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Old 02-02-2007, 07:08 PM   #31
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Being a Euro socialist, I have this old-fashioned idea that the government should subsidize education.
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Old 02-02-2007, 07:37 PM   #32
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In 1970 a worker in one of the larger factories made more than the average college professor. DON'T get me started on the abominable way anybody in the education profession is treated in this country. We in the field, and who know those in the field, are sick and TIRED of people holding us "accountable."--accoutavilty should dtermine salary, etc. I speak more at the grade-school and high school levels. I must restain myself from going into a major rant on this.....

Interesting posts regarding grants and tuition levels at private colleges verses public universities. Especially interesting now, since the Roberts/Alito Supreme Court is all set in its next term to eliminate affirmative action--flipping the equation around to make women and minortities more accessable to private colleges rather than universities. African-American enrollement at Berkeley is already at a 30-yr low.

And yes, moving out makes all the difference....I learned that for sure when I did! I now yell at my sister (who lives with her father), wiat until you have to move out and pay your own bills. We'll see if you're still picking on me for wanting to go eat out at the Chinest buffet place where dinner costs $6.50 instead of TGI Fridays.....
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Old 02-02-2007, 07:44 PM   #33
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Originally posted by yolland


As a side note, while I'd be happy if I never make more than that aforementioned humanities average, I can't help wondering why people so often seem to get so much more incensed by college professors who make plush incomes than by other kinds of workers who do. A PhD is an advanced professional degree, akin to earning an MD or JD, and it's a fuck of a long haul in time, money and effort to earn one; most who start the process never complete it. Then once you've earned it, and especially if you're in the humanities, expect to compete against 100-200 other highly qualified candidates for that tenure-track position at Mediocre State U. Then once you've secured that, in addition to a full teaching load, you'll also have to keep up your researching and writing ("publish or perish") as well as service to the university (joining steering, curriculum and search committees; overseeing student groups; advising and tutoring; writing reports etc.). And these are job requirements--I'm not waxing idealistic about the sorts of things only a really ambitious and driven prof might voluntarily do.


I didn't realize so many profs were under-paid. When I think of my favorite college profs, the ones who were at (or at least trying to be at) the head of their fields in terms of doing research, getting published, and groups of great thinkers from all over, I do believe they deserve the same salaries as my dentist, my doctor, a good lawyer, etc. I honestly have no clue what my profs make, but it's probably low compared to the amount of time and money they've poured into their careers and the development of their students and colleagues.

I was clueless to the "publish or perish" thing until my friend got a job in our Development department. One of her jobs was to compile all the reports that the college requires faculty to submit, describing all of their research and publications each year. If they aren't winning grants for research or writing books and journals, say bye bye!

Our faculty just started discussing professors' salaries on the staff/faculty discussion list (which turns out a lot like FYM, btw), so I'm kinda spying on this issue from the bottom of the educational institution totem pole.
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Old 02-02-2007, 07:49 PM   #34
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I was being somewhat sarcastic as I'm not in favor of capping anyone's income--I don't pretend to have more knowledge then the marketplace. I just think it's interesting that so many are so sure that "Big Oil" and "Big Pharma" are gouging us and reaping obscene profits, when college tuition is often raising at an even faster rate.

Yolland, as you point out there are many reasons for this, but ultimately it comes down to demand rising faster than supply. Plus, most people correlate cost with quality so where's the incentive for universities to lower their tuition?

A solid college education is still a good investment, but it's very troubling to read about students graduating today with such large debt. It's no doubt having an effect on our culture (delayed marriage & childbearing, less graduate work, job selection, etc.)
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Old 02-02-2007, 08:00 PM   #35
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Plus, most people correlate cost with quality so where's the incentive for universities to lower their tuition?
I don't expect tuition to be lowered, but why does it keep going up so much? For example, my uncle is on the board of trustees for my school and when I was a sophomore they all agreed to raise tuition by $6000 for the next year. Each year it's the same thing, the board sees all these improvements that just HAVE to be made, but funny enough, the board is made up of wealthy old people who don't understand what it's like to be 16 years old and take out tens of thousands of dollars in loans because even if they weren't as well off when they went to college, they only paid a fraction of what we paid (and minimum wage was basically the same!!!). They never ask the students or the parents - the ones who actually have to pay. My dad was so angry at my uncle when they big raise happened. We tried not to take it personally, but he kept talking about how great it would be, so my dad took him aside to explain that I had been denied my loan for that year b/c my dad did not qualify and at that point, was totally screwed. Looking back, I don't see what improvements were made that would have cost an additional $6000 per student.
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Old 02-02-2007, 09:22 PM   #36
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My school was always going berzerk on all sorts of improvements. Meanwhile they phased out community educational programs. And there was alot of talk about the profs getting ripped off, which I believed, and it really pissed me off because I had profs who meant a great deal to me. They deserved to get paid as much as my doctors, with all due respect to my docs.
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Old 02-03-2007, 01:35 AM   #37
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Teta - you asked where I live w/the 25% property value increase: Wilmington (New Hanover Co.), NC. Here's a little synopsis of the market values in the last 5 years.

Mr. Blu & I built a 1435sf home outside the city limits which was completed February '02. We bought a lot in the last phase of our neighborhood's development & got a deal on the home because we were one of the first on our street to build. For $137,000 we got the house w/an attached 2-car garage, approx. .25 acre lot, privacy fence for the back yard, alarm system in the house, front & backyard sod & front/side yard landscaping, and built-in sprinkler system. Our dream home & a bargain price compared to similar construction at the time. Fast forward to this past summer - similar construction in an older section of the neighborhood sold for $210,000. Now I've never been inside that home, so I don't know if it had marble countertops, hardwood floors, custom bathrooms, etc. but still - that's a huge profit from the original owner's purchase!

Wilmington's very attractive because of our beaches, fairly mild winters, relatively low crime rate, etc. etc. So you have a lot of folks moving from other areas who are happy to pay the market value prices here becuase it's soooo much cheaper than where they moved from - problem is, while our cost of living & housing has shot through the roof, Wilmington employers haven't kept up in terms of salary. My theory on that is because, unlike Raliegh or Durham, 2hrs up the road, Wilmington doesn't have any nearby competition to draw potential employees. There's no city of any size within 2 hrs of us - and that's more of a commute than anybody I know wants to make.

Sorry to derail the thread with my rant... I shall now step down from my soapbox & proceed to burn it post haste.
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Old 02-03-2007, 08:16 PM   #38
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Thanks Blu. And that was not a rant--hey, after my posts, you're entitled...I should talk .

MAil me at Spindle40@hotmail.com. Like I said, I want to pray for you guys and get updates on your situation. I feel for you, girl!
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