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Old 05-03-2005, 12:50 PM   #16
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Originally posted by Irvine511
what's a liberal?
Of, designating, or characteristic of a political party founded on or associated with principles of social and political liberalism, especially in Great Britain, Canada, and the United States.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:12 PM   #17
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The standard definition:

a. Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
b. Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
c. Of, relating to, or characteristic of liberalism.
d. Liberal Of, designating, or characteristic of a political party founded on or associated with principles of social and political liberalism, especially in Great Britain, Canada, and the United States.

The Fox News definition:

a. all those fags you see in pink leather tutus parading down the street in San Francisco
b. all those anti-God atheists you see trying to take God out of Christmas.
c. those responsible for 9/11, the price of gas, teenage pregnancy, abortion, Nambla, insecure borders, Terry Shiavo, Michael Jackson, Ludacris, the Tsunami, Spongebob Squarepants, and reality television.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:13 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by LPU2
The Fox News definition:

a. all those fags you see in pink leather tutus parading down the street in San Francisco
b. all those anti-God atheists you see trying to take God out of Christmas.
c. those responsible for 9/11, the price of gas, teenage pregnancy, abortion, Nambla, insecure borders, Terry Shiavo, Michael Jackson, Ludacris, the Tsunami, Spongebob Squarepants, and reality television.
Was that really necessary?
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:18 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by LPU2
The standard definition:

a. Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry.
b. Favoring proposals for reform, open to new ideas for progress, and tolerant of the ideas and behavior of others; broad-minded.
Is this the self-serving definition or the anti-"conservative" definition?
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:21 PM   #20
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No, actually it wasn't necessary. I'm sure most Americans know by now what Fox News is all about. Nevertheless, I do find it interesting to compare and contrast the definition of "liberalism" with the perception of it.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:24 PM   #21
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Originally posted by nbcrusader


Is this the self-serving definition or the anti-"conservative" definition?
You tell me.

It's straight from dictionary.com. But, y'know, with the parts that Macfist didn't want to include.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:24 PM   #22
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I don't care. Back on topic.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:34 PM   #23
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I think Irvine asked a very valid question. I think Mac you didn't really answer honestly. This question was obviously made to bait, and I've seen your generalizations and stereotyping of liberals over the years in here. So to see your definition of liberal would help in making this thread into something.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:39 PM   #24
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Again: I don't care. Back on topic.

The question for conservatives thread is on the ball, and those with liberal politics know who they are as well, and many of you wear it proudly.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:44 PM   #25
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whatever.
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Old 05-03-2005, 01:55 PM   #26
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Originally posted by BonoVoxSupastar
whatever.


yes.

seems like this thread answered it's own question.

if Mac can't even define the terms of the leading, baiting question he means to pose -- complete with a line of thinking he's planning to employ to lead us to a predetermined conclusion -- then it doesn't seem as if it's even worth participating in.
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Old 05-03-2005, 02:08 PM   #27
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What is a liberal? Inquiring minds want to know. Liberals are *not* people without morals. I'm a liberal and a practicing Catholic. I consider myself a liberal because I believe in government intervention in the laissez-faire capitalism to remedy the problems that come from pure laissez-faire economics.
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Old 05-03-2005, 02:19 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Irvine511
if Mac can't even define the terms of the leading, baiting question he means to pose -- complete with a line of thinking he's planning to employ to lead us to a predetermined conclusion -- then it doesn't seem as if it's even worth participating in.
The intention was not to define "liberal", but since you insist, I would say:

Self-defined "progressives", social libertarians, financial populists. I think that's clear enough.

The "free from bigotry" is not what I buy. John Kerry is the example, and the thread is to discuss whether he qualifies under liberal definition as a "bigot," since after all, many of you might refer to Bush in the same way, even though their stance on homosexuality is nearly identical. For civil unions, against gay marriage.
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Old 05-03-2005, 02:44 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by Macfistowannabe
The intention was not to define "liberal", but since you insist, I would say:

Self-defined "progressives", social libertarians, financial populists. I think that's clear enough.

The "free from bigotry" is not what I buy. John Kerry is the example, and the thread is to discuss whether he qualifies under liberal definition as a "bigot," since after all, many of you might refer to Bush in the same way, even though their stance on homosexuality is nearly identical. For civil unions, against gay marriage.


John Kerry didn't wield bigotry as a political tool to rally the bigoted base of his party the way Bush did. is Bush a bigot on a personal level, probably not -- remember, this is a man who thinks jokes about him giving hand jobs to horses is funny. as a politician, yes, absolutely.

and Republicans have done this for years, they've marshalled hate to get votes (see Nixon and the "southern strategy").

you still haven't defined what a liberal is. and your above definiton is really flawed. many social libertarians would call themselves conservatives and vote republican (fools ... the current GOP is currently constructing a Christian nanny state and bankrupting us all in the process). a progressive is probably different from a liberal ... and what about classical liberals?

the reason i pounced on your use of the word is because i don't think anyone has a clue as to what it really means, and it is used as a word to broadbrush ANYONE who doesn't march in lockstep with the current republican platform. there's such horrible groupthink ... liberals think this, liberals do that ... just look at your comments regarding abortion, and everything that you assume "liberals" believe and you'll see that the word, as you've come to use it, exists only as a McCarthyite political tool and has no attachment to reality.
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Old 05-03-2005, 02:49 PM   #30
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So, the question is: is John Kerry a bigot? I'm going to say no. To me a bigot is someone who comes out with irrational, intense hatred of a certain group. He should have been more decisive about the gay marriage issue in the campaign. The word "bigot" can be used in different ways. Voltaire was called a "bigot" by people in eighteenth century France because he believed in God.
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