Wondering why y'all hate HTDAAB

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65980

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OK, reading over the earlier thread of "Least Favorite U2 album", I'm staggered to see how many people picked the recent HTDAAB. I realize a lot of longtime fans are going to hate anything new, but WHAT THE F***???

Wondering if I'd lost my judgement and/or mind, I went back to those 2004 tracks and listened to them again. I'm in accord with the band themselves -- who were very pleased with the album -- and find the record AWESOME. (Upgrade that rating to STAGGERINGLY AWESOME if we factor in the age of the band and how long they've been around.)

I'm not so fond of "One Step Closer", but I think every other track on HTDAAB is really good, even outstanding. The melodies are first-rate, the production is fantastic (by far the best since Achtung Baby), Bono's voice sounds better than ever, Edge is more creative and playing with more jump than I've ever heard, the rhythm section is as solid as ever, etc., etc.

I'm aware that some of you are turned off by the iPod commercial (I actually never saw it), Bono's weird Spanish count-in to Vertigo, or one of any other trivial things. But to me such things are very minor and don't detract from my enjoyment of the album. I just think it's fantastic.

I don't really need a thousand posters responding, "I hate it 'cause it's shit!", but I'm seriously curious as to why so many people don't like it. I mean, what more do you people want??
 
The production is fantastic? Loud ≠ fantastic

I think Bono said it himself. There are some nice songs on there, but it's not greater than the sum of its parts.
 
I don't hate it, but it's not brilliant. Here's why:

Vertigo - A great rocker, some prefer Native Son, I don't. I wouldn't change a thing about Vertigo.
Miracle Drug - It's OK, but it sounds like they're trying too hard to sound 'big'. It doesn't come off the way it should.
SYCMIOYO - Good song, destroyed by over-production, in my opinion. I don't care for the studio version.
LAPOE - Very good song, probably could do with a bit of a tune lyrically, because it's a bit empty. I like it a lot though, even the studio version.
COBL - Brilliance. Should have opened the album. One of their best ever songs. But from here, the album starts to blow ass.
All Because of You - It's just awful. Majorly overproduced, the opening screech is enough to make me skip this song. Could have been so much better, but even if it was it wouldn't hold a candle to some of U2's other great rock work. 'Intellectual tortoise'? Are you kidding me?
A Man And A Woman - Yeah, it's OK I guess, and has some really great lyrics, but I still don't feel anything towards it. Maybe I would if it was surrounded by better songs? I don't know.
Crumbs From Your Table - Another really good song, destroyed by production. There's an alternative version on YouTube, apparently it was from some DVD, but it's far better. Far, far better. Would push it into 'great song' territory.
One Step Closer - One of the better songs on the album, it has soul and atmosphere and it's really good lyrically. I don't know why others can't appreciate it.
OOTS - See Miracle Drug. Never really takes off the way it should.
Yahweh - A decent closer, destroyed by ridiculous production. A studio version with acoustics, somewhat resembling the live version, would have been far better. Instead, it's just a mess.

When you've got good stuff like Smile and Xanax and Wine sitting on the sidelines, as someone else said here, it's scary how close they came to another brilliant album. Instead it's just OK, but I can see why people hate it.
 
65980 said:
OK, reading over the earlier thread of "Least Favorite U2 album", I'm staggered to see how many people picked the recent HTDAAB. I realize a lot of longtime fans are going to hate anything new, but WHAT THE F***???

Click to expand...

That's why people shouldn't listen to one particular album for too long. They start forgetting about the pro's and start seeing the cons. All of the sudden music no longer is a joy, but instead becomes a critical analysis.

Give them a few years and they'll love it again.
 
No hate! It was good. It was very good by todays shitty album standards, and one of my favourites of 2004. But it didn't stand the test of time (well of the last 4 years at least). Most if not all other U2 albums have a depth and soul that lasts. HTDAAB has a few good songs, maybe one or two great ones, but U2 have set a very high standard for themselves, judging by precedent and their own ambitions, and this just doesn't measure up.
 
I don't like this "today's music is crap" attitude. Yes, U2 is generally betterthan most bands, but to say that today's music sucks is just silly. There are a ton of great albums coming out every year. You just need to stop looking at the in your face radio mainstream stuff, because there's hardly anything worthwhile. And yeah, there are a ton of bands who are better than U2 in their current form.

Phew... anyways.

I guess I like it, but it's completely mediocre by U2 standards. I think I've come to realize what I really dislike about this album. I get the sense that they're trying so hard to get you to feel the music. It's contrived and seems completely deliberate. Look at a song like The Fly and then look at a song like Miracle Drug. When I listen to that song I get the "oh great... they're trying so hard to get me emotional again" feeling. There's no subtlety at all. The lyrics lack imagination just like the music. There's nothing that really stands out on most of the tracks.

I like City of Blinding Lights, Vertigo, OotS and especially One Step Closer because they seem to have their own feeling and atmosphere. But then songs like Miracle Drug, Crumbs and Sometimes feel like U2 are copying what they've been doing for years but with bad lyrics, boring arrangments and overproduction. At the same time they're trying sooo hard to make you feeling like jumping up in the air or crying or some such crap and it doesn't work for me. For some reason I liked ATYCLB way, way better.
 
What more do I want?

Better songs
Better production
Better song selection
More creative lyrics
More harmonies
Subtlety
Less brow beating choruses
Bono's voice to not be stressed out
More dynamic song formulas
More dynamic instrumentation
Anything but dumbed down
Trust the audience
Ignore the faddish pop crowd


that said, I would have settled for a better song selection
 
That is exactly the reason why I didn't go into that thread. I knew exactly what people would say. Sad to come here and find the same negativity going on. I love the album and the songs have grown so much more on me because of the way they were performed live. But I guess it's against the rules to say something positive about what U2 is doing today. In fact, many people on this board have already made up their mind that the new album, of which they haven't even heard a single song, will be bad as well.

:|

I want to enjoy the music I like without being told how "bad" it is from others.

So, no more threads that contain the phrase "least favorite" in their title. At least for me.

:wink:
 
65980 said:
OK, reading over the earlier thread of "Least Favorite U2 album", I'm staggered to see how many people picked the recent HTDAAB. I realize a lot of longtime fans are going to hate anything new, but WHAT THE F***???
Click to expand...

Because human beings unfortunately want to worship beauty – and tend to destroy it. The same goes with the last U2 album, which is a collection of good to excellent tunes, nice melodies, catchy (and sometimes really worth reading!) lyrics and strong vocal performances. In its sound it is a kind of retro, classic album made by a band, that finally decided to sound like themselves.
Even when you really should judge (end enjoy) every album as a single phenomenon of its time, this artistically doens't turn HTDAAB into the premier league of the masterpieces TUF, TJT, AB and POP, but has taken place alongside the very good albums like BOY or ZOOROPA.
A lot of people like to bitch around on the one side, praise on the other, fall from one ectreme to the other. Don't care about it, let a few years pass and you'll see, what all this chatter against or in favour of the album was worth. And most important: If you like it, that's really all, that matters ...
 
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Vertigo and ABOY are just dull now, for me. Totally meaningless lyrics in both.
I can honestly say that it's been well over a year since I last felt like listening to Crumbs/OSC or COBL, so I guess that shows my fondness for those particular songs. LAPOE is good but I hate seeing the live performences. So after seeing u23d a few times now that has slowly killed my enjoyment of the song.

Miracle Drug, Sometimes and AMAAW remain my faves from the album. OOTS I can really take it or leave it.
 
I don't hate HTDAAB at all, I just find it a little uninspiring by U2's standards, too many of the tracks are the kind of thing the band has done before and done better. I think songs like Sometimes, OOTS and Miracle Drug are straining towards epic but fall short, they don't fly quite as well as they intend. On stage I gained a much greater appreciation for songs like Vertigo, LAPOE, Yaweh and COBL, they seemed much more sure of themselves.

To me HTDAAB feels less focused and, to a degree, more forced. Unlike ATYCLB, I'm not sure that the bands ideas and intentions for this album were quite as well defined, the direction just wasn't as clear. The wish to do something that was a complete contrast to Pop in 99 wasn't as strong in 2003. IMO parts of the album seem a bit half-baked and when I heard that multiple producers had a hand in proceedings I did begin to think that the finished product might suffer from too many cooks. Late on in the process there seemed to be some doubts about how strong some of the material was and so more songs were developed to bolster the thing. Maybe this is why HTDAAB doesn't quite mesh into a satisfactory whole for me.

I think U2 were treading water slightly here, which is always dangerous for a band so intent on remaining relevant. What was originally potent and resonant becomes duller and less vibrant when its repeated too many times, making a fresh departure down unfamiliar paths is the way forward.
 
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The only good song on HTDAAB is Vertigo. The other songs are boring and put me to sleep. When Bono and The Edge stated that they thought HTDAAB was there best album, I think they both must have been under the influence of an illegal substance.

I say bring on the new album with hopefullyy a fresh new sound.
 
Eazy-V said:

When you've got good stuff like Smile and Xanax and Wine sitting on the sidelines, as someone else said here, it's scary how close they came to another brilliant album. Instead it's just OK, but I can see why people hate it.
Click to expand...

i've never thought of it like that, but both Smile and Xanax (especially Smile, imo) are really great songs -- maybe not with the same commercial appeal as A Man and a Woman or Original, but cool in an 'uncool' sense. Imagine how interesting the album would be with Smile on the tracklist.
 
U2DMfan said:
What more do I want?

Better songs
Better production
Better song selection
More creative lyrics
More harmonies
Subtlety
Less brow beating choruses
Bono's voice to not be stressed out
More dynamic song formulas
More dynamic instrumentation
Anything but dumbed down
Trust the audience
Ignore the faddish pop crowd


that said, I would have settled for a better song selection
Click to expand...

Yep, that pretty much covers it.
 
shart1780 said:
I don't like this "today's music is crap" attitude. Yes, U2 is generally betterthan most bands, but to say that today's music sucks is just silly. There are a ton of great albums coming out every year. You just need to stop looking at the in your face radio mainstream stuff, because there's hardly anything worthwhile. And yeah, there are a ton of bands who are better than U2 in their current form.
Click to expand...

Ha. I presume you were responding to my comment about "todays shitty music standards". I actually agree that there are some great albums coming out every year, but often it seems to me that they are overlooked in the face of the hoards of rubbish that is loaded up on the "top albums" list on the iTunes homepage, and the best sellers charts. Thats what I mean by todays music. The one hit wonders, the offensive gimicky hip hop rubbish, the techno-teeny bopper shit that my generation eats up. I stopped listening to the radio last year, because I just got so sick of it. So I guess what I mean by "today's music" is the mainstream shit. There is good stuff outside the box definately! I agree!

But anyway back on topic, I'm hoping that U2 can do better than HTDAAB next time round, prove that they're not just great, but that they're still capable of being extraordinary in the studio, not just live. HTDAAB stopped at great. Most U2 albums go way beyond that.
 
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great reason Sad Punk :eyebrow: But why do you think it sucks?

I don't think it sucks but I don't find it very good. The prodution ruined the album.

Still love Vertigo, SYCMIOYO, Yaweh, OOTS.
 
I do not know why people even dislike this album. I think that ATYCLB as a whole was not as good, it did not seem to have any broad themes or specific connections back to U2's previous eras.(It sounded a little like UF-JT, but only structurally, not thematically or personally for the band) It had smash hits like Beautiful Day and one of their best songs ever, Walk On, but the rest of it is simply a nice album and nothing more. HTDAAB, on the other hand, is much livelier, and has songs that represent something unique about U2 or that look back on their earlier days and themes:
The rockers and a look back:
COBL,Vertigo, Love and Peace:Nice solid rockers like streets, i will follow and bullet.
The Political:
Love and Peace, Crumbs:Goes back to U2's political roots, both hit hard, lapoe w/the sound and Crumbs w/ the lyrics-kind of evocative of silver and gold.
The Themes:
Vertigo,COBL,LAPOE again:Kick backs to their early early days for different reasons. COBL shows some of the energy of Boy, and at the same time provides a contrast with how the band felt in 1980 vs 2004. In 1980, they were young and naive and thought they knew it all, and as they have gone through their career and got older, they realize they do not have all of their answers, but nonetheless, the same fire and earnestness that they approached the world with in 1980 is still there, just in a different form."Time wont leave me as I am, but time wont take the boy out of this man." See Bono Brooklyn Bridge speech too. VERTIGO just a straight up rocker that puts their energy and intensity front and center like it was in the early days(Twilight, Out of Control, another time another place,electric co, SBS, like a song) I really like Vertigo,the guitar riffs are great, it is also Adam's best song in a while. I think the ITUNES criticism is bullshit. It is U2's job to make money by selling music, always has been. Anything that does this is not selling out in any way, shape or form! LAPOE is a hard hitting political anthem like SBS.

The Personal and Spiritual: Achtung Baby and Joshua Tree and how that relates to HTDAAB:
A man and a woman, SYCMIOYO, Miracle Drug, OOTS: are all inspired by personal relationships of band members and how they evolve and have their ups and downs, thematically similar to Achtung baby.(though vastly different sound Sometimes and Miracle sound more joshua tree like, but they address AB type themes)
Yahweh:Sounds like Joshua Tree days and continues U2's spiritual journey. Also continues their tradition of closing albums with a searching prayer of sorts-MLK, Mothers of the Disappeared, Love is Blindness, wake up dead man, etc. And it especially connects to 40. I loved how these songs were often played back to back to close shows. There is a lot of similarity between these two songs.

I did not mention ABOY or one step closer: Not because they are bad songs, just that they are not really stand outs. I have minor issues with ABOY, its a little too cliche rocker and I know U2 could do a lot better. Still a fun song to blast though on occassion. One Step closer-U2 has done it and done it better before, should have been replaced w/Xanax and Wine.

I know this is on the long side, but I really wanted to put some intelligent thought in writing on this album instead of just a few passing words. This is a highly debated question in these parts, and it deserves more no matter how you feel about the album. Me, I come down firmly on the side of an excellent lyrical and instrumental album that takes the U2 sound and themes as both have evolved over their spectacular career and makes the whole thing incredibly current and relevant. U2 sounding like U2 is not a horrible thing, it is a beautiful thing.(I include all eras as sounding like U2, even AB, Zooropa and Pop, as it is all distinctly them) Maybe some more alternative sounding stuff like the 1990s would have been good, but LAPOE has that element kind of and I'm sure the next album is headed that way. U2 just wanted to adpat a different part of their career to 2004 and they did a brilliant job of it! It is not perfect, Bono, Larry, Edge, Adam admit it, I certainly admit it. What it does do is take in the themes, ideas and sounds of a brilliant career and put them together to make a smash hit album that boldly declares U2 is not slowing down. That is more than can be said for ATYCLB, which did the latter but not the former.
 
For the first time in quite a while I listened to HTDAAB in it's entirety and it really isn't as bad as some people reckon. It's actually quite brilliant.

It's one of those albums that you have to actually be listening to to appreciate it. You might not list it as one of yer 20 greatest albums of all time, but when you listen to the fucker, it's mindblowing.

And there are other albums that I rate particularly highly and are amongst my all-time favourites, but I sometimes listen to it and think, "Why do I love this album so much?". I need to be in a particular mood to enjoy and appreciate such albums (Ok Computer, Achtung Baby).

The thing which I suppose frustrates me about HTDAAB is that it almost sounds like "music without vision". 11 enjoyable songs slapped together to form an album. Every other U2 album (besides maybe R&H), I'd argue, all seem to achieve what U2 set out to do and the songs relate to each other in some way. Even on the much maligned Pop, the band's vision for the album seems accomplished, and I get the feeling that U2's low regard for Pop is more down to how ridiculous the whole concept of the album, the tour, the sound and the philosophy would have seemed to many people. They might have felt they were acting like a bunch of fools. All speculation though....

HTDAAB is a cracker though, and puts most current pop music to shame.
 
While I definitely do not hate this album, I do think it's one of my least favorites. Here are the reasons why...

1. They come off as trying too hard to make this huge album that will sweep everyone off their feet and it ends up sounding unnatural. Example: The over-the-top intro lines to Miracle Drug. You know, The Edge once said about So Cruel... "I like the songs that just arrive". There are definitely no songs here that simply arrive without a big bang. Well, maybe One Step Closer.

2. The production is awful in parts. Why the hell does the intro to All Because Of You have to be so damn deafeningly loud? Loud does not equal rocking. It doesn't look like they've realized that. While I like the song Crumbs From Your Table, the production is too busy. Like somebody before said, the alternate HQ version is perfect! In the same way, Yahweh alternate sounds so much better than the album version, big reason being the production.

3. Mediocre lyrics. We need love and peace? Intellectual tortoise? The soul needs beauty for a soul mate... when the soul wants, the soul waits?? Honestly, they've done so much better in the past!

4. What's with the cheesy intros, incorrect spanish and odd bits of lyrics like "turn it up loud, captain" and "checkmated, shots fall"? I don't know. This stuff is just weird coming from a band such as U2. Even their fun songs in the past like EBTTRT never had any dumb words thrown in. Other than that I actually really enjoy Vertigo musically. The guitar bridge has been my cell phone ringtone for a while! :shifty:

5. This is more a complaint about the Vertigo tour but I do not like the current Bono's rock star posturing. It's way worse than it used to be. And sometimes I can't help but be embarrassed for the guy for doing incredibly cheesy things on stage. Example: The moment in U2:3D where he is flapping his arms and trying to fly off the stage or something. Or even worse is the infamous Chicago dvd An Cat Dubh thing which I won't get into cos somebody already mentioned it. The guy did a lot of crazy shit during Zoo TV or even before like Live Aid but the stuff looked cool coming from a rock star. It never made me go "Ohh Bono, what the hell are you doing?? :yikes: :reject: "

Okay, I think that's enough reasons. Despite all that, when I do listen to the album once in a while... like intedomine said, I do like it. Maybe I've learned to ignore the faults somewhat.
 
I loved it when it came out, and I still do. I will say that - and I know it's been brought up in this thread - that like Bono has said, the whole is somehow less than the sum of it's parts. It's also got one of the strongest second halves of any U2 records, as they usually fall apart towards the end.

It has variety. It has energy. It's U2 with the lid off. If they flirted with "sounding like U2" on ATYCLB, than on HTDAAB they took "sounding like U2" out to dinner, drinks, a night on the town and then took it home and made sweet sweaty monkey love to it on the sofa till the sun came up.

Song for song, it's as good as anything they've ever done. But somehow, as an album comes up just a little short. And I don't know why that is. But even with that I've never understood the hate. You just gotta let it be what it is. If you try not to like it, you probably won't like it.
 
Eazy-V said:
I don't hate it, but it's not brilliant. Here's why:

Vertigo - A great rocker, some prefer Native Son, I don't. I wouldn't change a thing about Vertigo.
Miracle Drug - It's OK, but it sounds like they're trying too hard to sound 'big'. It doesn't come off the way it should.
SYCMIOYO - Good song, destroyed by over-production, in my opinion. I don't care for the studio version.
LAPOE - Very good song, probably could do with a bit of a tune lyrically, because it's a bit empty. I like it a lot though, even the studio version.
COBL - Brilliance. Should have opened the album. One of their best ever songs. But from here, the album starts to blow ass.
All Because of You - It's just awful. Majorly overproduced, the opening screech is enough to make me skip this song. Could have been so much better, but even if it was it wouldn't hold a candle to some of U2's other great rock work. 'Intellectual tortoise'? Are you kidding me?
A Man And A Woman - Yeah, it's OK I guess, and has some really great lyrics, but I still don't feel anything towards it. Maybe I would if it was surrounded by better songs? I don't know.
Crumbs From Your Table - Another really good song, destroyed by production. There's an alternative version on YouTube, apparently it was from some DVD, but it's far better. Far, far better. Would push it into 'great song' territory.
One Step Closer - One of the better songs on the album, it has soul and atmosphere and it's really good lyrically. I don't know why others can't appreciate it.
OOTS - See Miracle Drug. Never really takes off the way it should.
Yahweh - A decent closer, destroyed by ridiculous production. A studio version with acoustics, somewhat resembling the live version, would have been far better. Instead, it's just a mess.

When you've got good stuff like Smile and Xanax and Wine sitting on the sidelines, as someone else said here, it's scary how close they came to another brilliant album. Instead it's just OK, but I can see why people hate it.
Click to expand...

QFT (mostly agree)

Vertigo: Shit lyrics, if you use Native Son, you've got a winner.
Miracle Drug: Just meh. Should be powerful, and just isn't. Needed an outro solo, better verses. Just kind of boring.
Sometimes: The first half of the song is so boring that it doesn't recover, even with a decent second half.
LAPOE: Good song.
COBL: Good song, poorly produced.
ABOY: Decent track, shit lyrics.
AMAAW: Not sure why, I just don't particularly take to it.
CFYT: Best track on the album. Production is awful, but the song itself is great. COBL live kicks the shit out of it, but in the studio I give this the upper hand.
OSC: Just because U2 attempts atmosphere doesn't mean they succeed.
OOTS: I actually like it, but the chorus is incredibly too long to be a chorus. Also, stupid things like the "Doo-deh's" take away from it.
Yahweh: Good acoustic track, horrible, horrible version on the album.

So, a mix of bad production and songs that stumbled leads to an album that's mixed at best.
 
Zootlesque said:
While I definitely do not hate this album, I do think it's one of my least favorites. Here are the reasons why...

1. They come off as trying too hard to make this huge album that will sweep everyone off their feet and it ends up sounding unnatural. Example: The over-the-top intro lines to Miracle Drug. You know, The Edge once said about So Cruel... "I like the songs that just arrive". There are definitely no songs here that simply arrive without a big bang. Well, maybe One Step Closer.

2. The production is awful in parts. Why the hell does the intro to All Because Of You have to be so damn deafeningly loud? Loud does not equal rocking. It doesn't look like they've realized that. While I like the song Crumbs From Your Table, the production is too busy. Like somebody before said, the alternate HQ version is perfect! In the same way, Yahweh alternate sounds so much better than the album version, big reason being the production.

3. Mediocre lyrics. We need love and peace? Intellectual tortoise? The soul needs beauty for a soul mate... when the soul wants, the soul waits?? Honestly, they've done so much better in the past!

4. What's with the cheesy intros, incorrect spanish and odd bits of lyrics like "turn it up loud, captain" and "checkmated, shots fall"? I don't know. This stuff is just weird coming from a band such as U2. Even their fun songs in the past like EBTTRT never had any dumb words thrown in. Other than that I actually really enjoy Vertigo musically. The guitar bridge has been my cell phone ringtone for a while! :shifty:

5. This is more a complaint about the Vertigo tour but I do not like the current Bono's rock star posturing. It's way worse than it used to be. And sometimes I can't help but be embarrassed for the guy for doing incredibly cheesy things on stage. Example: The moment in U2:3D where he is flapping his arms and trying to fly off the stage or something. Or even worse is the infamous Chicago dvd An Cat Dubh thing which I won't get into cos somebody already mentioned it. The guy did a lot of crazy shit during Zoo TV or even before like Live Aid but the stuff looked cool coming from a rock star. It never made me go "Ohh Bono, what the hell are you doing?? :yikes: :reject: "

Okay, I think that's enough reasons. Despite all that, when I do listen to the album once in a while... like intedomine said, I do like it. Maybe I've learned to ignore the faults somewhat.
Click to expand...


In the past I may have crucified this. :lol:

But TIIIIIIIIME won't leave me as I am.

Achtung rox
 
The only songs I listen to from the HTDAAB era are Fast Cars, Native Son, Xanax and Wine, Smile and Mercy. I really feel the material that made it onto the album was mostly shallow and horribly produced, and has definitely gotten worse over time.


I'd say a big problem was a lack of cohesion and vison, songs slapped together in other words.
 
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