U2 doesnt move me anymore, what should I do?

[IWasBored]

Everything they've done realized on one album.

i was just listening to an old interview clip and that was the exactly how the edge described it...

 

[Moonlit_Angel]

daisybean, most of the initial POP reviews were actually quite positive, so saying that the band turned against POP because of them is a bit of a contradiction. And if the band are to believe the fans' opinions, they must also believe those who were underwhelmed with POP. Unless you want to take the whole thing into the ugly territory of who "troo fans" are.

Anyway, I have read U2 criticise almost every of their albums in hindsight. Edge said once he'd like to remix all of them. I have never read any bandmember say, "oh yes this album could never ever be improved, it is a pinnacle that we will never ever repeat". Edge caused a few hissy fits when he said that he doesn't like Fly anymore and thinks it's dated, and said in one interview he wanted to apologise to everyone for Rattle'n'Hum. Of course it gets conveniently forgotten when somebody wants to complain about how the band criticise the song or album he/she loves and of course it has to be because the band fell under some bad outside influence.

With POP, most of the band's negative remarks are about their wish to have spent more time on that album, and Bono said repeatedly that he believes the songs themselves are good. (I believed him when I heard the new "If You Wear That Velvet Dress" cover) As for POPMart, it is thought of as a failure because it was hurt by the comparisons to the ZooTV, which was a much more successful blend of hi-tech spectacle and music and whose concepts were much better thought out and realised.

I agree with this.

What's this about a Best Buy incident and Target sell-out, Gickles?

Angela

 

[IWasBored]

i think he's talking about that 7 cd or something...

 

[Gickies Gageeze]

what i was bored said.

and the best buy thing was, (correct me if im wrong, its been a while) when u2 gave them the rights to distribute the elevation dvd two weeks earlier than anyone else.

pandering to companies like that is rediculously uncool.

 

[Salome]

but who gives a crap about being cool anyway?

 

[wavesofregret]

Originally posted by Saracene
daisybean, most of the initial POP reviews were actually quite positive, so saying that the band turned against POP because of them is a bit of a contradiction. And if the band are to believe the fans' opinions, they must also believe those who were underwhelmed with POP.

I agree Saracene. The band didn't turn against POP because of the media any more than the fans did. That is nothing more than a legend innvented and perpetuated by those who cannot accept that lot of fans weren't impressed by the album, and the tour, and the band now sees that and considers it a failure by their high standards. Neither the fans, the band, or the press are "stupid." It's just taste. Some people seriously need to get over that and move on.

On the topic of "troo" fans, what is that? If you don't like POP, if you don't like the Target CD, or if you hold it against Bono for singing with J-Lo; what is the difference? At some time we have all had something we didn't like occur with the band, but hasn't there been much more that we DID like? No one is stupid, or bad, or wrong. We're just different people. We should spend more energy dwelling on the things we love about this band

 

[Gickies Gageeze]

but who gives a crap about being cool anyway?

unfortunately thats all u2 cares about these days.

 

[Salome]

ah, I must have missed that thread you've started about meeting the band and talking to them about this issue

I have been very busy

 

[Gickies Gageeze]

ya, you must have been.

 

[IWasBored]

yes and they think that by constantly calling themselves 'uncool' and 'unhip' that by some process of reverse psychology we will all realise that they're trying to be cool?

somehow i don't quite think so....release dates are so screwy anyway, all sorts of local record shops had that thing that was only supposed to be released in target and the place where i got the dvd had it out a week before the 'official' release date. the store at the mall didn't get the dvd until 2 weeks after the 'official' release date


as far as saying that the corporate stuff means they sold out, i don't quite see it as that. the whole idea of what IS selling out is a quite lame arguement, anyway. the clash didn't sell out when they sold songs to commercials. they got crap for supposedly being sell outs the second they signed a record deal. you could easily say the same thing about u2, they signed a record deal...

you can put up the argument that selling out means different things depending on what type of music the band in questio plays, what ethics belong to their genre. you can argue that the punk that the clash came out of had stricter boundaries in terms of what selling out meant, but that means that you need to define clear categories for everything, and set down rules, as well as constantly alter your definition of selling out. which is rather the excersize in futility, don't you think, dear diary?

 

[u2popmofo]

unfortunately thats all u2 cares about these days.

People who arent fans would argue that's ALL U2 has ever cared about in their whole history of being a band. In some ways those people would have a good arguement. I dont see how U2 is doing anything differently right now from what they'd done in the past.

 

[Michael Griffiths]

see j. lo rumor (a fairly credible rumor)

see best buy incident

see target sell out.

see taking swipe at pop because the critics didnt understand it, and the general u2 fanbase is too stupid to accept good music when they hear it. ofcourse, thats a personal opinion, but for the band to go back on it and "admit it was a failure" is intolerable to me.

see all that you cant leave behind, everything except beautiful day.

see mishap with the corrs.

non of these things took place before atyclb. he used to do duets and work with good artists (pavarotti, sinatra) and now it appears to me as though he is doing everything he can to remain relevant. is there anything wrong with that? ofcourse not. but he, along with the band (particularly larry) appear to me as though they are only in it for the money.

remember when they said they were gonna get back to the studio right away and get the next album rolling as soon as the elevation tour was finished? that ended in 2001. how long does it take??? if your not going to release an album anytime soon, then dont make it sound like you will.

i dont expect flames from you michael, but from the rest, bring it on, i dont care. this is how i feel, and i think i was fair in my assessment.

and besides, when it comes down to it, this is all objective and personable.

These are all fair points, and I'd like to touch on some of them...
I don't really consider the Target store and the like marketing strategies to be selling out. To be honest, I don't think the term "sell out" is even in U2's vocabulary. They are in the music business, just like everyone else. If others choose to advertize only on the radio and music TV, that's up to them. If U2 chooses to advertize through promotions, that's really just another mean to the same end. It's a business, and they make good business decisions. As their manager said, it would be a shame to be good at the music, but bad at the business. They're good at both, in my opinion.

As for the Corrs, Bono is good friends with them. They live in the same city. They share interests, and I think it was just something they decided to do as collaborators and friends. I think the song they covered by Ryan Adams ('When The Stars Go Blue') is a beautiful song. Bono did a great job, and the timing with Andrea Corr is impeccable. It's a technically great performance. If you don't like it, that's okay, but I would't call it a mishap.

The band has always wanted to be the most popular in the world. It's nothing new. Pop was the result of one of the most commercial moves of all time. U2 thought electronica was going to be the next big thing in the mainstream. They wanted to catch it at the beginning and ride it into popularity. Unfortunately, it backfired. The same can be said for Achtung Baby. U2 wanted to catch many of the industrial pop acts that were making noise in the UK at the time. Some of the sounds were even found in places you don't want to know about, ie Marky Mark! In that case, it worked to a T. Many claimed U2 were selling out at the time, too. Even as far back as Unforgettable Fire and Joshua Tree, people claimed they were abandoning thief honesty and angst. As you can see, it wasn't only after ATYCLB that they became "commerically minded".

Bono still works with some great artists. Take Jooles Holland for example, and recently the late Joe Strummer. Bono has also worked with some dodgy artists in the past. Take 'We Are The World' for example. Pop music's finest.

As for Pop, I think you're misinterpreting U2. Did you see them on U2 Does Much when they played in Toronto? Bono talked of how wonderful Pop is, and that it was only a failure in American eyes. He said in Canada and Europe, you'd get a different answer as to which album was the "crap album". When U2 criticized Pop, they were speaking of it in context to how it was judged, and they also acknowledged that it wasn't completely finished (which is true, as they were rushed, even finishing a couple tracks the day of pressing!!). U2 and Bono have always stressed how proud they are of Pop. I think some of their comments have been simply taken out of context; it's as simple as that.

People will want to believe what best suites their musical interests at the time. It's as important to be critical of one's own opinions as much so as it is to have critical opinions.

 

[Gickies Gageeze]

These are all fair points, and I'd like to touch on some of them...
I don't really consider the Target store and the like marketing strategies to be selling out. To be honest, I don't think the term "sell out" is even in U2's vocabulary. They are in the music business, just like everyone else. If others choose to advertize only on the radio and music TV, that's up to them. If U2 chooses to advertize through promotions, that's really just another mean to the same end. It's a business, and they make good business decisions. As their manager said, it would be a shame to be good at the music, but bad at the business. They're good at both, in my opinion.

As for the Corrs, Bono is good friends with them. They live in the same city. They share interests, and I think it was just something they decided to do as collaborators and friends. I think the song they covered by Ryan Adams ('When The Stars Go Blue') is a beautiful song. Bono did a great job, and the timing with Andrea Corr is impeccable. It's a technically great performance. If you don't like it, that's okay, but I would't call it a mishap.

The band has always wanted to be the most popular in the world. It's nothing new. Pop was the result of one of the most commercial moves of all time. U2 thought electronica was going to be the next big thing in the mainstream. They wanted to catch it at the beginning and ride it into popularity. Unfortunately, it backfired. The same can be said for Achtung Baby. U2 wanted to catch many of the industrial pop acts that were making noise in the UK at the time. Some of the sounds were even found in places you don't want to know about, ie Marky Mark! In that case, it worked to a T. Many claimed U2 were selling out at the time, too. Even as far back as Unforgettable Fire and Joshua Tree, people claimed they were abandoning thief honesty and agst. As you can see, it wasn't only after ATYCLB that they became "commerically minded".

Bono still works with some great artists. Take Jooles Holland for example, and recently the late Joe Strummer. Bono has also worked with some dodgy artists in the past. Take 'We Are The World' for example. Pop music's finest.

As for Pop, I think you're misinterpreting U2. Did you see them on U2 Does Much when they played in Toronto? Bono talked of how wonderful Pop is, and that it was only a failure in American eyes. He said in Canada and Europe, you'd get a different answer as to which album was the "crap album". When U2 criticized Pop, they were speaking of it in context to how it was judged, and they also acknowledged that it wasn't completely finished (which is true, as they were rushed, even finishing a couple tracks the day of pressing!!). U2 and Bono have always stressed how proud they are of Pop. I think some of their comments have been simply taken out of context; it's as simple as that.

People will want to believe what best suites their musical interests at the time. It's important to be critical of one's own opinions as much so as it is to have critical opinions.

certainly a fair assessment.