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Old 03-19-2003, 12:52 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by cloudimani
I think someone has been watching too much "24"
it's the best show on tv...you can't watch too much 24
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Old 03-21-2003, 11:01 PM   #17
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I have to agree, Arun V. Real- reality TV. 24 hasn't been on since, whenever. It is hitting a bit too close to reality.. Last episode, I think, (nuclear bomb went off in LA) made me cry. Geez, who wants to watch reality TV...lets watch a real war. May not see it again till this war dies down.... Won't hear the B52's in the Uk either, or Sunday Bloody Sunday, etc.
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Old 03-21-2003, 11:21 PM   #18
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just in case anyone was interested to know how long this war has really been going on, you can visit this site:

http://www.ccmep.org/usbombingwatch/2003.htm#2003

and really get frustrated.

i was having a discussion with my husband today and he wanted to know how I felt about the U.S. attacking/attempting to assasinate a world leader. He said he hadn't heard any condemnation of the U.S. trying to assasinate another world leader. I had heard brief mention of it on NPR...but it's too much of a condemnation of U.S. action for TV media to refer to the fact.

It's not a good feeling when the U.S. (the world's policeman?) violates many international laws. If the (so-called?) policemen are breaking the rules, what hope do we have to ask the rest of the world to abide by the rules?

I'm not saying Saddam should be forgiven or protected. I wish he wasn't in charge. But I also wish Bush wasn't in charge. It's just too easy for him to lead the country against a "known" enemy than to battle the scary, sickening, sad things that make life here in the U.S. so terrible for many. I'm talking about poverty, health care, literacy, racism, etc.

I'm not saying I want more terror attacks. I want all terror attacks to end. Maybe one way to do that is to pave the way for better relations between the U.S. and other nations. Maybe we need to think about abandoning our internationally exploitative capitalist economy. Maybe we need to be more tolerant of different faiths without accepting discrimination and violence. From ANY faith.

I am mostly sickened by the way people polarize into different corners and never even try to see the sense of protestors who *perhaps* legimiately fear the effects of this war...which VERY LIKELY could be the same effects of no war. Who's to say taking action or NOT taking action will cause more terror...or won't?

It's not really useful to just talk about any scenario, negative or positive, tomorrow or next year, without thinking about how our past actions (as a citizen, a city, a nation) have led us to where we are today, and using that KNOWLEDGE and LESSONS to guide our future choices. That's why this website is interesting. It gave me some perspective on what's been going on in the past. Throught my training as a historian, we always teased people who over-quoted Santana, but it's appropriate now. "Those who don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it."

What lessons can we learn from the past? How can they help us now? Let's take a look at possible scenarios of the future and discuss rationally how we can work to avoid the worst ones and achieve the best....
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Old 03-22-2003, 03:01 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by elizabeth

i was having a discussion with my husband today and he wanted to know how I felt about the U.S. attacking/attempting to assasinate a world leader. He said he hadn't heard any condemnation of the U.S. trying to assasinate another world leader. I had heard brief mention of it on NPR...but it's too much of a condemnation of U.S. action for TV media to refer to the fact.

It's not a good feeling when the U.S. (the world's policeman?) violates many international laws. If the (so-called?) policemen are breaking the rules, what hope do we have to ask the rest of the world to abide by the rules?

I'm not saying Saddam should be forgiven or protected. I wish he wasn't in charge. But I also wish Bush wasn't in charge. It's just too easy for him to lead the country against a "known" enemy than to battle the scary, sickening, sad things that make life here in the U.S. so terrible for many. I'm talking about poverty, health care, literacy, racism, etc.

I'm not saying I want more terror attacks. I want all terror attacks to end. Maybe one way to do that is to pave the way for better relations between the U.S. and other nations. Maybe we need to think about abandoning our internationally exploitative capitalist economy. Maybe we need to be more tolerant of different faiths without accepting discrimination and violence. From ANY faith.

I am mostly sickened by the way people polarize into different corners and never even try to see the sense of protestors who *perhaps* legimiately fear the effects of this war...which VERY LIKELY could be the same effects of no war. Who's to say taking action or NOT taking action will cause more terror...or won't?

It's not really useful to just talk about any scenario, negative or positive, tomorrow or next year, without thinking about how our past actions (as a citizen, a city, a nation) have led us to where we are today, and using that KNOWLEDGE and LESSONS to guide our future choices. That's why this website is interesting. It gave me some perspective on what's been going on in the past. Throught my training as a historian, we always teased people who over-quoted Santana, but it's appropriate now. "Those who don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it."

What lessons can we learn from the past? How can they help us now? Let's take a look at possible scenarios of the future and discuss rationally how we can work to avoid the worst ones and achieve the best....
It's a fine idea, except that you get wildly contradictory lessons from the different bits of the past, as I've found out after reading a gazillion viewpoints and articles on war, so I'm not really sure how much of a guide they can really provide.

I've got incredibly mixed feelings about the war and its consequences, but I'm sure as hell not conflicted about the idea of removing Saddam. I don't like Bush much and I hate the way he handled the case for war, but I'm genuinely baffled when people put him anywhere near Saddam. If anything you'll get an opportunity to replace him come the next election; no such luck for Iraq.

While I agree that US needs to work on establishing better relations with the other countries, I do not think that the terrorism problems have everything to do with the way US behaves itself, but also with the other countries, too, and IMO it's naive to think that the peace only ever requires the effort from one side.
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Old 03-22-2003, 08:46 AM   #20
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Originally posted by brettig
*Just showing how the 'possible scenario' game can be played.
I am afraid that the most probable scenario is that sooner or later US will come under terrorist attack, more devastating that 9/11...
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Old 03-22-2003, 08:56 AM   #21
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Originally posted by ALEXRUS


I am afraid that the most probable scenario is that sooner or later US will come under terrorist attack, more devastating that 9/11...
I too think this will be the outcome. One of my beliefs was that we could act without the UN if we had the support of Arab nations in the area. THis we clearly do not have. It needed to be a much broader coalition in the area. Saudi Arabia, Turkey, and Jordan, have not been big enough players in all of this.

Senators Hart and Rudman (the men who predicted 9/11 months earlier) just again issued another report saying America was really not any better off than is was prior to 9/11.
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Old 03-22-2003, 10:01 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by ALEXRUS


I am afraid that the most probable scenario is that sooner or later US will come under terrorist attack, more devastating that 9/11...


:scaredmeggie:
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Old 03-22-2003, 10:07 AM   #23
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:scaredmeggie:

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