace
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Old 07-09-2002, 09:26 PM   #44
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that is truly...the crappest explanation I have heard


how is this supposed to be based on all the religions of the world again???

you made us wait for that??
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Old 07-09-2002, 09:42 PM   #45
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Arun.
Sometimes the answers are NOT as complicated as we think.:idea:..Man has complicated the truth by omitting/changing/deleting histories to control us thru out the ages.. ..:idea

And I have PROOF God has a sense of humor..ie Can YOU say "Hamilton"?

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