Abortion advocates misguided on Alito? - U2 Feedback

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Old 11-01-2005, 01:48 PM   #1
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Abortion advocates misguided on Alito?

I was watching the network news on ABC last night and the Alito appoinment was the obvious opening story. A major section of the report had to so with Alito's support of a law which would require women to inform their husband/boyfriend that they were choosing to abort. A few abortion rights activists were interviewed and expressed what an extremist opinion this was.

Does a father have a right to know?

Is Alito's position really that extreme?

ABC News ran a poll that day which showed 72% of Americans believe the father should know.
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Old 11-01-2005, 01:58 PM   #2
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The question before Alito was: Is a requirement of spousal notification (not consent) before an abortion unconstitutional?

Answering "no" seems to be reasonable and not at all "extreme".
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Old 11-01-2005, 02:42 PM   #3
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nice incendiary title for the thread!

(takes one to know one)

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Old 11-01-2005, 02:49 PM   #4
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As I recall, one of the problems raised by the dissenting opinions was, What about the case of battered wives? It's not an improbable question. A colleague of mine fled from her abusive husband several years ago after finding out she was pregnant (which is not infrequently a psychological "wakeup call" for battered women), and while she herself never wanted an abortion (and didn't have one), she remembers vividly the fear of how it might redouble his efforts at pursuit if he found out about the pregnancy (he never did). She had to live on the run between shelters for the better part of a year and a half, with an infant in tow for the latter part of it.
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Old 11-01-2005, 02:56 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511
nice incendiary title for the thread!

(takes one to know one)

you're right...

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Old 11-01-2005, 03:43 PM   #6
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Does anyone know-
Is Alito calling for women to get "permission" from their husbands to have an abortion, or just to "inform" them that they are having an abortion?
Very different things.
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Old 11-01-2005, 03:44 PM   #7
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i'm not against abortion, per say. but if i was with someone and they got an abortion without telling me first, i'd be crushed.

i understand the "battered wife" argument... but there needs to be some sort of comming round we can reach on that issue.
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:00 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Headache in a Suitcase
i'm not against abortion, per say. but if i was with someone and they got an abortion without telling me first, i'd be crushed.

i understand the "battered wife" argument... but there needs to be some sort of comming round we can reach on that issue.


and if a man gets a vasectomy

should the wife be notified?


or even if a women gets birth control pills
should the husband be notified?
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:02 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by BorderGirl
Does anyone know-
Is Alito calling for women to get "permission" from their husbands to have an abortion, or just to "inform" them that they are having an abortion?
Very different things.
it was inform (notify)

like with a 14 year old girl
the parents are to be notified

this was his basis
the wife is like the 14 year old

and the husband is the parent
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:25 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by deep


it was inform (notify)

like with a 14 year old girl
the parents are to be notified

this was his basis
the wife is like the 14 year old

and the husband is the parent
Considering that, upon conception, a father is responsible for the child and the child gains full rights of inheritance (showing two different aspects of legal status), it does not seem unreasonable to promote communication between spouses.

Drawing an analogy with parents and their children was likely meant to be inflammatory, not reasoned thinking.
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:35 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader




Drawing an analogy with parents and their children was likely meant to be inflammatory, not reasoned thinking.

are you familiar with Alito's decent

and the basis for it?
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:37 PM   #12
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what if a woman purposefully sabotages her birth control and doesn't tell her husband and gets pregnant.

could he be free of any legal obligation to the child if he can prove that she was deceitful?

this sort of happened to a friend of mine ... rumor has it, he was getting ready to leave the relationship and then suddenly, she's pregnant! so they got married. and he never went to film school.
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:37 PM   #13
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Interesting, that, nbc. I try not to view it as convenience when we look at the various views, but responsibility is deemed very much there in a wanted, though (for example) teen pregnancy. We rally and raise our fists that young boys and men need to learn responsibility. Does this change though, if the pregnancy is not wanted by the woman? Is his responsibily and right or obligation altered by this fact? I really dont want to go back to the issue of whether this is an issue for the woman's body or for the unborn foetus, but I guess I ask is there an answer which fits all?
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:52 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbcrusader


Considering that, upon conception, a father is responsible for the child and the child gains full rights of inheritance (showing two different aspects of legal status), it does not seem unreasonable to promote communication between spouses.

Drawing an analogy with parents and their children was likely meant to be inflammatory, not reasoned thinking.


So you have said Alito does not execute reasoned thinking?

I do agree also about his ruling on uzis and machine guns.

He thinking is flawed, he should be rejected.

Quote:
Alito voted to uphold it as a judge on the U.S. 3rd Circuit Court of Appeals. He argued that the law did not put an "undue burden" on women, and he did so based on his reading of a standard set by Justice Sandra Day O'Connor in earlier cases that tested whether teenage girls must notify their parents before getting an abortion.

But when the Pennsylvania case reached the Supreme Court, O'Connor and the court majority rejected Alito's view and characterized the "spousal notification" law as an insult to married women.

"Women do not lose their constitutionally protected liberty when they marry," the court said in an opinion written in part by O'Connor. It is "repugnant to our present understanding of marriage" to permit the state "to enable the husband to wield an effective veto over his wife's decision," the high court said.

O'Connor set a middle course. She said states could regulate abortion so long as they did not put an "undue burden" on a woman's decision to end a pregnancy. She voted to uphold regulations that required doctors to wait 24 hours after a pregnant woman asked to have an abortion. She also upheld rules that required teenage girls to notify a parent before seeking an abortion.

Alito said.

"The Pennsylvania Legislature could have rationally believed that … discussion prior to the abortion" between a wife and her husband might prompt her to rethink her plans to obtain an abortion, he said. "We have no authority to overrule that legislative judgment even if we deem it unwise or worse," he concluded.

The case was appealed to the Supreme Court, and it set up a showdown in 1992 over abortion and the fate of Roe vs. Wade. To the surprise of many observers, the court, despite the recent addition of two Republican appointees, issued a resounding 5-4 opinion that pledged to uphold the right of women to choose abortion.

The court's opinion also upheld the 3rd Circuit's ruling and threw out the "spousal notice" rule. O'Connor made clear she found the Pennsylvania ruling offensive to women.

"A state may not give to a man the kind of dominion over his wife that parents exercise over their children," she said in the joint opinion for the court.
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Old 11-01-2005, 04:58 PM   #15
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Sadly, the article either mischaracterizes O'Connor's statements or O'Connor is wrong.

The law dealt with notification, not consent. The law did not place any veto power in the hands of the husband.

But I can see how this gets miscommunicated as many have asked (here and elsewhere) whether the law covered notice or consent.
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