2008 U.S. Presidential Campaign Discussion Thread-Part 10. - Page 18 - U2 Feedback

Go Back   U2 Feedback > Lypton Village > Free Your Mind > Free Your Mind Archive
Click Here to Login
 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-12-2008, 07:01 PM   #256
ONE
love, blood, life
 
financeguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ireland
Posts: 10,122
Local Time: 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by phillyfan26 View Post
Lewis could not have hit the nail on the head more. McCain and Palin are allowing hate to spread just to not alienate that relatively large, ignorant portion of the Republican base.

That part of the base has no equal in the Democratic Party. And that's the point. There's a sector of Republicans that pride themselves on not being "elitist" (a buzz word for well spoken and intellectual), and to deny that is to ignore a large part of modern American politics.

No, to be fair, McCain condemned it. Soundings are coming from his camp that he is against this type of behaviour. Of course, it could be just a tactic but I don't believe that it is just that, myself.

There is, believe it or not, a middle ground between the Strongbow point of view that McCain is perfect in every way, and the alternative point of view, sometimes vented on FYM, that McCain is a conniving bollix that will do anything to get elected.
__________________

__________________
financeguy is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:04 PM   #257
Blue Crack Addict
 
anitram's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 16,290
Local Time: 10:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strongbow View Post
Its as uninformed and anti-intellectual a statement as any other statement in here.
Go tell it to David Brooks, of your conservative Republican persuasion.

I can't believe you are standing there with a straight face and telling us that intellectuals and "elites" have not been scorned by the Republicans. Did you watch the GOP convention this year? Did you not hear Romney's speech? Giuliani's speech? Please. Get a dose of reality check.
__________________

__________________
anitram is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:05 PM   #258
Forum Moderator
 
yolland's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 7,471
Local Time: 04:51 PM
Yes, there are racists of every political persuasion, including among independents. And they aren't the majority in either major party.

I don't, however, recall reading about shouts of "Kill him!" "Off with his head!" "Traitor!" and "Terrorist!" at Hillary Clinton rallies, and I doubt that's mere coincidence.
__________________
yolland [at] interference.com


μελετώ αποτυγχάνειν. -- Διογένης της Σινώπης
yolland is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:11 PM   #259
Resident Photo Buff
Forum Moderator
 
Diemen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Somewhere in middle America
Posts: 13,237
Local Time: 09:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by financeguy View Post
No, to be fair, McCain condemned it. Soundings are coming from his camp that he is against this type of behaviour. Of course, it could be just a tactic but I don't believe that it is just that, myself.
There was a moment in those clips, after the shout of "kill him!" came over, that McCain looked up and paused, and a look of concern passed over his face. Then he continued on.

To me that's troubling. Especially with the delay between those kinds of remarks and finally a plea for a respectful campaign. It's the kind of delay that says (to me) "ok, we're getting pummelled in the press and the polls over this, let's not continue down this path" rather than "this is obviously wrong and I need to speak up."
__________________
Diemen is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:15 PM   #260
ONE
love, blood, life
 
financeguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ireland
Posts: 10,122
Local Time: 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diemen View Post
There was a moment in those clips, after the shout of "kill him!" came over, that McCain looked up and paused, and a look of concern passed over his face. Then he continued on.

To me that's troubling. Especially with the delay between those kinds of remarks and finally a plea for a respectful campaign. It's the kind of delay that says (to me) "ok, we're getting pummelled in the press and the polls over this, let's not continue down this path" rather than "this is obviously wrong and I need to speak up."
I tend to take a different view, but possibly I have a more favourable impression of McCain than you. I never really classed him as a true-believin' neo-con. Of course, I could be wrong.
__________________
financeguy is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:18 PM   #261
Blue Crack Addict
 
anitram's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 16,290
Local Time: 10:51 AM
Actually I agree with financeguy that I think McCain isn't a racist and probably this isn't the way he wants to win. However, it is also extremely duplicitous of him to be standing up (to some degree) against these loons while Palin is going around inciting them. I'm sorry but you can't have it both ways.
__________________
anitram is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:29 PM   #262
Resident Photo Buff
Forum Moderator
 
Diemen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Somewhere in middle America
Posts: 13,237
Local Time: 09:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by financeguy View Post
I never really classed him as a true-believin' neo-con.
Neither did I. I don't think McCain is a racist. I do however think he was going down a very dangerous and poorly chosen path (to put it mildly) in an attempt to rally support. My hope is that yes, he has realized that now, but then as anitram has pointed out, he can't have it both ways. It comes across as disingenuous when only one member of the team is calling for a respectful campaign.
__________________
Diemen is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:45 PM   #263
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,684
Local Time: 09:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Diemen View Post
Neither did I. I don't think McCain is a racist. I do however think he was going down a very dangerous and poorly chosen path (to put it mildly) in an attempt to rally support. My hope is that yes, he has realized that now, but then as anitram has pointed out, he can't have it both ways. It comes across as disingenuous when only one member of the team is calling for a respectful campaign.
I agree. I feel he's back himself in a corner...
__________________
BVS is online now  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:45 PM   #264
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London/Sydney
Posts: 6,608
Local Time: 04:51 PM
It’s because Sarah Palin probably is "one of us" (them). She's more than happy to stoke those feelings, she probably isn't sure whether Obama is an evil secret Muslim or not herself. It's not the elitist thing that's getting them angry, it's that. Go to a site like Free Republic and just have a look around. The ignorance and fear is absolutely stunning, and it's from there that the anger is getting whipped up. It's certainly not about healthcare or tax.

I'd like to think that McCain genuinely doesn't like it and doesn't want to either go down or win that way. I think he sold his campaign out a long time ago, but if you notice, he has pushed back a little a few times. Whether thats just for appearence or not could be disputed, but I would like to think there is some decency there.

Like the wide open racism in the primaries, when I wanted Clinton to get up there and say something like - "If you are not voting for Obama simply because he's black" (remember people were openly saying that in, I think, West Virginia?) "then I don't want your vote either" - I'd love to see McCain do something similar now.
__________________
Earnie Shavers is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:56 PM   #265
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
U2DMfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: It's Inside A Black Hole
Posts: 6,637
Local Time: 09:51 AM
As a supporter of McCain in 2000, the only solace I take is a full on, soul searching mea culpa. next year about the tactics that he's been forced into.

You can tell by his reaction to the lady who called Obama an "arab" that he loathes this.

He's got so much pressure behind him to go this route... don't completely throw McCain under the bus just yet. Palin, I would suspect she's a true believer.
__________________
U2DMfan is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 07:58 PM   #266
ONE
love, blood, life
 
financeguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ireland
Posts: 10,122
Local Time: 04:51 PM
Democrats out-register Republicans in swing states - Telegraph

Quote:
In eight swing states that could decide the election, Democrats have out-registered Republicans by ratios ranging from 2 - 1 to 6 - 1.

With electoral rolls now closed in most states, Mr Obama has a clear advantage among first-time registrants, many of whom are under 30 or African Americans. The big question mark over new voters is how many of them will show up on Nov 4.

Historically their turn out rate has been significantly lower than regular voters. Even allowing for that, Democrats are quietly confident that a silent minority of new voters are lying in wait to deliver the White House - and cancel out the voters who may be unwilling to support a black candidate.

If new voters turn out at the same rate as in 2004 - and cast their ballots in line with their registration - then Mr Obama is set to win the swing states he needs to beat Senator John McCain.
__________________
financeguy is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 08:06 PM   #267
BVS
Blue Crack Supplier
 
BVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: between my head and heart
Posts: 40,684
Local Time: 09:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by U2DMfan View Post
As a supporter of McCain in 2000, the only solace I take is a full on, soul searching mea culpa. next year about the tactics that he's been forced into.

You can tell by his reaction to the lady who called Obama an "arab" that he loathes this.

He's got so much pressure behind him to go this route... don't completely throw McCain under the bus just yet. Palin, I would suspect she's a true believer.
Yeah... When McCain loses he'll end up looking like a complete tool. He's turned his back on almost every piece of integrity he had left... It's actually pretty sad.
__________________
BVS is online now  
Old 10-12-2008, 08:07 PM   #268
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London/Sydney
Posts: 6,608
Local Time: 04:51 PM
It alienates independents, doesn’t bring them in. There’s no need to keep whipping up the base, certainly not from McCain anyway, he’s got Palin out there and there are plenty who even if McCain puts them offside will now still show up and vote for her or against Obama. They’re on board now and that won’t change. He has nothing to lose and a bit to gain (independents, his reputation/legacy) from coming out and putting all of it down, something along the lines of: He’s a Christian. He’s an American. He’s a good guy, a great family man. He’s worked hard, he’s earned it. None of this is disputable. I absolutely, truthfully, do not believe anything otherwise and if you do, frankly, you are wrong. You should however definitely not vote for him if you believe (onto policy/issues differences)… Fat chance of that happening, I know, but it would certainly save his reputation and would only gain him votes, not lose them, as is clearly happening now while he lets ignorance, racism, fear and hate control the tone and message of his campaign.
__________________
Earnie Shavers is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 08:12 PM   #269
Rock n' Roll Doggie
VIP PASS
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: London/Sydney
Posts: 6,608
Local Time: 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by U2DMfan View Post
You can tell by his reaction to the lady who called Obama an "arab" that he loathes this. [/I].
Yes, the look on his face and the reaction to that were quite telling. A lot of people thought he should have more forcefully put her down, but you could see he was floored by it, in a “My god, I can’t believe this is really happening” kind of way. More sad than angry. Sometimes, like at that moment, I think he looks defeated by more than just Obama, but by his own campaign as well, and that’s why I like to think that there’s still some decency in there.
__________________
Earnie Shavers is offline  
Old 10-12-2008, 08:22 PM   #270
ONE
love, blood, life
 
namkcuR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Kettering, Ohio
Posts: 10,290
Local Time: 10:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by U2DMfan View Post
As a supporter of McCain in 2000, the only solace I take is a full on, soul searching mea culpa. next year about the tactics that he's been forced into.

You can tell by his reaction to the lady who called Obama an "arab" that he loathes this.

He's got so much pressure behind him to go this route... don't completely throw McCain under the bus just yet. Palin, I would suspect she's a true believer.
But doesn't the fact that he picked a "true believer" as his running mate say something about him? It says he either didn't mind that mentality in his running mate or he wasn't aware of it.
__________________

__________________
namkcuR is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:51 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Design, images and all things inclusive copyright © Interference.com