U2: read this! (it may hurt but it's the truth!)

[MrBrau1]

Check out this wonderful site. It's answer most anyone's lyric questions.

http://hem.bredband.net/steverud/U2MoL/

 

[Zoots]

The beginning of the song features Bono singing "uno, dos, tres, quatorce", which are familiar to the book of James 1,2,3 and 14, which speaks about temptation.

I wonder if that's really true!

 

[LMP]

I dunno which theory I like better

the uno, dos, tres, catorce being about the Bible

or that Bono was just pissdrunk when he wrote it

 

[thelaj]

I thought it was the album number Steve Lilyshite had produced?

 

[U2DMfan]

The only real problem I have with the last 2 albums is the lyrics! I think the lyrics seriously went down the freaking drain with ATYCLB! I mean, look at the last few verses (fragrant/basement) of Kite! Or the stupid rhymes of Elevation! Or everything except the 'scatter of light' verse in IALW! Or parts of New York! The terrible terrible rhymes of Grace! Moving on to HTDAAB... The weak chorus of COBL! The cringeworthy 'all of this could be yours' line in Vertigo! The weak 'where is the love' of LAPOE!

Okay, I won't go on because I don't wanna come off as an ATYCLB/HTDAAB hater, because I'm not. I do like other things about these albums and they still sound better than 90% of what's out there!

But compared to EVERYTHING from Boy to Pop.... yes, everything!, the afore-mentioned lyrics sound much too inferior and uninspired to me.

It's his delivery, IMO. The voice and the style.

You can pick on "oh you look so beautiful tonight" but then again there are other older songs that aren't exactly Shakeperean that don't come as trite and simplistic because of how he sang them. It is music afterall, his voice is maybe the most important instrument in U2.

When Bono had a great voice and really sang with power and wasn't trying to be so soulful and gritty, you could look past those lines because ultimately the delivery is what seperates written word from song. You could marvel at the tone of his voice as an instrument, when it's stripped to the point of being almost raw, you get all the bad things that go with it, and a less than stellar line is going to ring like fingernails on a chalkboard.

Sometimes it's because his approach is off for instance, When I Look At The World and All Because of You, which are frankly just lazy delivery. Sometimes it's because he just doesn't have the pipes like he used to. Sometimes it's because he's spent so long
in the studio his voice is wore down.

In A Little While is absolutely dreadful, from the lyrics to the voice. But again, he sang the song about a hangover with a hangover or something, so it goes to delivery. It's what he's trying to accomplish with his voice. He wanted to do that song.

He can hit the high sustained notes because he hasn't lost the ability to save up for it, but listen to verses in the live versions of Sarajevo. It's snap crackle and pop. There is a huge crack on Stateless, which was probably left intentionally in. So again, it's delivery, the voice and the style.

A great vocal take can save a song from sketchy lyrics, IMO.
Some people would rather have the better lyrics and a worse vocal take, if that were the option. Ideally, we'd all like to have both.

The tempos aren't helping either, some of the songs almost encourage a less than strong vocal (for rock songs). Elevation could still be digging up moles and holes lyrically, but imagine if it were as fast as Vertigo, I'd bet there would be a lot of people who find it more rocking and better (FWIW, Vertigo is about 140 bpm and Elevation is about 115 bpm) Beautiful Day is right around there with Vertigo, but WILATW is with Elevation. If that makes sense to you guys. ABOY is pretty fast as well, and Bono sounds like he's sitting on a sofa, so I don't know.....

 

[david]

i thought fast cars had some of the best lyrics he's written since the days of zooropa.

 

[Earnie Shavers]

Yeah, I really like those lyrics. It might be a little thing to some, but I also far prefer them knocked down with a bit of Xanax & Wine. The whole thing becomes far more confessional or something, has more of an edge as well. But yes, of this 'generation' of songs, Fast Cars/Xanax has the best lyrics.

 

[thelaj]

Xanax and Wine is cool, lyrically and musically. I really like the way the song wavers out on the lyric "xanax and wiiiiiiiiine"

 

[Zoots]

U2DMFan, you may be on to something there with the thing about delivery! Like the chorus of ABOY for instance has the second line 'aaaalll because of you' sung differently and I wish he would have sung it like he did on the alternate version, which I still think is mostly better, except for the 'I'm alive' part which really kicks ass in the album version!

And IALW like you said... I can't stand those vocals and esp. that verse... 'in a pram they pushed her by.... it's been... it's been a little while...'!

 

[BVS]

IALW the approach alone makes that song brilliant.

I have a friend who's not even that big of a fan and thinks that their best song.

 

[onyourkneesboy]

Could you all stick to the original topic, please?

Otherwise somebody start a thread about: "I like this lyric better than that lyric.."

Thx.

 

[Achtung_Bebe]

Actually, the current discussion is very much on topic, i.e. a response to your claim that Bono has not been there "100% when it comes to the writing process." I don't see how a discussion of past and current lyrics is off topic.

 

[U2mixer]

Although U2 is my favourite band ever and has been for many years, it's getting harder and harder for me to keep loyal to them all the way.
To me, their nonchalance and their eagerness to wanting to appeal to the masses have become a problem that I can not deny.

The band have ALWAYS wanted to appeal to the masses!
From the start (before most of the fans on this forum were even born), Bono has wanted to 'appeal' and communicate with 'his' audience so it's nothing new that he still feels this way - maybe you want to keep U2 to yourself?
The majority of Beatles fans HATE their mass appeal too.
I think that's an 'elitist' attitude to adopt.

Introducing HTDAAB and it's first single Vertigo, U2 used shitloads of swagger and blah-blah to be heard by the masses. It is known that they, again like with ATYCLB, wanted to be the biggest of the biggest !! Again...!
Well, of course they are! But for years now the music starts to suffer with this attitude.
First of: I know that when you have a new album you have to use some media/advertising to let people know it's out there. But the way U2 uses the media nowadays is one step away from: "Along with your Happy-Meal comes the new U2-single: Original Of The Species !!"

I understand where you are coming from with this - I'm not happy with their 'no fees advertisements' for Apple - but the band have ALWAYS sought the spotlight and the opportunity for band promotion. Nothing wrong with that. THAT is what the music industry is all about. It doesn't mean that you are selling out, but just promoting your band, your music and your beliefs.
Remember the rooftop shoot for Streets?
Know what I mean?

I don't think - scrap that! - I KNOW that U2 will never offer any joint promotions with MacDonalds (I do realise that you were using humour), but they have 'slept with the devil' when touring South America on the PopMart tours when they 'allowed' advertising during their concert broadcasts, but they did this so they COULD play to the loyal fans of those countries and not for monetary gain.

I'm getting bored with Bono's blah-blah about U2 still wanting to be the best, the biggest, and so on...Bono: shut up!!, and just MAKE great music! Don't talk about it! Get your ass FULL TIME in the studio and CREATE with the boys extraordinary music like you've done in the years before! Create landscapes, atmospheres…

There's nothing wrong with Bono still wanting to 'be the biggest' and shouting bravado, but I agree that when he does so then he should also 'get his ass in the studio and create great music' to support his rhetoric.

I admire you for your spirit and effort for the good cause, but the music suffers from it! And I'm already aware that you've got life all figured out and have al lot of expensive sunglasses and friends. It’s seems all to be about posing now: looking cool, know how to look when you talk, all those little “Robbie Williams-like manners” Come on man, focus on the music! Get mysterious again, epic, poetic, ambient, take your fans on a ride like in the old days with new music!

Bono has ALWAYS enjoyed looking the part (remember the awful 'mullet' and the JT stetsons), but so what! What rock star doesn't enjoy dressing up!
As far as your comments go on his expensive sunglasses - hasn't he deserved them?
Wouldn't you love to wear great clothes and drive a nice car if you've worked BLOODY hard for it? Of course you would!

And PLEASE don't mention Robbie Williams in the same breath as U2 or Bono - that's just plain insulting

I think people nowadays hunger for some imagination, getting sucked into landscapes, atmospheres in music, not only sincerity. Don't we all want to hear a band that doesn't give a shit if the new CD sells, but want to make a record that is original, experimental and is not written for the masses. Like The Unforgettable Fire, Achtung Baby and Zooropa were. Bono said about HTDAAB: "I want every song to sound like it could be released as a single.." Man, with this attitude in the songwriting-proces they tend to shift towards sounding like Bon Jovi or The Rolling Stones.

I think nowadays you imagine you are speaking for all of the fans - you're not.
But I agree with you! I would LOVE to see more creativity, but not every fan wants this.
All bands music is open to subjectivity and critique where noone is right and everyone has their own opinions - you know what it's like, fans on this forum can equally love and hate the same track, album or tour.
You can't please all of the fans all of the time, but you can please all of the fans some of the time and some of the fans all of the time.

Please don't mention Bon Jovi in the same breath as U2

U2 should focus on making surprising, artistically interesting songs again that come from another place like: Tomorrow, The Unforgettable Fire, Bad, In God's Country, Love Comes Tumbling, Walk To The Water (talking about a gem!), The Fly, Acrobat, Until The End Of The World, Lemon, Heartland, Love Is Blindness, Please, When I Look At The World, Mercy…
These song are creative, emotional in a subtle way, multi-layered, spiritual, and come from places out of this world.

Again, according to YOUR musical tastes (which I agree with!), but you have to see the bigger picture. It's about the band appealing to every fan and not just a certain type of fan otherwise we would still be hearing the Edge's 2 chord chimes and Bono 'shouting' the lyrics.
The band feel they are still pushing their talents, but I feel a more stripped down approach would help their music and not fantastic studios, producers and amazing guitar pedals.

While, except for Yahweh and A Man And A Woman!, the songs on HTDAAB sound like everyday life. Down to earth, to straight-on, flat, plain lyrics, no surprises, so therefore less interesting and not long lasting as the earlier albums full of gems, and not full of "hit-singles"!

But the band have already reached their creative peak/s with JT and AB so we have to realise that we can only expect the odd piece of greatness now and again.
A whole new album on the scale of JT or AB will never happen again. We need to accept this and appreciate what we have and what we have to look forward to.

BTW there's nothing wrong with hit singles!

More and more you hear people getting bored with U2 because they don't tickle the listeners imagination anymore en don't delve into unknown territory. I'm afraid right now they've fallen into the trap of being the biggest, therefore pleasing the masses who might as well go to a Rolling Stones-concert. Come on man, I want my favourite band to sound the way that doesn't attract a Rolling Stones audience. U2 should not sell out and become they're on tribute-band !

You shouldn't knock a band to support a band - it's a bad way of arguing and you've done it too many times in this post.
The Stones were ground-breaking, dangerous and exciting at their peak, but now they're just labelled dinosaurs!
They are still a great live band and if you ever got to see them then you might change your opinion - sounds like another band we all know?

You keep on mentioning U2 pleasing the masses so what would be better? Pleasing the few?

Yeh, at times U2 sound like their own pastiche, but every artist suffers this fate (see Elvis, Frank Sinatra and at the other end of the musical scale, Nirvana).

Quote's from another forum:
.."Their latest album (which is a very good album btw) suffered from "lazy songwriting." C'mon, are you really going to say Vertigo is... fresh. The riff is cool... I'll say that, but it's almost like Elevation. The way the bridge takes the song down, and then busts right back into the chorus... it's Elevation verbatim, but just a different melody. How many times does Bono rhyme 'steal' and 'kneel' on 'Bomb, and let's not forget "I'll give you EVERYTHING that you want/except the THING that you want". Look, I don't care what sales have to say. 'Bomb isn't progressive. It's dried up.
Bono: Bring back the metaphors and deep lyrics. Edge: Bring back the sonic sounds and soaring guitar solos. It's time to venture into deeper, daring and perhaps darker territory on the next album."

Just fans entitled to their opinion - it doesn't mean that they are right because they agree with you.
Reading the above just makes me think they want a 'gothic', bleak U2 - never gonna happen. been there done that made the record sold millions.

I'm afraid I a have to agree on these quotes.
Further on: Miracle Drug has the sound, chords and structure of Beautiful Day, City Of Blinding Lights the most predictable, cheesy song ever by U2, All Because Of You is like Rolling Stones and still they didn’t nail this song, just boring rock-and-roll for elderly men, One Step Closer has nice lyrics but: yawn…boring, Crumbs is a straight copy from Walk On (talking about lazy songwriting!)

What is one man's 'cheese' is another man's caviar.
And there's nothing wrong with using the same chord structures.
Quote bono paraphrasing Dylan "3 chords and the truth".

But you shoot yourself in the foot here by complaining that the band don't write songs like "Tomorrow, The Unforgettable Fire, Bad, In God's Country, Love Comes Tumbling, Walk To The Water (talking about a gem!), The Fly, Acrobat, Until The End Of The World, Lemon, Heartland, Love Is Blindness, Please, When I Look At The World, Mercy…" anymore, but indicating that you wish they would therefore the band using similar chords, structures and techniques that appealed to you from these songs.
See what I mean?

Anyway, 8 out of 11 songs have major problems!
The songs nowadays have no unpredictable chord-sequences, special atmosphere, or poetic lyrics. It’s good songs but down to the ground.
The point is: many years ago U2 was a young band who wanted to make music no one ever heard before: spontaneous, passionate, spiritual and while trying they achieved this but they weren’t aware of it at the time. They were half in the shadow, half in the light. One could hear that creating extraordinary music was their obsession. They were full-time passionately attached to this obsession. Nowadays they can’t/want seem to reach that point anymore. The last 2 albums are good, with good songs on them. But not more than that. 85% is indeed dry and one-dimensional.

The exuberance of youth! That's what the early years is about.
You don't see many old people skateboarding - get my point?
They are better musicians, more experienced songwriters, but what they lack is 'danger'.
The band are too comfortable. They need to be 'scared' into life.
I like HTDAAB, but there are weak songs on that album that DO sound lazy, but you can say that about The White Album!!!
Make the band play for their suppers THAT might turn a mediocre album into a classic.

Now that they have the attitude: “o.k., we now know how to write a good song, so listen what we got!” (with a lot of swagger). Sorry Bono, you can scream to the world that City Of Blinding Lights is one of the best songs ever, but it’s nowhere near Streets, Unforgettable or Please!! And I think he knows it. The more a song or album lacks this magic, the more he brags about it, and feels he has to back it up with a lot of noise and blah-blah…Everybody knows that by now Bono! It’s so see-through…

Stop comparing songs! This doesn't help your argument.
Bono has ALWAYS and will ALWAYS brag about the band and their music because he LOVES the band and believes in what he/they do.
Would you prefer he didn't say anything?
Interviewer "How's the new album going, Bono?"
Bono "er...erm....hmm...er...it's not bad, but not as good as JT".
I LIKE my rock stars to be loud and passionate about what they're doing - just like the young Bono was which you WERE in favour of earlier in this post

But I’m still waiting for a great return of my favourite band. And I’m convinced when they keep a few things in mind, we’ll hear them as we never heard them before, full of surprises. A few things that could help them:
1. take risks musically (like in the AB and Zooropa-era)
2. forget about wanting to be the biggest, best or whatever!
3. in songwriting: search for weird, unknown territory, dark/light sounds, dark/light landscapes
4. forget about: “how do we appeal to the largest number of listeners/audience”
5. forget about: “how do we play this live?”
6. forget the down-to-earth thing: get the passion and the poetry back
7. u2 is a 6-member band: get Eno and Lanois back for the atmosphere and special moods, the colour, the melody, the extra push for the surprises
8. Bono: be there 100% when it comes to the writing process. In the studio, FULL TIME, with the others all the time! Stimulate each other! Fight, argue, experiment, whatever but look for new grounds!

It’s going to be hard labour again for them. Like UF and AB were… But man, what a result! And I think they can pull it of again. They just need to forget their ego’s and giganticness for a while!

That sounds good for fans like us (yes, I do agree with you about the music), but it's not for every fan and when a band is making music then they will take into consideration all its listening audience and not just those who want a new album that sounds like a mix of TUF and AB - as much as that would be a good thing!

You are entitled to your opinion, but I feel that you have to take into consideration other fans tastes and, of course, the band's desires.

But you have to understand that the band are ALWAYS trying to progress and are not into selling out.

 

[U2girl]

1. take risks musically (like in the AB and Zooropa-era)
2. forget about wanting to be the biggest, best or whatever!
3. in songwriting: search for weird, unknown territory, dark/light sounds, dark/light landscapes
4. forget about: “how do we appeal to the largest number of listeners/audience”
5. forget about: “how do we play this live?”
6. forget the down-to-earth thing: get the passion and the poetry back
7. u2 is a 6-member band: get Eno and Lanois back for the atmosphere and special moods, the colour, the melody, the extra push for the surprises
8. Bono: be there 100% when it comes to the writing process. In the studio, FULL TIME, with the others all the time! Stimulate each other! Fight, argue, experiment, whatever but look for new grounds!

1. If it's combined with good songs, like AB - fine. Risks for the sake of risks - pass. Another gigantic backlash might kill them.

2. You mean like the young kid who at their band's third album was babbling how they have the magic that "the Beatles, the Stones and the Who have"? Same guy who declared they want to "wage war with the music on the charts"? Same guy that thanked the college radio upon winning the Grammy for JT? Same guy that boasted "this is the sound of four men chopping down the JT"? Same band that had a freaking movie and book released, about basically themselves? They same guy that said "this won't be our best album by a long-shot, but it's our best album to date" about JT?

3. Exactly what new grounds can they enter? I mean seriously - what major genre haven't they covered? Rock, punk, blues, dance music, pop, retro sound. (I feel any band has a right to sound like themselves - most do it all the time! - especially one that's been running away from it for 10+ years. that said they can only get away with it once) Their quest to write pop music and to find the perfect single actually was something new to them.

4. See answer no. 2

5. ? Nothing wrong with being able to actually play their own songs live.

6. That is probably coming - see Fast cars and Mercy. I wouldn't mind something new, and this is coming from someone who thouroughly enjoyed the last two albums.

7. I actually think U2 should lay off Eno/Lanois team for a while - same goes for Lillywhite/Flood etc - if they really want to make new music.

8. Impossible and you know it. He can't just quit his activism. I'm actually surprised at how little his lyrics got inspired by that. It will be interesting to see, given the tensions between him and the other three on the last (two) album(s) over him MIA, if he will cut it down a bit.

 

[onyourkneesboy]

Hey U2mixer:

thanks for your comments on my thread !! (and the time it apparently took!)

I don't agree with all your replies but hey, that's part of the deal...I can live with that!

I agree with you on this note:

but what they lack is 'danger'.

The band are too comfortable. They need to be 'scared' into life.

Maybe this is how I wanted to say things.

To comment the way you did: Great sport!

Some of them here could learn from you!

 

[BVS]

Could you all stick to the original topic, please?

Could you put all your whining in one thread?

 

[twochordcool]

I'm sure I can rattle off a ton of songs - even U2 ones - that I adore and you hate

There are NO U2 songs that I hate.

NONE.

ZER0.

NADA.

ZILCH.

NIL.

I love ALL of their work after War.

There are some earlier U2 songs that I am not crazy about - but they have been SIMPLY AMAZING since they've matured.

 

[twochordcool]

Why you people don't get it that every single fan has the right to express his/hers own view on U2 work, songs, lyrics...............Diversity is beautiful,appreciate it! THERE IS A SUBTLE LINE THAT DIFFERS A FAN FROM FANATIC!

Er, actually fan is just an abbreviated word for "fanatic"!

I think there are people that are U2 "fans" - they love, adore, worship everything U2 - U2 can do no wrong.

Then there are people that simply like U2.

I don't think you can be a true fan AND criticise them - unless they REALLY screw up somehow, which they haven't.

Do you know what I mean?

 

[twochordcool]

The only real problem I have with the last 2 albums is the lyrics! I think the lyrics seriously went down the freaking drain with ATYCLB! I mean, look at the last few verses (fragrant/basement) of Kite! Or the stupid rhymes of Elevation! Or everything except the 'scatter of light' verse in IALW! Or parts of New York! The terrible terrible rhymes of Grace! Moving on to HTDAAB... The weak chorus of COBL! The cringeworthy 'all of this could be yours' line in Vertigo! The weak 'where is the love' of LAPOE!

IT'S ROCK & ROLL, FOR GOD'S SAKE!

Some of you people act as though Bono has to be Walt Whitman!

Kite is beautiful - the lyrics, the melody, the connection to his father - I cry often when I hear this and I put that all together.

New York is AWESOME! I love the melody AND the lyrics. I love the description of New York from Bono's creative viewpoint. I love how it starts out really mellow and then CCRRAANNKKSS!! ("but it's down to Alphaville!" CCRRAANNGG!!)

"In New York summers get hot
Well into the hundreds
You can walk around the block
Without a change of clothing

Hot as a hair dryer in your face
Hot as handbag and a can of mace"

Personally I think those lyrics are very cool and very creative! Let's see some of your writing!

Elevation, in my opinion, was not made to be serious - it was made to rock - and it was made for fan interaction live. And it works TREMENDOUSLY.

Same goes for Vertigo.

I think you fail to realize that the lyric is more vital to certain songs, and not necessarily to others. Regardless, most of their songs work as a WHOLE.

 

[twochordcool]

All of this could be yours... just gimme what I want and no one gets hurt???

I mean... WTF? It's like Bono just pulled this pseudo-cool sounding line out of his ass and just put it there in the middle of this song

Well, I think he succeeded as far as most U2 fans are concerned! Pseudo-cool or not I LIKE IT!

It sounds very rock and roll and I love it!

 

[twochordcool]

See, they did a great job with Mercy!

...and The Ground Beneath Her Feet!

and Stateless!

and Fast Cars!


Then they go and leave these songs out of the albums!

So, what I'm saying is that they definitely still have it in them! They still got potential! But why don't they pick the good ones for the album? Why???

Can you tell me how / where to acquire these songs?

Are they B sides to singles?

 

[twochordcool]

Jeez, U2Mixer...YOU GOT A LIFE OUTSIDE OF THIS?

 

[namkcuR]

Can you tell me how / where to acquire these songs?

Are they B sides to singles?

Mercy was a song that they recorded during the Bomb sessions; it was never officially released, but one fan somewhere managed to obtain a copy of Bomb(before it was released) with this song on it and leaked it. The sound quality of the recording isn't great, and the circumstances around which this individual obtained the recording are still somewhat cloaked in mystery.

Fast Cars is the 12th bonus track on Bomb, only available on the UK versions of Bomb, and the US Limited Edition of Bomb.

GBHF was originally on the Million Dollar Hotel soundtrack, and was later the 12th bonus track on ATYCLB, only available on the UK versions of ATYCLB.

Stateless is on the Million Dollar Hotel Soundtrack, and can also be found on the Unreleased&Rare portion of the digital box set.

 

[U2mixer]

Jeez, U2Mixer...YOU GOT A LIFE OUTSIDE OF THIS?

No, but I could tell you where to download those songs that you seek!

But then again...

 

[LMP]

No, but I could tell you where to download those songs that you seek!

But then again...

karma, it come back and kick ya in the ass can't it?

 

[U2DMfan]

I don't think you can be a true fan AND criticise them - unless they REALLY screw up somehow, which they haven't.

Do you know what I mean?

No. There is a discernable difference between fanatics and fans.

The difference is rationality.
And that is actually by definition.

A fan being an enthusiastic devotee
A fanatic being an irrational enthusiastic devotee

Is there a difference between a fan of religion and a religous fanatic? Certainly.

In that sense, you are right that fanatics wouldn't really criticise the band, but who is saying that the fanatics are the only true fans? Fanatics are a breed of fan.

"True fans" don't have to be irrational at all.

 

[chickadee]

Whoever said IALW is bad is CRAZY. I can't continue a conversation with crazy people! I'm off! *gets coat and flounces out the door*

Hee.

No, seriously, that song is brilliant. And I don't hate any U2 songs either. None. So. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

I'm in a weird mood tonight.

 

[twochordcool]

No. There is a discernable difference between fanatics and fans.

The difference is rationality.
And that is actually by definition.

A fan being an enthusiastic devotee
A fanatic being an irrational enthusiastic devotee

Main Entry: 3fan
Function: noun
Etymology: probably short for fanatic
1 : an enthusiastic devotee (as of a sport or a performing art) usually as a spectator
2 : an ardent admirer or enthusiast (as of a celebrity or a pursuit) <science-fiction fans>

(straight out of Merriam-Webster online dictionary!)

 

[twochordcool]

No, but I could tell you where to download those songs that you seek!

But then again...

I own nearly a thousand CD's and not one MP3 - music and sound-quality is too important to me.

Thanks anyway.

I'm sure if I dig hard enough I can acquire those!

 

[indigo tree]

"You left my heeeart eeempty as a vaaaacant lot"- don't tell me that 13 years ago people didn't go WTF??! at this.