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Old 11-07-2012, 02:19 PM   #811
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Originally Posted by BVS View Post
There's all kinds of blame and spin going on today. But I've been seeing a lot of, "well the only reason ______ voted for Obama was because he gives you free shit."

So all you Obama supporters, what did he give you?







Here's the reason Romney lost, plain and simple:

The GOP has become an insurgent outlier in American politics. It is ideologically extreme; scornful of compromise; unmoved by conventional understanding of facts, evidence and science; and dismissive of the legitimacy of its political opposition.

When one party moves this far from the mainstream, it makes it nearly impossible for the political system to deal constructively with the country’s challenges.

By Thomas E. Mann and Norman J. Ornstein(an employee of the conservative think tank American Enterprise Institute)
good quote

as an outsider in particular, i find the GOP incomprehensible and very scary indeed... it baffles me that they could get into such a powerful position...
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:20 PM   #812
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When is 332 less than 286 ????


Obama got 332 EC votes, or 62% to Romney's 38%. A big margin.

In 2004 W won with 286 EC votes. One state, Ohio was his margin.

In all national votes cast, Bush beat Kerry by more votes than Obama beat Romney.
Also more people voted for Bush in 2004 than people that voted for Obama yesterday..

The Electoral College really is terrible. Hopefully some GOP will see that now. I would just like to see it go away.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:28 PM   #813
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So Obama won the popular vote and the Electoral College. What do the margins of victory have to do with whether it is a good system?

I don't think anyone is viewing this year's election as a landslide or some huge mandate.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:30 PM   #814
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Also more people voted for Bush in 2004 than people that voted for Obama yesterday..
Third party turnout was bigger this year (and not all votes have been counted yet).

Also, third party voters in Florida were greater than the difference between Obama and Romney. Yay!
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:32 PM   #815
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Also, irrelevant comparing a 2004 population to a 2012 population. There's still millions of votes to come in. In all likelihood, both Romney and Obama will pass Bush's total from 2004.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:42 PM   #816
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So Obama won the popular vote and the Electoral College. What do the margins of victory have to do with whether it is a good system?

I don't think anyone is viewing this year's election as a landslide or some huge mandate.
332 to 206 is a huge margin

slide the popular vote down 3-4 million, good chance Obama still wins, but could lose popular by millions.

Please keep in mind this is not a partisan issue for me. Since 2000 when I studied the EC every which way, and did models, I saw how absolutely stupid and indefensible it is. Any GOP people I know would just shut down the conversation, because they believe the unfair system favors them. I tried to explain how the Dems could lose the popular vote by millions and still win the EC. The models were similar to what happened last night. Romney, GOP could easily pick up millions of votes in large (or small) safe states, especially CA, TX, NY, NJ, MA but not enough to change the outcome. Let's say in those states Romney got his supporters to the polls by 2% more? No change in EC votes awarded. But he wins the popular by a good margin.

The fact that these scenarios exist, and are plausible is just stupid. I would rather have a national popular vote razor thin, where the person that got the most votes is declared the winner, over one state being razor thin, and having that one state decide. Especially if it goes against the national popular vote winner, that may have won by millions. What is the rational in calling that a better system?

I am not arguing for an outcome I want. Except that the winner be the legitimate winner.
I do realize that one could be conceived illegitimately, even against the public will. Some people might call that conception an act of God. I do not recognize it as that.
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:44 PM   #817
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"Thanks a lot Christians, for not showing up. You disgust me."
I don't know who she's talking about. I voted
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Old 11-07-2012, 02:51 PM   #818
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deep

332 to 206 is a huge margin

slide the popular vote down 3-4 million, good chance Obama still wins, but could lose popular by millions.

Please keep in mind this is not a partisan issue for me. Since 2000 when I studied the EC every which way, and did models, I saw how absolutely stupid and indefensible it is. Any GOP people I know would just shut down the conversation, because they believe the unfair system favors them. I tried to explain how the Dems could lose the popular vote by millions and still win the EC. The models were similar to what happened last night. Romney, GOP could easily pick up millions of votes in large (or small) safe states, especially CA, TX, NY, NJ, MA but not enough to change the outcome. Let's say in those states Romney got his supporters to the polls by 2% more? No change in EC votes awarded. But he wins the popular by a good margin.

The fact that these scenarios exist, and are plausible is just stupid. I would rather have a national popular vote razor thin, where the person that got the most votes is declared the winner, over one state being razor thin, and having that one state decide. Especially if it goes against the national popular vote winner, that may have won by millions. What is the rational in calling that a better system?
This post wins.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:01 PM   #819
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Quote:
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The fact that these scenarios exist, and are plausible is just stupid. I would rather have a national popular vote razor thin, where the person that got the most votes is declared the winner, over one state being razor thin, and having that one state decide. Especially if it goes against the national popular vote winner, that may have won by millions. What is the rational in calling that a better system?
Totally agree with this. I just don't think that anyone who understands our electoral system saw last night's results and thought, "ZOMG landslide!"
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:10 PM   #820
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The Republicans don't have a choice but to find a way to court the Hispanic vote. It is a rapidly growing demographic that just voted for Obama in excess of 70%. The hard realism is that trend cannot persist if the Republican Party wants to have any viable future.
Did anyone else see the Republican (can't recall if he was a politician or just another talking head, or what network it was on) come right out and say, "we have a Latino problem"?

You may want to rethink that choice of words, buddy.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:14 PM   #821
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Did anyone else see the Republican (can't recall if he was a politician or just another talking head, or what network it was on) come right out and say, "we have a Latino problem"?

You may want to rethink that choice of words, buddy.

They can't vote Democratic if we deport them. That would solve the Latino problem.
And go a long way in lowering unemployment, and cut down on all the government programs.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:49 PM   #822
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So the NateSilverFacts hashtag on twitter is comedy gold.

My contribution: Nate Silver knows the air speed of an unladen swallow. #natesilverfacts

Quote:
Han Solo lets Nate Silver tell him the odds. #natesilverfacts
Quote:
Heisenberg asks Nate Silver when he's feeling uncertain. #natesilverfacts
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#natesilverfacts When they find the Higgs-Bosson particle it will contain a note from Nate with winning lottery numbers for that day
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#natesilverfacts Nate Silver already knows how many #natesilverfacts will be written this week.
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Old 11-07-2012, 03:57 PM   #823
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Originally Posted by corianderstem View Post
Did anyone else see the Republican (can't recall if he was a politician or just another talking head, or what network it was on) come right out and say, "we have a Latino problem"?

You may want to rethink that choice of words, buddy.
Yes, I saw that too.

In context it made sense, but if I were to shout that phrase out in the east side of Green Bay, I would expect to get my legs broken, best case scenario.
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Old 11-07-2012, 04:10 PM   #824
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Ted Nugent responds...

Quote:
Goodluk America u just voted for economic & spiritual suicide. Soulless fools.
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Old 11-07-2012, 04:14 PM   #825
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Ted Nugent is giving spiritual advice?
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