a loving God and the Tsunami

[Do Miss America]

When a butterfly flaps its wings in Madagascar it has an effect on what happens here in Chicago. When something is dropped in the ocean it has an effect some thousands of miles away. Everything we do as humans has an effect somewhere else. Nothing is completely "natural".

What we've done to this earth over the millions of years effected and caused this occurrence. God gave us free will therefore whatever happens here is our doing.

 

[Dreadsox]

So let me see if I understand this.....

America caused the earthquake because of consumerism and Global warming?

Who do we blame for earthquakes thousands of years ago? Just want to make sure I am up on things.

 

[Do Miss America]

So let me see if I understand this.....

America caused the earthquake because of consumerism and Global warming?

Who do we blame for earthquakes thousands of years ago? Just want to make sure I am up on things.

Was this in response to my post? I never singled out America.

But we could probably blame farting dinosaurs for earthquakes a long time ago.

 

[DrTeeth]

There's a lot of truth in mystery girl's post, but it has little or nothing to do with earth- and seaquakes.

 

[verte76]

I blame a hell of alot of bad things on greed and consumerism, but earthquakes aren't one of them.

 

[Dreadsox]

Was this in response to my post? I never singled out America.

But we could probably blame farting dinosaurs for earthquakes a long time ago.

No it was a combination of posts....

 

[babyman]

@babyman: I was trying to say that maria wasn't poor at all it's just a story that the leaders in that time made up because they were afraid for Maria and Jesus......
Maria is from the house of Benjamin she's from royal source ......have you looked to the pedigree of Benjamin?

and Jesus was a jewish.....he's from the pedigree of king David and king Salomon both jewish kings.......
Yahweh is hebrews for God what kind of language does the jewish have....maybe it could be hebrew????

yes, you're right about what Jesus was doing here on earth but the bible says Jesus is a human being with "superpowers" while in the lost documents they've retrieved Jesus just was a human being just like you and me without "powers"

I know Durante 'Dante' Alighieri(Divina Commedia; the journey between hell-purgatory and heaven) and he's right politic and religy doesn't match but they always will have to do with each other just look to all the wars fighted because of different religy

I also know the acopalypse my granddad used to be a priest.......
and I believe one day earth will dissappear when I don't know nobody knows that......but I think it's when the humankind destroyed earth that much they're going to die.......all the poisoned air, nucleair weapons, cutting from rainforests etc.

you're right when saying that trusting the bible is a matter of believing....you trust in the bible when you want but hey can somebody tell me how you can trust the bible while it's put together by a roman emporior and not only roman also one who was a heathen emporior(Constantin) how weird is that????
and to come back up that human being thing.....they've(the leaders in that time among Constantin) declared Jesus to a holy just 300AC before that they wouldn't have thought of that....but they did this because Constantin was a excellent emporior he saw that the the popularity of Jesus was growing and so he thought why don't we make profit of that......and don't say Constantin was a catholic because he wasn't.....he got baptised just before his dead if he was a catholic then it seems more logical that he's baptised much earlier....

don't blame me now for what I'm saying now I just ask you to forgot the bible and just ask yourself a few questions, just for a moment and try to find the answers to that question in history books then you can back to what the bible says:
who says Jesus is the son of God????? a lot of people(not me) also very, very famous people say that Jesus just was a human being not the son of God.........
other question is how accurate is the bible and how accurate is history?? is it true or is it invented?? I'm sure many passages are happen I'm also sure many things are invented.....
who says there's a God??? maybe the earth has begun with the evolution theory??
this and many other questions I haven't find an answer just like millions other people but I'm still searching for my explanation.......

I don't there's a God but at all I don't believe there isn't a God it sounds strange but I'm still on my journey to God and I'm asking your comments on these questions

yeah, that might take confusion, and maybe that's exactly what the church was trying to do in that times. i say you just this, only the bible which recognises the name of god is the right bible, there you can have all your questions clear. constantin and many popes have cancelled lots of important parts of the bible through the history, for a question of power, but mainly to move people away from the truth. believe me, if i'd have to tell you something about church's tricks it would take too long, and maybe someone would get offended, and i don't want this at all. take a bible of jehova's witnesses when you got some spare time, maybe try to let teach you something. search the right word, you find the right answers. nothing is invented, all the things written in the bible (real bible) are really happened. but you don't need me to tell it to you, i've given you an advice, if you want answers search them, in the right places, as you see there's a labyrinth out there. fill your heart with belief, and if searching and knowing god means to change some of your point of views, or some of your ways of live, do it, there's no one luckier in this world as the ones who got god's approval


ps. congrats for knowing dante!

 

[BestDrummer]

God allowed this to happen to test us to see if we stay strong. God designed us to overcome trials and strongholds.

anyways its all how you look on death. is death an end and a travisty, or a new beginning?

 

[Angela Harlem]

Then he is a cruel God. Reducing those souls, 150,000 odd of them to pawns, in a test.
Another reason why Christianity is a revolting concept.


And one more claim of knowing God's will.

 

[babyman]

we're no test dummies, we're people gifted with reason

 

[bammo2]

God allowed this to happen to test us to see if we stay strong. God designed us to overcome trials and strongholds.

anyways its all how you look on death. is death an end and a travisty, or a new beginning?

oh for gods sake.

do you have any idea at all about the concept of compassion and sensitivity???

 

[Dreadsox]

Welcome to thousands of years ago

 

[bammo2]

travisty

is that the band that sang 'why does it always rain on me?

 

[Dreadsox]

Another reason why Christianity is a revolting concept.

Another reason to hate generalizations......

A majority of the Christians in here have not agreed with this.....

But make your generalization....

 

[Angela Harlem]

Jesus would have liked that song bammers.
He'd have hummed it while fishing and the like.

 

[Angela Harlem]

Another reason to hate generalizations......

A majority of the Christians in here have not agreed with this.....

But make your generalization....

Dread I've spent too much of my reasoning years being offended by what is what is put forward as Christian concepts. This is one. Not specifically, but the tendancy to treat heartache and suffering on earth as a test of us and our faith. It's just one of the revolting things which make my stomach turn. It is in no way directed at Christians themselves, but if it comes from them specifically, then we all end up offended, don't we? I can never listen to and smile sweetly, someone saying this kind of offensive justification.

A generalisation on Christians it is not, and whether it is a generalisation on Christianity, then I'd be more than happy to one day write a list of what revolts me about this self proclaimed righteous path and someone can tell me how wrong I am. But until then, offended I too, remain.

 

[Dreadsox]

Well, sadly, I know of not a single Christian in my life who believes this......

And being a Christian.....I find your generalization misguided.

 

[babyman]

what do you mean with "test", angela?

 

[Angela Harlem]

God allowed this to happen to test us to see if we stay strong. God designed us to overcome trials and strongholds.

anyways its all how you look on death. is death an end and a travisty, or a new beginning?

This is what I was referring to babyman. I dont think test has anything to do with it.

 

[U2Vertigoing]

yeah, that might take confusion, and maybe that's exactly what the church was trying to do in that times. i say you just this, only the bible which recognises the name of god is the right bible, there you can have all your questions clear. constantin and many popes have cancelled lots of important parts of the bible through the history, for a question of power, but mainly to move people away from the truth. believe me, if i'd have to tell you something about church's tricks it would take too long, and maybe someone would get offended, and i don't want this at all. take a bible of jehova's witnesses when you got some spare time, maybe try to let teach you something. search the right word, you find the right answers. nothing is invented, all the things written in the bible (real bible) are really happened. but you don't need me to tell it to you, i've given you an advice, if you want answers search them, in the right places, as you see there's a labyrinth out there. fill your heart with belief, and if searching and knowing god means to change some of your point of views, or some of your ways of live, do it, there's no one luckier in this world as the ones who got god's approval


ps. congrats for knowing dante!

thanks of course I know dante ........he's Italian most famous poet....and he got in a lot of trouble with the roman church btw.....

I'll search for answers but in the bible yes their is standing real happened stories no doubt abou that only it's only giving one side of the truth because it's written by the 'winners' like always history is always written by winners......

@dreadsox......well you think it's crazy all the christians don't believe this because they only look to what is standing in the bible and don't want to hear other sides of what really could have happened......
and if you say a other side of the story most of the time they feel offended sadly enough....they only believe in their own view and it's very hard to change that even trying to let them listen to your story....
btw:you're a fan of Leonardo Da Vinci???

 

[mystery girl]

There's a lot of truth in mystery girl's post, but it has little or nothing to do with earth- and seaquakes.

Well, greed and consumerism have nothing to do with the Indonesian (or any other) quake. But it seems to me that we're in for more of the EFFECTS of the quakes - people losing their livelihoods, being killed etc - although this time, it will be due to floods, storms etc. and not earthquakes. The result will be the same, and it will be our greed and consumerism that caused this. Maybe this thread was not a good place to bring up the subject of global warming, but I just found it interesting that people were speculating about what role God had in this tragedy, when it seems we ourselves are about to cause tragedies on an equal (or even greater) scale...

 

[stagman]

Every religion believes it has the only way to God....no if's or buts..it's fact!

So if you believe in a God, be it Jesus..Allah, Buddha or whatever you believe that there is a way to heaven.

If you don't believe in a God, then the following will probably be meaningless to you...

You will also believe that there is good and evil...yes that means poeple that don't believe your religion do go to hell.... if you don't believe that then you should study your scriptures more

It's a terrible thought to think about with 150000 people dying in one big event....is it a deliberate act of God or is it the result forces of Good and Evil forces battling it out.

If you believe in God, then obviously there are battles between good and evil right.... Disasters happen all the time...this is one of the worst ever...we always ask why don't we...

So is this current disaster the result of the battles of good and evil or a God not blessing a certain group of people with safety??
I don't really know...but the following may give some indication.....

I mean really if you are a parent... and you treated your children the best way possible...and constantly reminded them that you love them would'nt you expect them to love you back and be true to you when they are old enough to make their own decisions...
So if one of them rebel.. and go off with the wrong people and screw their lives up... you still love them obviously...you would still want them to love you too... But if that son or daughter totally rejects you and curses their very own family, what do you do???
Are you going to welcome them into your home, if you had the chance...are they still going to be in your will? That's what faces God....whoever your God is if you believe in one. So that is my shabby attempt at explaining that no.. not everyone goes to heaven..... However, there are many that will not get the choice to pick what or who they will believe in.. their souls are still pure and not corrupted. These dear souls will go to heaven.

 

[stagman]

There are many poeple groups who have never or may never get to hear the word of the one true God(whichever God that is)
It is upto the believers of a God to spread the word to everyone they can.....if your faith does'nt do this..then I think you should question what is the ultimate reason for your faith.... Tell me, what God would'nt want as many as possible to be with him in heaven..... We have all been given a seemingly unwarranted gift....the freedom of choice...with that comes knowledge.....we can work out for ourselves weather we want to believe in the one true God or not. There are very strong forces of Evil out there...So a God has to fight to get as many poeple as he can for himself.... Those evil forces make false gods and false paths that lead to hell. The Devil fights for every soul he can...he seeks out whom he can devour...So it's not easy for whichever God you believe in now is it......

 

[Dreadsox]

btw:you're a fan of Leonardo Da Vinci???

Is there something wrong with that?

 

[babyman]

This is what I was referring to babyman. I dont think test has anything to do with it.

exactly, i agree

 

[U2Vertigoing]

Is there something wrong with that?

no not at all I love his work but if you're a fan then you maybe can tell me what his ideas were about Jesus and Maria or must I tell it to you??

Stagman you mean satan?? then you must read what I've wrote about that some posts ago.......

and test has absolutely nothing to do with this also God has nothing to do with this.....it's a natural disaster but there were less people dead when they had a warning system there.....

mystery girl.....most of the problems of this time has to do with greed it's a very bad thing......and not the politics is the biggest problem now but the greed from people....(not all people though)
would you deny others, what you demand for yourself?

 

[stagman]

Yes, I'm talking about Satan(The Devil)...He was an angel...he and all the angels had the choice to do as they wished...he was the only one to reject God...so he went his own way...which is what he wants us to do as well... He is the Great deciever.

I don't believe God would let his eternal message decay into meaningless blabber that you are maybe suggesting.... many people, religions and sects have decieved..but the eternal message is still in the bible that we have today.
Who is this Maria you talk about? you mean Mary?
She was just a normal woman... but very just and obediant.. that is why God chose her... and she remains no one special...unlike what the Roman Catholics would have us believe.

 

[stagman]

also u2vertigoing Mary the mother of Jesus was not a prostitute....the New Testament describes 3 Mary's... Mary Magdalene was the prostitute that wept at Jesus feet...

 

[Angela Harlem]

no not at all I love his work but if you're a fan then you maybe can tell me what his ideas were about Jesus and Maria or must I tell it to you??

I'm interested in your thoughts!

 

[Angela Harlem]

also u2vertigoing Mary the mother of Jesus was not a prostitute....the New Testament describes 3 Mary's... Mary Magdalene was the prostitute that wept at Jesus feet...

da Vinci and co. believe she was all the one and the same Mary. Not a prostitute. Married to Jesus. I believe it is thought the prostitute angle was introduced later to put her and women in a bad light. You disagree with that school of thought?

I'm mad keen to hear anyone else's views on all of this. Maybe we should start a seperate thread if anyone's interested so this one doesn't sidetrack.